[zach915m]

I thought that he only meant that for the HE6. I plugged in my LFF Code X (HE5) as well. They are lets say equivalent to HE500 power requirements wise and get too loud on the LC even under half way on the volume knob and the MZ2 cant even power these without getting distorted? Then I plugged in my Omnis and same results. Why do I keep reading these have enough power for most headphones and what not?

I read enough comparisons between the LC and MZ2 mentioning how MZ2 trumps the LC in all possible ways, without anyone mentioning that these just dont have the power for many headphones, and I assumed specs dont say everything about amps. I might be missing something completely or these are maybe just made for very easy to drive headphones only.

Whats the source? Sorry of I missed this already.

I just don't recall having to go past 1 pm much if ever on the zotl. I'm wondering if this has anything to do with the input level.

 

[Jozurr]

I was all set to get the Glass, but decided I didn't want to wait more than 6 months, so I got the MZ2. I am very happy with the MZ2, but I'd still be curious to hear your comparison with the Glass. 

Re: Power supplies: I originally got mine with the very basic SMPS power supply. I think they might not even provide these any more. Then I upgraded to the LPS, and the difference was amazing. That got me on the power supply bandwagon, and now I have an even better power supply (Joule 5 from Mojo Audio). Each upgrade has been a large jump in terms of background blackness, speed, and clarity. 

Funny, I didn't even realize background blackness was a thing until I got the LPS, when I immediately saw that the background had been just darkish grey before.
The LPS *seemed* pitch black, but with the J5 I see that it was only, errr....very dark grey. :rolleyes:  

I was curious how I would have used them out of the box had I just ordered the MZ2 without LPS but that seems to have gone unanswered.

I have the LPS and currently im facing trouble powering 3-4 of my main headphones so Im not sure how Id be able to post comparisons or even use the MZ2 as an amp. Its also difficult to post comparisons as I dont have 2 pairs of same tubes, and tubes contribute to a lot of the sound, so side by side comparison would be impossible. I could have done a comparison taking out the tubes from MZ2 and using them on the LG, but currently I cant even say that MZ2 alone can even power the headphones Im using.

 

[Jozurr]

Whats the source? Sorry of I missed this already.

I just don't recall having to go past 1 pm much if ever on the zotl. I'm wondering if this has anything to do with the input level.

Im using the DAC-19. Using the same cables out from the MZ2 into the LG/LC and both of those amps seem to have enough power half way on the pot.

 

[crazychile]

@willsw already answered your distortion question

I might be missing something completely or these are maybe just made for very easy to drive headphones only.

Or maybe you listen to music a lot louder than most people. The Microzotl might not be for you. This may be more appropriate:

https://www.millerwelds.com/equipment/welders/advanced-mig/continuum-advanced-mig-welder-m90589

 

[zachawry]

I was curious how I would have used them out of the box had I just ordered the MZ2 without LPS but that seems to have gone unanswered.

I have the LPS and currently im facing trouble powering 3-4 of my main headphones so Im not sure how Id be able to post comparisons or even use the MZ2 as an amp. Its also difficult to post comparisons as I dont have 2 pairs of same tubes, and tubes contribute to a lot of the sound, so side by side comparison would be impossible. I could have done a comparison taking out the tubes from MZ2 and using them on the LG, but currently I cant even say that MZ2 alone can even power the headphones Im using.

I don't think it's possible to buy an MZ2 without some kind of accompanying power supply. Or if someone ordered one without a power supply, it would only be because they already had one from a third-party. That's like ordering a car without wheels--you only do it if you already have a great set. 
 
As for power...I've never really gone past 12 noon, even on (relatively) power-hungry headphones like the Alpha Prime, so I can't speak to power. 

 

[Jozurr]

Or maybe you listen to music a lot louder than most people. The Microzotl might not be for you. This may be more appropriate:

https://www.millerwelds.com/equipment/welders/advanced-mig/continuum-advanced-mig-welder-m90589

There is no need for digs like these. If you cant handle criticism against the magic amp, you shouldnt be in a discussion thread.

 

[Jozurr]

I don't think it's possible to buy an MZ2 without some kind of accompanying power supply. Or if someone ordered one without a power supply, it would only be because they already had one from a third-party. That's like ordering a car without wheels--you only do it if you already have a great set. 

As for power...I've never really gone past 12 noon, even on (relatively) power-hungry headphones like the Alpha Prime, so I can't speak to power. 

Yes my question is, what does the standard MZ2 come with, and is that not included in the deluxe package so I can try the amp without the LPS. What did your MZ2 come with before you got the LPS? maybe someone who has gotten just the MZ2 can chime in

 

[zachawry]

Yes my question is, what does the standard MZ2 come with, and is that not included in the deluxe package so I can try the amp without the LPS. What did your MZ2 come with before you got the LPS? maybe someone who has gotten just the MZ2 can chime in

The standard MZ2 came with the SMPS power supply when I got it. I believe they switched to offering the LPS standard, but I'm not sure. 

 

[willsw]

I thought that he only meant that for the HE6. I plugged in my LFF Code X (HE5) as well. They are lets say equivalent to HE500 power requirements wise and get too loud on the LC even under half way on the volume knob and the MZ2 cant even power these without getting distorted? Then I plugged in my Omnis and same results. Why do I keep reading these have enough power for most headphones and what not?

I read enough comparisons between the LC and MZ2 mentioning how MZ2 trumps the LC in all possible ways, without anyone mentioning that these just dont have the power for many headphones, and I assumed specs dont say everything about amps. I might be missing something completely or these are maybe just made for very easy to drive headphones only.

 
Jozurr, apologies about not addressing more of your questions more clearly. It's been very busy around here.
 
The HE-5 is also a hard to drive headphone. The HE-500 is designed to be more sensitive than the HE5 I have limited experience with, but recently used one with a MicroZOTL2 and found I could go quite loud around 1 o'clock on the pot, and had no distortion. I've listened to several different Omnis with the MicroZOTL2 and never heard distortion, nor reports of distortion. Zach of ZMF, who makes the Omni, has a MicroZOTL2 and has never mentioned distortion. 
 
An amp needs a power supply. You can't compare the MicroZOTL2 "with and without" the LPS, you can compare it with the LTA LPS and with a different power supply. The stock model we sell comes with a smaller, lower-quality switching power supply. There are many options for power supplies you could switch out. 
 
The LC puts out more power than the MicroZOTL2. The power output of an amplifier is not equivalent to the quality of the amplifier. I don't think anyone has claimed, nor we would claim, that the MicroZOTL2 is a good amp to listen to the HE6, HE5, or any modified version of either. 
 
Some people think the MicroZOTL2 makes the HD-650 sound better than any amp they've tried. Some (fewer) people think it doesn't power them well enough.
 
If you have the locking jack, the preamp output will still be active when your headphones are plugged in, though they'll share power. If only an adapter is plugged in, I don't imagine you'll be losing any power, though the signal path probably won't be as pure. We recently made available a closed circuit jack that disconnects the speaker and preamp outputs when headphones are plugged in. 
 
If using the MicroZOTL2 as a preamp with a DC coupled Solid-state amp, you must turn on the MZ2 BEFORE the amp and turn it off AFTER the amp. Otherwise the turn on and turn off transients can be amplified and can be dangerous for your speakers and your power amp. We are developing an ideal way to do protection but it won't be available for a while, in a future model. The current MicroZOTL2's preamp capabilities were put in as an afterthought that has turned out to be very good, but unfortunately it is operated in the most basic way and must be operated carefully with DC-coupled power amps. 
 
There is also the possibility that something is malfunctioning with your amp, if you're hearing all of this distortion. If you'd like to contact me via PM or via the email on our website, we could troubleshoot that with you. 

 

[willsw]

@Jozurr I just tested with some Omnis, and I will give you that around 4o'clock, which is kind of painful for most music and definitely higher than I imagine anyone listening at home, I can hear some distortion, that increases until you top off around 5:30. If these are levels you like to listen at with the headphones you have, this may not be the amp for you.

 

[doctorjazz]

I don't have the Omnis in the house any more, but had them for review, mostly used the ZOTL, and at normal listening kennels (say, 11 to 1 or 2), I thought it was a great sounding combination.

 

[Jozurr]

So the stock model power supply is not included with the MZ2 Deluxe? I thought the LPS was an addition, and not a replacement of the stock power supply for the selling price of a deluxe combo, so one can switch back and forth if required, or sell the LPS etc, without having to buy an additional power supply.
 
I tried the HE-500 as well, and going past 2 o clock on the MZ2 with it as well, I can hear distortion in the bass, just like the Omni. I've never heard power running out with any amp, even the cheaper Gustard H10 had enough power for the Omnis to be loud enough for me. My listening levels haven't changed.  When I plugged in the HE-6 on the H10, I could still hit maximum volume without distortion, just that the HE-6 werent loud enough. Maybe my source isn't as loud (AGD DAC-19), but it certainly seems to work great with the LC and LG I'm currently using. The only headphone working loud enough is the THX-00, because it is loud enough at 12 o clock. Up to 2 o clock on the knob, everything works beautifully, and it's just a TAD bit less louder than I like. After 2 o clock everything takes a nose dive. Im wont be using the HE-6 with any headphone amp, but I do it out of curiosity. but the Code-X, HE-500 and the Omni have never had problems with any of the other amps.
 
I'm very surprised no one else would have noticed lack of power on the MZ2. I'm not sure about reports saying how the bass hits harder than the LC when I cant even go loud enough to feel the bass on it.

 

[willsw]

  So the stock model power supply is not included with the MZ2 Deluxe? I thought the LPS was an addition, and not a replacement of the stock power supply for the selling price of a deluxe combo, so one can switch back and forth if required, or sell the LPS etc, without having to buy an additional power supply.
 
I tried the HE-500 as well, and going past 2 o clock on the MZ2 with it as well, I can hear distortion in the bass, just like the Omni. I've never heard power running out with any amp, even the cheaper Gustard H10 had enough power for the Omnis to be loud enough for me. My listening levels haven't changed.  When I plugged in the HE-6 on the H10, I could still hit maximum volume without distortion, just that the HE-6 werent loud enough. Maybe my source isn't as loud (AGD DAC-19), but it certainly seems to work great with the LC and LG I'm currently using. The only headphone working loud enough is the THX-00, because it is loud enough at 12 o clock. Up to 2 o clock on the knob, everything works beautifully, and it's just a TAD bit less louder than I like. After 2 o clock everything takes a nose dive. Im wont be using the HE-6 with any headphone amp, but I do it out of curiosity. but the Code-X, HE-500 and the Omni have never had problems with any of the other amps.
 
I'm very surprised no one else would have noticed lack of power on the MZ2. I'm not sure about reports saying how the bass hits harder than the LC when I cant even go loud enough to feel the bass on it.

 
The AGD DAC-19 is one I've used. It sounds like your listening level is just higher than average, and the MicroZOTL2 just might not be powerful enough to make things loud enough for you. Separately from that, I'm not sure why you're equating output power with the quality of the amp, but if that's your measure, that's your measure. I can't really say anything else about it. This is why we offer (if you bought it from Urban HiFi) a 15-day return policy. 
 
One final, very unlikely thing, is to make sure the input switch on the front is set to the correct input. 

 

[willsw]

If anyone is or knows a smaller person, we have a couple of men's size small LTA shirts for sale, extras from my guessing sizes to surprise the guys with some shirts. http://www.head-fi.org/t/816357/two-lta-t-shirts-size-mens-small

 

[Stereomojo]

Perhaps I can clear up the confusion over power supplies for the MicroZotl2. Part of the confusion is due to the LTA website which does not explain what I have learned from Will. It really needs to be updated. There should be separate listings for the two different packages they offer with at least pictures of the unit with the standard power supply and another showing the unit with the upgraded power supply.

There are two packages available. One includes the standard power supply and that combo sells for $1100.

The second package, called the Deluxe, includes the bigger, better linear power supply that was designed by Mark Schneider specifically for the MZ2. The deluxe sells for $1695.

I don't know if you can buy an MZ2 without a power supply, but it needs a power supply to work in the same way a car needs an engine to work. It will not work without one. If you already have a compatible power supply with the correct connection, you would have to contact LTA for that type of purchase if available.

The better linear power supply can be purchased separately later if you wish to upgrade from the standard.

I think it's great that they give you a choice, much less the fact that they designed the unit with an external power supply in the first place for lower noise and greater sound quality.

Hope this helps.