[coli]

  So not a magazine reviewer or tech lab. I think the R-2R DACs are having a revival, and high end users using RedBook mainly, or having tried high-resolution files and come back to 44.1 are realising just how damb good it can sound. I spent much too much on multi DAC purchases over the years, Naim, Musical Fidelity, Meridian, Maranz, Pink Triangle, it goes on. I nearly gave up as I hate the digital edge or unnatural treble and vocal presentation of those Delta-Sigma DACs. R-2R hits the right spot for me.
 
And with the advances in USB connectivity it is now possible IMO to get better performance than that offered by 20K+ CDPs and DACs for sale even 5 years ago.

No, they had lab measurements. I think it's a magazine.
 
They said the Audio Note measured horribly but sounded amazingly good.

 

[windwolf447]

Should be because of the Even-order harmonics. That is the reason why tube can sound so good.
All those tube output DAC you guys mentioned are too rare in Hong Kong. I wish I have chance to compare them to my Pavane.

 

[PATB]

   
I would recommend trying the R-2R Audio Note DAC 4.1 for a different flavour. I use that DAC and the jump from the Metrum is enormous.
 
 

 
I have read good things about the Audio Note DACs.  Unfortunately, I have no DIY skills, and the built ones are out of my price range.  My original plan was to get the Hex; I am already stretching my budget to get the Pavane.
 
EDIT:  I saw the Digital Pete ANK 4.1 kit post by preproman and googled it up.  Actually cheaper than a Pavane.

 

[coli]

Found it Audio Note DAC5 with measurements: http://www.hificritic.com/store/p5/Review%3A_Audio_Note_CDT-3_DAC5.html
 
"measures appallingly, and sounds wonderful. Martin Colloms and Chris Bryant attempt to pick the bones out of this conundrum."
 
And their point charts: http://www.hificritic.com/digital-audio.html
Audio Note Level 5 DAC Level 5, Force Power 400-450
Metrum Acoustics HEX balanced output 195

 

[astrostar59]

   
I have read good things about the Audio Note DACs.  Unfortunately, I have no DIY skills, and the built ones are out of my price range.  My original plan was to get the Hex; I am already stretching my budget to get the Pavane.
 
EDIT:  I saw the Digital Pete ANK 4.1 kit post by preproman and googled it up.  Actually cheaper than a Pavane.

Hi PATB
You can get the DAC 4.1 pre-assembled. Email Brian an Audio Note kits for details.
audionotekits@rogers.com
 
The build will be pro level. I can tell you it sounds fantastic, think best vinyl rig you ever heard with digital black background.

 

[PATB]

  Hi PATB
You can get the DAC 4.1 pre-assembled. Email Brian an Audio Note kits for details.
audionotekits@rogers.com
 
The build will be pro level. I can tell you it sounds fantastic, think best vinyl rig you ever heard with digital black background.

 
Thanks astrostar.  I will look into it.  To complicate matters, according to their facebook page, ANK will be displaying their new 5.1 kit in the California Audio Show next week. 

 

[astrostar59]

   
Thanks astrostar.  I will look into it.  To complicate matters, according to their facebook page, ANK will be displaying their new 5.1 kit in the California Audio Show next week. 

Yes, I saw that. I know of the new DAC 5.1. It has a bigger power supply and different output tubes. The price will be higher than the 4.1 though.
I would say get the 4.1 regardless, it is awesome. Unless you have the budget to go higher... This hobby it nuts! Seriously, the 4.1 is that good, you won't be disappointed, it has been in the market for a few years and has been fine tuned to get the absolute best sound out of it, is so solid and proven, you can't go wrong - trust me. I have one and am not selling it, no chance.

 

[preproman]

   
Thanks astrostar.  I will look into it.  To complicate matters, according to their facebook page, ANK will be displaying their new 5.1 kit in the California Audio Show next week. 

For the price the 5.1 kit will be "which I have no idea"  Take a look at the AMR DP-77 SE and the La Scala MKII and of course the Pavane.  All are different designs but with tube output stages except the Pavane.

 

[realmassy]

One more option if you like tube: http://www.lector-audio.com/S-192.htm
It is my current dac

 

[PATB]

The main reason I am still leaning towards the Pavane is because I am not sure of the longevity of the tubes in the dac, especially when you have to keep it on all the time as in other dacs.  I have a balanced tube amp (SinglePower SDS-XLR) and the cost of the ken-rad black glass, replacements every couple of years, and the fact that new old stock 6sn7s are disappearing and getting very expensive are keeping me away from tubes in general.  Still, I like the sound of tubes.  I just hope I don't attend the California Audio Show (a couple of minutes from my house) next week to check on ANK, as I tend to buy on impulse 

 

[wahsmoh]

So not a magazine reviewer or tech lab. I think the R-2R DACs are having a revival, and high end users using RedBook mainly, or having tried high-resolution files and come back to 44.1 are realising just how damb good it can sound. I spent much too much on multi DAC purchases over the years, Naim, Musical Fidelity, Meridian, Maranz, Pink Triangle, it goes on. I nearly gave up as I hate the digital edge or unnatural treble and vocal presentation of those Delta-Sigma DACs. R-2R hits the right spot for me.

And with the advances in USB connectivity it is now possible IMO to get better performance than that offered by 20K+ CDPs and DACs for sale even 5 years ago.

I think the unnatural treble and glare of most D-S DACs is something you don't notice until you try a good R2R. Then when you try and go back it never sounds the same again. I have listened to a few of the newer D-S like the Auralic Vega, Yulong DAC varieties, Ayre qb-9 and codex, schiits akm4399 and what I have found is generally they sound less engaging and don't have the slam or timbre of the R2R and become fatiguing more quickly at higher volume. There is a sweet spot for the volume on most D-S DACs and once you go up higher in volume the glare becomes more noticeable. I find that when R2R in general you can push them in volume without killing your ears with digitiitus in the treble.

 

[preproman]

I suggest you go up a few levels in D-S DACs.  Where there is no treble glare and they are very engaging.  This entire D-S is bad R2R is good thing is very general.  There are good and bad of both. Different output stages, different proprietary filters / no filters - whatever the case may be.  These things are all there the help / hurt the sound and all in different ways.  All D-S DACs can't be clumped into the "bad" category.  Just saying..

 

[jibzilla]

  The main reason I am still leaning towards the Pavane is because I am not sure of the longevity of the tubes in the dac, especially when you have to keep it on all the time as in other dacs.  I have a balanced tube amp (SinglePower SDS-XLR) and the cost of the ken-rad black glass, replacements every couple of years, and the fact that new old stock 6sn7s are disappearing and getting very expensive are keeping me away from tubes in general.  Still, I like the sound of tubes.  I just hope I don't attend the California Audio Show (a couple of minutes from my house) next week to check on ANK, as I tend to buy on impulse 

Many of us 6sn7ers are getting 6f8g adapters from 2359glenn. Decent end around.

 

[astrostar59]

 
Many of us 6sn7ers are getting 6f8g adapters from 2359glenn. Decent end around.

 

  The main reason I am still leaning towards the Pavane is because I am not sure of the longevity of the tubes in the dac, especially when you have to keep it on all the time as in other dacs.  I have a balanced tube amp (SinglePower SDS-XLR) and the cost of the ken-rad black glass, replacements every couple of years, and the fact that new old stock 6sn7s are disappearing and getting very expensive are keeping me away from tubes in general.  Still, I like the sound of tubes.  I just hope I don't attend the California Audio Show (a couple of minutes from my house) next week to check on ANK, as I tend to buy on impulse 

I run my DAC 4.1 on all the time. The 5687 Tungsol NOS 1960s are about 110 US a pair or less. They last 2-3 years, some more than that. I don't worry about that cost as the sound is so damb good. The power tubes I uses are Bendix and last 5 years+ and cost around 160 US pair. The tubes are low voltage types as in a pre-amp so nothing like a power amp such as 300Bs. They can last a long time. Brian at Audio Note kits will have the DAC 5.1 at the show, you could see it then and ask about prices. I am not sure what they, but will be more than the DAC 4.1. My DAC 4.1 beats many D-S DACs at 3 times the price. I don't want to get into the D-S v R-2R here, it goes on to long and the D-S gang get wound up. needless to say, listen and then make your mind up.
 
I am certainly not saying all D-S are bad, but I haven't yet heard a D-S that sounds 'right' IMO. Yes, detailed, dynamic, exciting (for a while) but too hi-fi form me. I want a more realistic (warmer?) sound, and one I can play loud and not run for the volume when the drums start.... To me R-2R + tubes = heaven.

 

[Articnoise]

  I suggest you go up a few levels in D-S DACs.  Where there is no treble glare and they are very engaging.  This entire D-S is bad R2R is good thing is very general.  There are good and bad of both. Different output stages, different proprietary filters / no filters - whatever the case may be.  These things are all there the help / hurt the sound and all in different ways.  All D-S DACs can't be clumped into the "bad" category.  Just saying..

 

+1

 

(A few years ago it was hard to find a really good sounded D-S DAC, today not IME.)