[Hun7er]

Did anybody try old monster amplifier like Mark Levinson 23.5, Krell KSA50, Threshold 3.9 ?

 

[zilch0md]

  Did anybody try old monster amplifier like Mark Levinson 23.5, Krell KSA50, Threshold 3.9 ?

 
I don't think so - check with the guys in the vintage thread, but Gary in MD settled on using an Odyssey Cyclops (110W into 8 Ohms) with his directly-connected LCD-3. It's a monster, but it's not old.
 

 

 

[zilch0md]

  Why are you trying to get away from tubes Zilch? Do you have them coming out of your ears or something? 

 Nice to see you join the Senn club, have you heard the HD-800 yet? 

 
[snip]

 
LOL
 
Only six tubes were coming out of my ears, but I've got them boxed up, ready to ship with a Decware ZSTAGE (see the FS link in my signature, below).  
 
As transparent as the ZSTAGE is, given its simple design...
 

 
... I should think about the only thing you can actually hear is the tube itself, when you insert the ZSTAGE between DAC and amp, and introducing some tubeliciousness into the signal path was exactly what the bright and harsh treble of the Emotiva Mini-X a-100 needed, but with tubes comes rolling, lots and lots of rolling!  What I hear, with that many tubes from which to choose, is quite simply, too many choices!   

 

 
I tend to obsess with such things, having spent about three months worth of evenings and weekends (over a year ago), rolling op-amps with my iBasso PB2 Pelican portable amp, where even a modest collection presented too many choices:
 

 

 

 


 
Here, I was using AD797s as buffers with OPA1611 in L/R.  The AD797s are prone to oscillation and although I couldn't hear anything unsavory, the case would get so hot, I added a heat sink.  LOL  
 
So much for portability!  I didn't use this combination but for a couple of days, but it sounded pretty good, despite leading me to purchase one of these - to measure op-amp temperatures (with the case opened):
 

 
Without resorting to the use of Loc-tite on the case screws, I've managed to keep the iBasso PB2 closed for several months, now, having finally settled on using LME49990 in L/R, with dummy buffers, but that followed several days of swapping HA5002 buffers in and out with the dummy buffers.  Better dynamics or more transparency?  Better dynamics or more transparency? Better dynamics or more transparency?Even just two choices was driving me crazy, before I finally went with more transparency.

  
 
As much as I was tormented by rolling op-amps, and more recently, rolling tubes, I have to say, it really teaches you to listen analytically, but that leads to almost never listening emotionally.  
 
And therein lies my problem, at least, with rolling anything - be it op-amps or tubes:  I want to enjoy my music, not tweak it ad infinitum.   

 
That's where the TBI Millenia MG3 has brought so much solace - perfection - with no tweaking required (beyond my having spent about a week and a half comparing its signature at different supply voltages, finally settling on a 24V battery solution).  Tweak, tweak, tweak!  

 
But now, I just turn it on and listen. Yeah-yuh! 
 

 
Mike

 

[brunk]

   
LOL
 
Only six tubes were coming out of my ears, but I've got them boxed up, ready to ship with a Decware ZSTAGE (see the FS link in my signature, below).  
 
As transparent as the ZSTAGE is, given its simple design...

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

 

 
... I should think about the only thing you can actually hear is the tube itself, when you insert the ZSTAGE between DAC and amp, and introducing some tubeliciousness into the signal path was exactly what the bright and harsh treble of the Emotiva Mini-X a-100 needed, but with tubes comes rolling, lots and lots of rolling!  What I hear, with that many tubes from which to choose, is quite simply, too many choices!   

 

 
I tend to obsess with such things, having spent about three months worth of evenings and weekends (over a year ago), rolling op-amps with my iBasso PB2 Pelican portable amp, where even a modest collection presented too many choices:
 

 

 

 


 
Here, I was using AD797s as buffers with OPA1611 in L/R.  The AD797s are prone to oscillation and although I couldn't hear anything unsavory, the case would get so hot, I added a heat sink.  LOL  
 
So much for portability!  I didn't use this combination but for a couple of days, but it sounded pretty good, despite leading me to purchase one of these - to measure op-amp temperatures (with the case opened):
 

 
Without resorting to the use of Loc-tite on the case screws, I've managed to keep the iBasso PB2 closed for several months, now, having finally settled on using LME49990 in L/R, with dummy buffers, but that followed several days of swapping HA5002 buffers in and out with the dummy buffers.  Better dynamics or more transparency?  Better dynamics or more transparency? Better dynamics or more transparency?Even just two choices was driving me crazy, before I finally went with more transparency.

  
 
As much as I was tormented by rolling op-amps, and more recently, rolling tubes, I have to say, it really teaches you to listen analytically, but that leads to almost never listening emotionally.  

 
And therein lies my problem, at least, with rolling anything - be it op-amps or tubes:  I want to enjoy my music, not tweak it ad infinitum.   

 
That's where the TBI Millenia MG3 has brought so much solace - perfection - with no tweaking required (beyond my having spent about a week and a half comparing its signature at different supply voltages, finally settling on a 24V battery solution).  Tweak, tweak, tweak!  

 
But now, I just turn it on and listen. Yeah-yuh! 
 

 
Mike

Ahh ok, well I totally understand now why you don't want tubes. I wouldn't either if i was you! It's about time poor Mike has come around to enjoy the fruits of his labors If you ever go back to using a preamp, and seeing how you preferred transparency, do put the lightspeed at the top of your list! No tweaking required my friend. I for one still have a mountain of tweaking left to do, but these back loaded horns i built are just stopping me dead in my tracks lol. the soundstage extends well past the speakers and with great depth to boot. They are killer.

 

[zilch0md]

Back-loaded horns!  You're building amps AND speakers?   Sheesh!  Where do you get the energy?
 
Tell us more about the speakers (given that this thread has the word "speaker" in its title).  
 

 

[Steve Eddy]

Tell us more about the speakers (given that this thread has the word "speaker" in its title).  

So does that mean we can talk about John Boehner too?

se

 

[brunk]

  Back-loaded horns!  You're building amps AND speakers?   Sheesh!  Where do you get the energy?
 
Tell us more about the speakers (given that this thread has the word "speaker" in its title).  
 

Oh my pleasure Mike! 
 
Yeah lol, It's overwhelming sometimes, which is why i wholly recommend cardboard boxes for each project lol! First off, I bought everything from Madisound. They are a wonderful crew that is very informative during the purchase process and have been in business nearly 4 decades. After much research, I chose the Fostex FE206En. The reason being is that it's widely accepted as that is their best fullrange driver, despite more expensive offerings, and there is a ton of info and computer-modeled enclosure schematics for them. Second, is that an 8in. driver gives a much better bass response than the smaller siblings. Third, I can mod the whizzer cone, or remove it completely and put in phase plugs if i wish.
 
As said earlier, there are tons of enclosures that are available for them. However, the very best ones are massive and you need to make it yourself or find a local woodworker to do it for you. I am not at the stage to undertake those massive beasts, nor have the space at the moment. Therefore I opted to go with the Fostex BK-20 enclosure, easy to assemble, great price, and fits my room perfectly. I used 100% Tung Oil to stain them, but they still need an extra coat or two, and the edges are unfinished. I'm afraid I have to wait until Spring now to complete that task.
 
Next up, the general consensus is that fullrange drivers lack a bit of air in the top end. Since all this was so affordable, I decided to go for the Fostex T90a Super Tweeters! Also needed is an attenuator and some caps to adjust brightness/darkness. These I do not have hooked up yet until I become super familiar with the drivers first in order to make proper tweaks to my taste.
 
All in all, if you were to buy them, sans super tweeters, its about $700 shipped. That's the cost of the HE-500 for some fullrange speakers! With the tweeters and required accessories, its about $1,100 shipped. Still a good deal, unlike bookshelves i've seen at that price. I don't have a sub hooked up at the moment, and i don't really miss it. The speakers are totally transparent with a great musical tone, not dry as dust, and not bloomy as a ...flower?? Lol anyways, they are extremely enjoyable as-is and ive yet to roll in the tweeters. Here's a couple pics. Please excuse the state of my audio rack, it's missing alot of gear and the whole listening room is in a complete state of flux right now. I'll take more once complete in the future
 

Spoiler: Detailed information if you want to buy the kit

- 2x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/full-range-speaker-kits/fostex-bk-20-cabinet-sold-flat-each/ (add 2x of the input cups from drop down menu too)
- 2x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/approx-8-fullrange/fostex-fe206en-8-full-range/
- 2x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/bullet-tweeters/fostex-t90a-top-mount-horn-super-tweeter/
 
Tweeter attenuator: two options
1) 1x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/l-pads-attenuators/fostex-r82b-200w-l-pad/
2) 2x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/l-pads-attenuators/fostex-r80b-100w-l-pad/
 
i went with #1 because it's cheaper and is only one knob instead of two.
 
Capacitors to adjust brightness/darkness of tweeters: get 2 of each, they're cheap enough to play with.
 
- 2x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/solen-capacitors/solen-0.33-mfd-fast-cap-630v-ppe-series/
- 2x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/solen-capacitors/solen-0.47-mfd-fast-cap-630v-ppe-series/
- 2x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/solen-capacitors/solen-1-mfd-fast-cap-400v/
 
Misc. Hardware:
- 8x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/black-ox-wax-finish/screw-size-8-1-phillips-pan-head-black-ox-wax-finish/
- 18oz. Gorilla Wood Glue
- Some sandpaper
- Choice of finish, i used Hope's 100% Tung Oil 18oz. bottle
- 6ft ea. of 12-14 awg. black and red wire, or whatever color you want.
 
Home Depot: These are insanely cheap for the quality, free shipping too. I love them. This is the minimum quantity you need.
- 3x http://www.homedepot.com/p/100159936
- 2x http://www.homedepot.com/p/100134583
 
Optionals:
- 1x http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/acoustic-damping/dampers-acousta-stuf/lb/ (owner didn't recommend it, so i didnt use it)
- 4x each Red and Black Quick connects if you don't want to solder.

 

Spoiler: Pictures of the back loaded horns

 
 

 

[zilch0md]

So does that mean we can talk about John Boehner too?

se

 
LOL  

  Talking about that speaker would thoroughly derail this derailed thread!

 

[Steve Eddy]

LOL     Talking about that speaker would thoroughly derail this derailed thread!

Yeah, that would be like a double-dog derail.

se

 

[zilch0md]

Brunk, you are such a mad scientist!
 
Quote:

  [snip]
 
All in all, if you were to buy them, sans super tweeters, its about $700 shipped. That's the cost of the HE-500 for some fullrange speakers! With the tweeters and required accessories, its about $1,100 shipped. Still a good deal, unlike bookshelves i've seen at that price. I don't have a sub hooked up at the moment, and i don't really miss it. The speakers are totally transparent with a great musical tone, not dry as dust, and not bloomy as a ...flower?? Lol anyways, they are extremely enjoyable as-is and ive yet to roll in the tweeters.
 
[snip]

 
I say "scientist" for how smartly you documented everything in that post!  That was even more detailed than your tips for soldering - which sent my scurrying off to order everything so that I can be just like you when I grow up!   

 
 
Now you go and hit me with this!  How's a guy supposed to resist it when you lay it all out so well?
 
No!  I must resist!  I will NOT be assimilated into the Brunk collective!  

 
LOL
 
Those speakers are no doubt very efficient.  And as I've said before, I envy your self-satisfaction of having built them yourself!  What a glow that must be...
 
Seriously, the "mad" part of "mad scientist" is the passion you exhibit.  I'm inspired!  
 
Mike

 

[brunk]

   
I say "scientist" for how smartly you documented everything in that post!  That was even more detailed than your tips for soldering - which sent my scurrying off to order everything so that I can be just like you when I grow up!   

 
 
Now you go and hit me with this!  How's a go supposed to resist it when you lay it all out so well?
 
No!  I must resist!  I will NOT be assimilated into the Brunk collective!  

 
LOL
 
Those speakers are no doubt very efficient.  And as I've said before, I envy your self-satisfaction of having built them yourself!  What a glow that must be...
 
Seriously, the "mad" part of "mad scientist" is the passion you exhibit.  I'm inspired!  
 
Thanks Mike! I would love to have that as my title lol
 
Mike

Hehe thanks Mike! I'm glad you enjoy my posts 

 Come join the Brunk-o-lution, the information is laid out before you... 

 
 
Yeah they are very efficient and my next amp endeavor will be finding a design that allows for A+B speaker outputs like my golden nugget of a Yammy I have. My next project hopefully starting next week will be this little devil - a Cornet2 from Hageman Technology and of course it won't be complete without a TOTL A/D converter - a PCM4222 EVM from TI 

Mike... if I can do it, you surely can! 

Spoiler: Cornet2 S.E.T. Phono Pre

 
 
 

Spoiler: PCM 4222 EVM

 

 

[Gary in MD]

Just wanted to let you folks know that I will NOT be doing a comparison test of 9-mile-long cables vs. 9-ft-long ones, or even 9-inch-long ones.  I mean, there have to be some limits to the insanity.
 
I am seriously considering buying an Emo DC-1 Stealth DAC.  They're on sale right now for $500 and the siren song of a relative bargain is drawing me closer and closer... This purchase could put at risk next summer's DAC comparison if I really love the DC-1 and am able to overcome the incredibly strong urge to do comparison tests whether I need new equipment or not (except for comparisons related to 9-mile cables).

 

[brunk]

Lol Gary, I don't even think a bonafide audio nut would expect that! In regards to the Emo DAC, have you seen the upcoming line of Geek Pulse gear from Light Harmonic? Ground floor indiegogo backers get the DAC for $249.
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/687851/geek-pulse-geek-desktop-dac-amp-by-light-harmonics

 

[zilch0md]

  Lol Gary, I don't even think a bonafide audio nut would expect that! In regards to the Emo DAC, have you seen the upcoming line of Geek Pulse gear from Light Harmonic? Ground floor indiegogo backers get the DAC for $249.
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/687851/geek-pulse-geek-desktop-dac-amp-by-light-harmonics

 
I recall commenting elsewhere that this product looks great except for the fixed 4V rms analog line out.  Why so high?  (Why not 2V rms?)
 
This alone would make it incompatible with a lot of speaker amps.  We're bouncing along near 7:00 o'clock on the volume control, as it is.  Hopefully, that's just a type in those specs.
 
Mike

 

[zilch0md]

Hey Gary,
 
Quote:

  I am seriously considering buying an Emo DC-1 Stealth DAC.  They're on sale right now for $500 and the siren song of a relative bargain is drawing me closer and closer... 

 
Wow, their write-up on the DC-1 is compelling.  All for $499.  I can see that the sale price includes free shipping, as usual, but do you know if it also allows their 30-day return policy?
 
Mike