Sennheiser HD 600 Impressions Thread
Apr 1, 2016 at 11:14 PM Post #13,861 of 23,439
Any cables worth buying for the HD600? Luckily my purchase came with both the 600 and 650 cable and I know the 650 cable sounds better so I am using that. But I hear scattered things about upgradr cables and wonder if any are worth it.
 
Apr 1, 2016 at 11:22 PM Post #13,862 of 23,439
Listening to the remastered score to The Abyss by Alan Silvestri and many times I almost gasp at how amazing it sounds with my old friend Mr. HD600. My Denon receiver is absolutely formidable (tons of power, extremely dynamic, natural and balanced highs/mids/bass, big soundstage very transparent... noticeably better than my old Schiit Magni 2) and I now chalk up my original hesitation to just needing to get used to the HD600 sound again. The only thing I forsee upgrading is my Schiit Modi 2 DAC and probably going for a Bifrost Multibit. And then maybe $1K+ amp when my funds increase. I suspect that since Denon also makes audiophile cans and dedicated headphone amps, they put more attention into their reciever headphone outputs than other receiver manufacturers but this is pure speculation on my part. Or I just got lucky.


Some interesting reading: http://diyah.boards.net/post/18445
 
Quote:
Any cables worth buying for the HD600? Luckily my purchase came with both the 600 and 650 cable and I know the 650 cable sounds better so I am using that. But I hear scattered things about upgradr cables and wonder if any are worth it.

Never found headphone cables to make a difference unless the original cable was defective to start.  I've had some really nice Double Helix and Forza cables that look gorgeous but did nothing for the sound, but this is one of those were YMMV really applies
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Apr 1, 2016 at 11:40 PM Post #13,863 of 23,439
RE: DACs... I prefer to let my ears do the judging rather than reams of technical data.

As far as cables I've always been able to tell even subtle differences between them. I've even rejected more expensive usb cables that sounded worse than cheaper or stock cables.
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 12:12 AM Post #13,864 of 23,439
RE: DACs... I prefer to let my ears do the judging rather than reams of technical data.

As far as cables I've always been able to tell even subtle differences between them. I've even rejected more expensive usb cables that sounded worse than cheaper or stock cables.

I have a Bimby and its not a really noticeable difference from the Modi2Uber to me but then I maybe DAC deaf.  The way I define noticeable is to let others listen to the various DACs and switch between them with a level matching box.  If more than 50% can notice a difference then I would consider it a "noticeable" difference.  In the case of the Bifrost MB vs Modi2Uber only 1 in 7 persons could notice a difference so far and most of them were younger with fairly good hearing that could tell the difference between 256 MP3 and WAV files which many can't.
 
As for headphone cables, if you can tell the subtle differences between them then your hearing is far superior to mine.  I couldn't tell the difference between the stock HD-650 cable and a $380 Forza during a blind test where a friend switched the cables.  Same with the $500 Double Helix HIFIman cable, couldn't tell the difference between it and the Canare cable that I had built during a blind test.
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 12:27 AM Post #13,865 of 23,439
I have used both the hd600 cable and the hd650 cable with my hd600's. I think both cables are essentially the same. I did not hear a difference. I got a cardas cable, and that was when I noticed an improvement. Subtle, but enough to make the switch permanently.
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 2:57 AM Post #13,867 of 23,439
  Just a PSA I just received the 5 Ft. cable from this provider.
 
I am a huge fan. The original cable really feels kind of like my old Playstation 1 AV cable and just isn't quite what I'm looking for in something to connect my WA6 to my HD600s. 
 
This new cable feels quite nice and is a very good length that doesn't hang all over the place. 
 
I am not a cable guy really but in case anyone is wondering, it sounds exactly the same as the stock cable. So, if you are on the fence I certainly wouldn't worry about it being of lower quality. Of course, YMMV, and as I mentioned I never have heard a difference between cables. 
 
Basically I give this minor upgrade an objective 4/5 (would prefer real 1/4" termination) but a 5/5 in terms of value. It was easily worth the $16 or so, especially compared with some of the $200 offerings on eBay. 

I definitely like these cables. And I actually like the pseudo-1/4" termination, it makes it a bit more versatile, especially for those really eclectic testing phases where you're trying it on a headphone amp one minute and a Fiio X5 the next. Much rather adapt up to a larger jack then adapt down to a smaller jack, it usually tends to be more cumbersome when you have to adapt to a 3.5mm. Besides, I doubt many people can hear a difference between native 1/4" and adapted 1/4". I know for sure I can't, but as we always say YMMV
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Any cables worth buying for the HD600? Luckily my purchase came with both the 600 and 650 cable and I know the 650 cable sounds better so I am using that. But I hear scattered things about upgradr cables and wonder if any are worth it.

Your ears are way sharper than mine cuz I don't hear a difference between the HD650 and HD600 cables haha. I just buy cables to get them in a desired length. But in the realm of cables in the more-than-I'd-like-to-pay price range, Best in the Verse ones are said to be pretty good value. And in the higher realm of these-cables-cost-more-than-my-headphones-why-would-I-buy-this, Norne Audio supposedly makes fantastic cables as well.
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 8:21 AM Post #13,868 of 23,439
  I definitely like these cables. And I actually like the pseudo-1/4" termination, it makes it a bit more versatile, especially for those really eclectic testing phases where you're trying it on a headphone amp one minute and a Fiio X5 the next. Much rather adapt up to a larger jack then adapt down to a smaller jack, it usually tends to be more cumbersome when you have to adapt to a 3.5mm. Besides, I doubt many people can hear a difference between native 1/4" and adapted 1/4". I know for sure I can't, but as we always say YMMV
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Your ears are way sharper than mine cuz I don't hear a difference between the HD650 and HD600 cables haha. I just buy cables to get them in a desired length. But in the realm of cables in the more-than-I'd-like-to-pay price range, Best in the Verse ones are said to be pretty good value. And in the higher realm of these-cables-cost-more-than-my-headphones-why-would-I-buy-this, Norne Audio supposedly makes fantastic cables as well.

Yes I definitely cannot tell the difference between terminations....Just as a practical issue for me, I will never plug into a 3.5mm jack. 
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 9:33 AM Post #13,869 of 23,439
  I have a Bimby and its not a really noticeable difference from the Modi2Uber to me but then I maybe DAC deaf.  The way I define noticeable is to let others listen to the various DACs and switch between them with a level matching box.  If more than 50% can notice a difference then I would consider it a "noticeable" difference.  In the case of the Bifrost MB vs Modi2Uber only 1 in 7 persons could notice a difference so far and most of them were younger with fairly good hearing that could tell the difference between 256 MP3 and WAV files which many can't.

 
And strangely you have tons of people who swear they hear a (not subtle) difference between the Modi and Bifrost (multibit), some even having done blind tests.  What I've also noticed is it depends on your chain.  Higher (or maybe just different) grade cans/amps can pick up certain differences that others can't.  So it's not just a matter of doing A/B tests, but having a setup that can reveal those differences.  You are not just testing the DAC, but testing everything else in your system along with it, since different components react differently to each other.  Yes, confirmation bias is a real thing, but also, this hobby seems to be extremely delicate in terms of synergy between components (which is a real thing too), which is why even blind tests may not be reliable.  I also find it hard to believe a transparent, down to earth company like Schiit (who are friendly to this forum) would intentionally make a DAC that is several hundred dollars more than the Modi that is not sonically different in some way.  I don't really buy that at all.  I'm sure they thoroughly test using sophisticated techniques, and if they can't hear a difference, then it means they're no better than the snake oil cable charlatans, since it would mean they're intentionally deceiving people.  Anything's possible I suppose, but I don't really buy it.
 
EDIT: And those younger people with really good hearing, I've noticed that sometimes people need to know what to listen for in terms of differences (depth, transparency, transients, fast/slow, etc) in order to be suitable candidates for blind tests.  The difference between a 256kbps mp3 and WAV should be extremely obvious to most anyone with decent hearing, because one is garbage and the other is excellent.  Mp3s are not good audio files (it actually strips sonic information from the track).  So you have two totally different classes of audio.  Whereas with the Modi, you already have an excellent DAC that is not on the level of a crappy mp3 (let's say just in terms of comparison), being compared to a more expensive Bifrost... you are already starting with two excellent sound sources, not one crappy and one excellent (mp3 vs WAV), so it may be harder for casuals (who are not sophisticated with audio terms and sonic levels) to differentiate between the two.  In their mind, they both sound great, so this may trigger an unconscious/confirmation bias in themselves, since they are both awesome sounding (just as a matter of deductive reasoning).  I have heard stories like this where a wife will not be able to tell the difference between two excellent pieces of equipment that is obvious to the husband, with her reasoning being "they both sound amazing!"  These DACs can be enjoyed by anyone, but they were made by sophisticated people who understand and appreciate these subtle, but powerful differences that your average person may not.
 
But in the end, the individual must use their own ears and decide, confirmation bias or not.  
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 9:53 AM Post #13,870 of 23,439
  ...
 
But in the end, the individual must use their own ears and decide, confirmation bias or not.  

 
+1.  I completely agree...
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 10:26 AM Post #13,871 of 23,439
  The difference between a 256kbps mp3 and WAV should be extremely obvious to most anyone with decent hearing, because one is garbage and the other is excellent.

 
This is a very bold statement.
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 10:52 AM Post #13,873 of 23,439
Anything that actually REMOVES audible information from a track (and thus destroy the artist's creation) is garbage to me. And that is what mp3s do in order to compress the file so drastically. This is even more aparent on good sounding gear.

 
I'm saying this as someone who has a huge FLAC collection and not a single MP3 file.  In fact, poor mastering (read: loudness war) is what ultimately destroys the artist's creation, not the encoding format, lossless or not. I've also used to be an audio-snob for the big part of my life, but now I don't even mind Spotify Premium for convenience sake. The perceptible difference (if there is one) is simply negligible... But when people are claiming literally "night and day difference", it just makes me smile.
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 11:41 AM Post #13,874 of 23,439
   
I'm saying this as someone who has a huge FLAC collection and not a single MP3 file.  In fact, poor mastering (read: loudness war) is what ultimately destroys the artist's creation, not the encoding format, lossless or not. I've also used to be an audio-snob for the big part of my life, but now I don't even mind Spotify Premium for convenience sake. The perceptible difference (if there is one) is simply negligible... But when people are claiming literally "night and day difference", it just makes me smile.

I bought a number of HDTracks high res that I found very disappointing due to the poor remastering.
 
I had assumed (bad plan on my part) that the remastered versions would be better.  In many cases they are not.
 
I have found I am happier with a quality master at Spotify Premium than the high res that was caught up in the "loudness war".
 
Apr 2, 2016 at 12:00 PM Post #13,875 of 23,439
  I bought a number of HDTracks high res that I found very disappointing due to the poor remastering.

 
Yep, that's why I'm always trying to get the earliest CD releases (original pressings). They're usually the least compressed, best quality versions available. The actual media format is not even in top 5 of my concerns.
 

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