[Davedog]

This has been massively helpful.    BIG THUMBS UP!
 
As much as i like the DT1350 and the P5 i can't afford them so its the hd25's all the way.
 
(I'll still probably get the P5's, hopefully they'll be a bit cheaper in future)

 

[WakiDabeast]

so which has more/stronger bass ms300 or m80? btw love the m-80 review, really looked forward to it. I love how you mentioned the people trying to appeal to the consumer, because I could not agree more. How is the M-80 bass anywhere near bass head? Seems like more bass than hd25, but less punch?

 

[ljokerl]

 
Quote:

Nice review on the M-80 joker. Looks like everyone whose reviewed the headphone is in agreement that the highs are the weak point but everything else is quite good. So tell me considering you scored it a 9 in sound does that mean your beloved HD25 is going to lose some listening time to the M-80.

Probably not - I can wear the HD25-1 pretty much all day and I still consider its sound signature better for rock and metal, which is around 80% of my library. I think I've found a new benchmark for midrange performance, though, and I the signature of the M-80 is great for movies (just want it in a small circumaural shell a-la Bose AE...)
 


Quote:

Nice to see the M80 here. Still working on the MS300 review?

My girlfriend made off with the MS300, which means I get to 'borrow' it for comparisons but I certainly won't get to sell it off when I'm done with it. That means I'm probably going to keep putting it off since I'm trying to reduce my own collection.
 


Quote:

This has been massively helpful.    BIG THUMBS UP!
 
As much as i like the DT1350 and the P5 i can't afford them so its the hd25's all the way.
 
(I'll still probably get the P5's, hopefully they'll be a bit cheaper in future)

Thanks. HD25 is still a no-loss proposition for most listeners in my book
 


Quote:

so which has more/stronger bass ms300 or m80? btw love the m-80 review, really looked forward to it. I love how you mentioned the people trying to appeal to the consumer, because I could not agree more. How is the M-80 bass anywhere near bass head? Seems like more bass than hd25, but less punch?

M-80 has more bass than MS300. More depth than the HD25 (more rumble as well) but the HD25 has a slightly more pronounced mid-bass lift for more of that immediate impact. If you consider the HD25 to be near-basshead, the M-80 will be as well. That said, it hasn't got nearly as much bass as the old Crossfade LP or the Denon D1100.

 

[roma101]

Nice review as always Joker! I appreciate the comment on timbre too since it's the most important attribute for me these days when it comes to choosing cans.  
 
 
 
Quote:

Have you heard M-80 and compared to HD25?
 

Yep I own both. They're kind of a yin yang for me - one has better soundstage and a more lounge-y feel (M-80) while the other has a a bit more pronounced detail, punch and all-around aggression (HD25). I love my HD25s but I have always felt the vocals can sometimes get drowned out slightly due to its signature and the narrow soundstage (although this improves greatly when you have a good amp IMO). The M-80 is overall less-fatiguing, with punchy bass, clear mids with polite highs (definitely nowhere near as sparkly as the HD25). The imaging is better on the M-80s - I think this is due to the increase in depth and width. They're good complements to each other. No matter which headphone you choose, you'll be getting a good one that's for sure. 

 

[roker]

Quote:

If you need the isolation and don't mind the size, go for the ZX700. Seems to be available for around $80 here and there and I think it matches what you want a little better than the V6. D1100 would be a good choice as well but then there's the price gap. I haven't heard the 440.
 

 
Thanks for the response.  I just saw it for 80 from a couple of websites.  I'll pull the trigger tomorrow in case something else pops up tomorrow.  
 
I actually saw the 1100 for 135, free ship, no tax.  Then I saw it was from buy.com.  I've had so many bad experiences from them (and their affiliates) that I decided it's better I buy a product from a reputable vendor than chance it through them.
 

 

[scrypt]

Herr Joke, mein Compf:
 
Thanks for adding the M-80s.  Having heard and endured the Crossfade LPs myself, I'm amazed you like the newest V-Modas so much.  Given your merciless fairness, they really must be as different from the LPs as others have said.
 
However, I find it a Hank odd you're being asked to compare the bass of the MS-300 with that of the M-80, since everyone seems to say that the bottom is the low point of the 300s (pun not intended -- like Hedy Lamarr's corpse's left buttock, it's an outie). 
 
I'd have thought the MS-400 offered more parallels to the M-80 sonically.  Beyond the form factor of the MS-300, are the two very similar at all?  Don't people tend to liken the MS-300 to various and sundry pointy-high'd Grados more often than kuh-not?
 
Of course, never having heard either of the Phiatons or the M-80s, I'm effectively asking from the vantage of a naked mole rat in a fallout cube lodged below a series of secret tunnels spiraling through the multiple navels of the Carpathian Mountains:-- i.e. (a-i-e-e-e-e!), at significant remove from actual users.
 
I'm also asking because I'm currently (they found the smoking body in the bathtub playing chess with its own detached limbs) deciding whether to pick up the 300s or 400s during a brief but rather enticing sale.  Despite my low impulse control, I am not a sociopath.  After all, I'm fighting the impulse by stalling and asking you questions.
 
I've also never seen the black 400s onsale before, and I'm reluctant to dodder through the bad parts of Bronx with a walking cane, spats and blinding red pleather overscoring my skull.  The combination of mo' black and better lows might possibly be what the good Doc Severinsen ordered.
 
 
Quote:

M-80 has more bass than MS300. More depth than the HD25 (more rumble as well) but the HD25 has a slightly more pronounced mid-bass lift for more of that immediate impact. If you consider the HD25 to be near-basshead, the M-80 will be as well. That said, it hasn't got nearly as much bass as the old Crossfade LP or the Denon D1100.

 

 

[bigaustin25]

Wow, this is amazing.   This is exactly what I was looking for, but couldn't find it anywhere else on the net....
 
Is there any chance of adding the new V Moda LP2 to the review?   I just ordered some and I don't know much about these products.  Just curious what your thoughts are on the new model.  I think I have 60 days to return them if I don't like it.  Thanks again, this must have taken you forever, but it is appreciated it.  

 

[ljokerl]

 
Quote:

Nice review as always Joker! I appreciate the comment on timbre too since it's the most important attribute for me these days when it comes to choosing cans.  

 
Thanks! I guess we're on the same page both when it comes to the timbre of the HD25, which is something I've complained about in the past, and them still being rockin' portable cans.
 


Quote:

 
Thanks for the response.  I just saw it for 80 from a couple of websites.  I'll pull the trigger tomorrow in case something else pops up tomorrow.  
 
I actually saw the 1100 for 135, free ship, no tax.  Then I saw it was from buy.com.  I've had so many bad experiences from them (and their affiliates) that I decided it's better I buy a product from a reputable vendor than chance it through them.
 

For what it's worth someone did buy those cheap D1100s from buy.com without issue and I do think you would like them if you can get past the huge bass.
 


Quote:

Herr Joke, mein Compf:
 
Thanks for adding the M-80s.  Having heard and endured the Crossfade LPs myself, I'm amazed you like the newest V-Modas so much.  Given your merciless fairness, they really must be as different from the LPs as others have said.
 
However, I find it a Hank odd you're being asked to compare the bass of the MS-300 with that of the M-80, since everyone seems to say that the bottom is the low point of the 300s (pun not intended -- like Hedy Lamarr's corpse's left buttock, it's an outie). 
 
I'd have thought the MS-400 offered more parallels to the M-80 sonically.  Beyond the form factor of the MS-300, are the two very similar at all?  Don't people tend to liken the MS-300 to various and sundry pointy-high'd Grados more often than kuh-not?
 
Of course, never having heard either of the Phiatons or the M-80s, I'm effectively asking from the vantage of a naked mole rat in a fallout cube lodged below a series of secret tunnels spiraling through the multiple navels of the Carpathian Mountains:-- i.e. (a-i-e-e-e-e!), at significant remove from actual users.
 
I'm also asking because I'm currently (they found the smoking body in the bathtub playing chess with its own detached limbs) deciding whether to pick up the 300s or 400s during a brief but rather enticing sale.  Despite my low impulse control, I am not a sociopath.  After all, I'm fighting the impulse by stalling and asking you questions.
 
I've also never seen the black 400s onsale before, and I'm reluctant to dodder through the bad parts of Bronx with a walking cane, spats and blinding red pleather overscoring my skull.  The combination of mo' black and better lows might possibly be what the good Doc Severinsen ordered.


 

I'll be honest - I was probably taken aback by the M-80s more than anyone since I do detest the original LP. The MS300 questions are easy to explain - it's the one Phiaton I mentioned in the M-80 review. Reason being, of course, that I don't own an MS400 these days. The MS300 is definitely the more balanced headphone - the 400 is warmer and bassier, with lush mids and a less prominent top end. The two Phiatons still have a number of common traits, such as the average-at-best presentation. 
 
The MS400 is a closer match to the M-80's sound signature and probably worth picking up when discounted. Don't expect sonic miracles from a portable, however - the scale of my review is greatly skewed by the number of sub-par (or worse) cans I've heard so an 8/10 is quite far from perfection.
 


Quote:

Wow, this is amazing.   This is exactly what I was looking for, but couldn't find it anywhere else on the net....
 
Is there any chance of adding the new V Moda LP2 to the review?   I just ordered some and I don't know much about these products.  Just curious what your thoughts are on the new model.  I think I have 60 days to return them if I don't like it.  Thanks again, this must have taken you forever, but it is appreciated it.  

Not unless it's vastly improved from the LP - from what I understand neither the old LP nor the LP2 is oriented towards audiophiles. I understand the worry of finding out that you could've spent your money better elsewhere later. What really matters, though, is whether you're happy with them, and I guess you'll have 60 days to figure that out.

 

[JamesMcProgger]

sound: 9/10 for the M80s? I knew I wasnt crazy about them just because I got them for free 

. thnak you Mike, i was waiting for that one to be added.
 
Looking at the top 10, and I own 6 of them, the ATH M50 kinda looks out of place there... but might be just me, I dont like the M50.

 

[DigitalFreak]

Quote:

sound: 9/10 for the M80s? I knew I wasnt crazy about them just because I got them for free 

. thnak you Mike, i was waiting for that one to be added.
 
Looking at the top 10, and I own 6 of them, the ATH M50 kinda looks out of place there... but might be just me, I dont like the M50.

I'm surprised the B&W P5 has lasted in the top 10 so long. Sonically it's not exactly the best I've ever owned.

 

[scrypt]

From what I gather, the only reason you still have the MS-300 is because your grillfiend covets it. 
 
My sense is the 400 is slightly better made and has a more distinctive (if less balanced) signature, and that you preferred it ever-so-slenderly to the 300 despite the latter's balanced sound -- which seems odd, if true, since I believe we share a studio musician's interest in detail, part separation and relative flatness.
 
Which makes me wonder why in the name of Chinnamasta we're talking about Phiatons at all.
 
This has been useful. You're convincing me that the glossy sling-ons of magazine-ad luxury might have underwhelmed me, their sound fading to carbon black as I returned to the headphones I already own and have kept. 

Those who aren't trained to be pitiless about detail might better appreciate the warmth of the 400s and gestalt of features offered by both models.  They're perfect for fans of sound-object confections, and the interests of those fans is understandable; it isn't superficial. 
 
But they are not disciples of the surgery of the mix.
 
In providing this sort of perspective, you become the very conduit -- the divining rod -- of this entire site's OCD.  Your descriptions of contrast are reference-shelf-worthy in their maximalist accuracy. 
 
(Not that I have any idea how much you drink when you write these things.)
 
Quote:

I'll be honest - I was probably taken aback by the M-80s more than anyone since I do detest the original LP. The MS300 questions are easy to explain - it's the one Phiaton I mentioned in the M-80 review. Reason being, of course, that I don't own an MS400 these days. The MS300 is definitely the more balanced headphone - the 400 is warmer and bassier, with lush mids and a less prominent top end. The two Phiatons still have a number of common traits, such as the average-at-best presentation. 
 
The MS400 is a closer match to the M-80's sound signature and probably worth picking up when discounted. Don't expect sonic miracles from a portable, however - the scale of my review is greatly skewed by the number of sub-par (or worse) cans I've heard so an 8/10 is quite far from perfection.

 

 

[roma101]

Quote:

 
 
Thanks! I guess we're on the same page both when it comes to the timbre of the HD25, which is something I've complained about in the past, and them still being rockin' portable cans.
 

 
Yep I'd say so. It wasn't until I got my Panasonic HJE900s (my timbre benchmark) that I could tell the timbre on the HD25 was slightly off. The D1001s also sound more natural than the HD25 to my ears. But nevertheless, my HD25 are irreplaceable for what they offer and are definitely rockin'. Glad to have some M-80s in my stable - I think if there was a headphone with the HD25's isolation and the M-80's soundstage.imaging with an overall tonal balance between them, that would be something pretty amazing.
 
Anyway, I'm looking forward to what you review in the future! Any chance there will be a TMA-1 or Skullcandy Aviator review at some point?

 

[kyuuketsuki]

Quote:

 
Yep I'd say so. It wasn't until I got my Panasonic HJE900s (my timbre benchmark) that I could tell the timbre on the HD25 was slightly off. The D1001s also sound more natural than the HD25 to my ears. But nevertheless, my HD25 are irreplaceable for what they offer and are definitely rockin'. Glad to have some M-80s in my stable - I think if there was a headphone with the HD25's isolation and the M-80's soundstage.imaging with an overall tonal balance between them, that would be something pretty amazing.
 
Anyway, I'm looking forward to what you review in the future! Any chance there will be a TMA-1 or Skullcandy Aviator review at some point?

I'm going to be sending him my TMA-1s for review (as beat up as they are) once I have a moment to breathe. It has been hell lately for me in terms of time (as in I have had none). I'll be contacting him probably after the holidays. If someone wants to send them to him before that, then be my guest, but that is the earliest time frame I have.

 

[DannyBai]

SQ wise, the TMA-1 do not stack up to the M-80's.  

 

[Rainbow Randy]

Wonderful thread, Joker. This has guided me in many decisions--yet, I must question your logic! Why weight isolation, which may be unwanted by quite a few, but not value, the supreme sign of worth, in reaching an average score? This is madness.
 
--All respect