[jimmers]

The HD650 are a very clean 'fast' headphone . Can you provide any facts to back up these claims about the 650 not being quick enough for a solid state amp?

That was the kind of information I was looking for in "expand", (hopefully inferred by the reference to "Sound Science").

 

[pdrm360]

The HD650s have fast decay, though not as fast as the HD800s.  
 
HD650 vs. HD800:

 

[JacobLee89]

  I dunno, my source first philosophy was established when I owned the HD650 and reinforced when I upgraded.
 
There still is somewhat of a substantial (in headphone terms) noticeable increase in soundstage and separation when I went balanced - even though I didn't notice any speeding up of the drivers.
 
The thing is, when you start spending that much on the HD650, which I had to because there was no alternative prior to Audeze, you might as well get a better headphone.

My curiosity is generally based on "What's really the greatest bang for buck". I have read from reviews that the HD650 "Scales very well with amps", which has lead my curiosity towards the BH Crack, which (yet again) reviews have reached the general consensus that it works well with the HD650 and also hold's itself well against amps of higher budget.
 
My mention of the Uber Bifrost Gen 2 comes from this insightful post by Flysweep: http://www.head-fi.org/t/661444/schiit-bifrost-uber-analog-upgrade/390#post_9704321, which also conveniently talks about the BH Crack 

, which may or may not be a good thing. *reassuring pat to his wallet*
 
The reason why I mention those in particular, is that I can "upgrade" my gear without having to risk spending too much on hunting down headphones which I can subjectively/objectively decide better than the HD650. If I can buy both those DAC and AMP (+ SB) and add shipping + customs for the cost of one "potentially" better sounding headphone, I might as well purchase the DAC and AMP separately as I save up.
 
Another solution would be to go to Meets, but I'm not sure how I will be able to do comparisons on the spot when I only have an ODAC + O2, and that my music collection consists primarily of FLAC's from obscure musicians of indie games.

 

[SP Wild]

If you've heard a few headphones and decide that the HD650 is your cuppa neutral...then yeah, build a system around it...I'd be inclined to get the crack right away and use the odac and upgrade the dac later.  I know its opposite of what I said...but I have very good hindsight now.
 
If you wan to try different headphones - keep your odac and 02 for now.
 
The problem with the crack is that it is designed to work well with few headphones, the HD650 being one of them.  A full tube HD650 for me was an eyeopener...I have since run my speakers on full tube integrateds and got rid of my solid state speaker amp...it was a tubed HD650 that got me addicted to the tube sound.

 

[SP Wild]

  The HD650s have fast decay, though not as fast as the HD800s.  
 
HD650 vs. HD800:

 
Explain to me, please - how this relates to transients.

 

[pdrm360]

   
Explain to me, please - how this relates to transients.

 
It depends you are talking about what kind of "Transient", Decay Transient or Attack Transient, the decay follows the attack though. 

 

[pez]

The HD650 are a very clean 'fast' headphone . Can you provide any facts to back up these claims about the 650 not being quick enough for a solid state amp?

 
I personally like my HD650 out of my Asgard 2.  I think they have a pretty good 'speed'.  I listen to quite a bit of Metal.  I'd go so far to say they're better at it than the SR325i's were.

 

[Jeff Y]

   
I personally like my HD650 out of my Asgard 2.  I think they have a pretty good 'speed'.  I listen to quite a bit of Metal.  I'd go so far to say they're better at it than the SR325i's were.

I like the Graham Slee Solo SRG2 with the 650 and the SR325Is. Out of many solid states including Burson or Grace Designs I love how my phones sound with the Graham Slee.

 

[olddtfan]

I have the Asguard V.1 and the 650 I listen to prog metal and modern jazz out of a cd player and it keeps me happy.

 

[pez]

  I like the Graham Slee Solo SRG2 with the 650 and the SR325Is. Out of many solid states including Burson or Grace Designs I love how my phones sound with the Graham Slee.

 
Yeah, I didn't care for the Grado SR325i out of the Asgard 2 so much that I sold them.  Bright amp and bright headphones normally don't match too well; at least in my opinion.  However, I can't say that I miss the Grado's all that much.  The HD650 is so flexible, I haven't found anything that I don't enjoy on them.  This includes EDM, too.

 

[dxanex]

   
Yeah, I didn't care for the Grado SR325i out of the Asgard 2 so much that I sold them.  Bright amp and bright headphones normally don't match too well; at least in my opinion.  However, I can't say that I miss the Grado's all that much.  The HD650 is so flexible, I haven't found anything that I don't enjoy on them.  This includes EDM, too.

Every Grado I've ever gotten rid of/auditioned I haven't missed. They've never been my cup 'o tea except maybe teh RS1. It's that flexibility from the HD 650 that makes it hard for me to imagine ever getting rid of them. I've yet to find a headphone where I can confidently say that it's a clear replacement for my HD 650. I always go back to them.

 

[pez]

 
Every Grado I've ever gotten rid of/auditioned I haven't missed. They've never been my cup 'o tea except maybe teh RS1. It's that flexibility from the HD 650 that makes it hard for me to imagine ever getting rid of them. I've yet to find a headphone where I can confidently say that it's a clear replacement for my HD 650. I always go back to them.

 
Yeah, if I make it to that Charlotte meet, I'm very curious to try out the HD800.  I still need to get a dedicated DAC, too.  And I really loved the SR325i's.  If I try another Grado, though, it'll have to be much warmer...and just as comfy...haha.

 

[dxanex]

   
Yeah, if I make it to that Charlotte meet, I'm very curious to try out the HD800.  I still need to get a dedicated DAC, too.  And I really loved the SR325i's.  If I try another Grado, though, it'll have to be much warmer...and just as comfy...haha.

 
I think you'd like the RS1 then. I found them much smoother and a lot less bright than the SR325. I believe someone at the Charlotte meet is also bringing an RS1, so you'll get to try both! HD 800 is great, but if I owned it, I would still keep my HD 650 for sure...they are VERY different headphones.

 

[pez]

   
I think you'd like the RS1 then. I found them much smoother and a lot less bright than the SR325. I believe someone at the Charlotte meet is also bringing an RS1, so you'll get to try both! HD 800 is great, but if I owned it, I would still keep my HD 650 for sure...they are VERY different headphones.

 
Yeah, I noticed that, too.  And you're right, from what I hear of the HD800, it's an acquired taste.  The good thing about meets, is it is probably a lot easier to be unbiased in impressions because you're not pressured into that 'I bought, so I've gotta somewhat like it' criteria.  Not saying everyone is like that, but you know there is nothing more disappointing than being unhappy with an expensive audio purchase .

 

[abablitz]

Is the FioE09K enough to power the HD 650s? I have a emotiva mini that I just got for my HE-4's, and I was justwondering if I should keep the E09K or use it with my emotiva mini if that is okay.