LCD-2 / Bifrost / Lyr
Aug 31, 2011 at 7:30 PM Post #16 of 39


Quote:
Heya,
 
I have the Lyr. It will not damage anything. I even tried to blow up some cheap headphones to see. It just won't. It will work great with any headphone you plug into it, and will especially work well with an ortho that can be fed endless amounts of power. So if you want the Lyr, get the Lyr.

 


Confirmed.
 
I just plugged my 900s into my freshly unpacked Lyr and threw on some Rodrigo and Gabriela, initially at very low volume, slowly increasing to normal listening levels, then a bit more adventurous "rock out levels".
 
No smoke, no electric discharge, no damage to the phones, the amp, or my head.
It certainly gave the 900s a different "shape" and "color", noticeable but not extreme. Although, as far as volume and performance go, not much was different from the headphone jack on my CD player. Both being a great step up from the iPod line out, but nonetheless both seem to drive the phones evenly (ie plenty of power for the 900s), just with slightly different tonal influences (Lyr being warmer than my little Teac's headphone out).
 
 
I also agree with the others. Take the biggest hit and biggest upgrade first, the headphones, then get your amp/dac situation sorted later. I have and love both the 900s and now the LCD2s, I love them both for different reasons, and now the Lyr as well (I use a Marantz SA8004 or Teac CR-H500NT for my DAC, so no comment on the Bifrost). You are building a really nice little setup.
You'll be really happy with it by the time it's done!
 
 
 
Aug 31, 2011 at 7:47 PM Post #17 of 39
Sigh... What's that saying 'Opinions are like ...' - here's mine 
wink_face.gif
. I like your choice of gear. I have Lyr, am waiting for Bifrost and have my eye on the LCD-2 Rev.2. I own two Lyrs - one for home and one for the office. Both are played virtually every day (the work one get's a break on Sunday). I have a couple of DT990/600s that I mainly listen to, but I also plugin my Denon D2000s, K702s and HD600s into the Lyrs. While the DT990s and K702s excel synergy wise, the D2000s and HD600s sound very nice with Lyr. While my listening levels are relatively low, my lower impedance cans seem to benefit from the gobs of headroom available in peaks and transients. Music has tons of slam and is very dynamic with Lyr - regardless of which of my headphones I use.
 
Lyr's been out for quite a few months, and they're are bunches of users who use it day in and day out, with all types of headphones with nary an issue. Caution should always be observed (regardless of your amp/headphones) to unplug your cans, and turn down the column when powering up. All that being said, If you can swing it, the LCD-2 would probably give you the biggest benefit.
 
Sep 1, 2011 at 1:06 PM Post #18 of 39
Good advice all round, thanks everyone! As it stands i'm gonna get myself a nice shiny new LCD-2 over the next couple of weeks then make the other upgrades from there. As it stands it looks like it will be a Lyr / Bifrost (depending on reviews on release) combo. But maybe i will go for an all-in-one system for practicality. For some reason, as i've heard someone else say, there is something satisfying about having multiple units. 
 
A few final questions about the LCD-2 if anyone knows? Is it worth paying the extra $50 for a leather headband? Does it look much better / is it more comfortable? I'd like the whole thing to look as good as possible to be honest. 
Are all the LCD-2's for sale at the moment the Rev2 version? And finally, does anyone know where the best place to order is in the UK?
 
Thanks
 
Sep 1, 2011 at 2:51 PM Post #19 of 39
I was considering the headband but personally I like the look of the stock foam better. The headband might be slightly more comfortable and less damageable than the foam, but it's a matter of whether that's worth $50 to you.
 
Sep 1, 2011 at 2:57 PM Post #20 of 39
It's ultimately down to preferance i suppose. i'm thinking more from an aesthetic point of view (basically to show off) :p
 
Sep 1, 2011 at 3:20 PM Post #21 of 39
Quite true, I found out the hard way that power alone means nothing. The amp might still suffer in certain aspects of SQ regardless of it's high power.
 
Last I checked the LCD thread, there was no consensus about the headband. Some found it more comfortable, others said it was slightly less comfortable due to weight. Though I do think everyone agreed that it looks better.
 
Quote:
Unfortunately some of these high powered amps might not necessarily perform that great themselves. I wouldn't want to trust my headphone's performance to an amp with few published measurements just because it might hypothetically control drivers better for no apparent reason.



 
 
Sep 2, 2011 at 2:52 PM Post #22 of 39
I suppose that comfort is a very individual thing. I think i might go straight for the leather option if i can. May as well go all out!
 
Quote:
Quite true, I found out the hard way that power alone means nothing. The amp might still suffer in certain aspects of SQ regardless of it's high power.
 
Last I checked the LCD thread, there was no consensus about the headband. Some found it more comfortable, others said it was slightly less comfortable due to weight. Though I do think everyone agreed that it looks better.
 


 



 
 
Sep 5, 2011 at 7:10 AM Post #23 of 39
LCD2: If you mean 2nd hand, many or most are rev1. If you mean new, rev 2. Rev 1 is no longer manufactured. The revision occurred because of a change of supplier and material owing to reliability issues that arose. A new material was already under consideration and reliability caused Audez'e to change sooner than originally intended.
 
The Lyr is a great amp with the flexibility of changing sonic signature through tube-rolling. Personally, it's not my favourite with the LCD2; but it's very, very good. With GE 6BZ7 tubes (you can order from Schiit with this option) there is a fairly neutral sound overall with a slight thickening to the midrange that suits e.g. electric guitar (think blues rock, blues metal etc) extremely well. I understand that with other - albeit expensive - tubes the Lyr really starts to show its potential. Of course, tubes can be upgraded as you can afford them - see the Schiit Lyr tube-rolling thread.
 
Also, look out for a review from Skylab/Rob sometime in the next few weeks, together with his review of the Bifrost. He has a loaner (of the Lyr) and has been surprised by the quality of the amp. Its low price makes it something of a bargain. 
 
I am undecided on what difference the ample power levels of the Lyr makes to the LCD2. I agree with headinjury's comments. With careful matching of levels, I find the Lyr and Meier Concerto - which some have claimed can only manage 500mW into the 52-ohm LCD2 - cannot be separated on bass slam, transient handling etc; however, to be fair, other's who have owned both amps heard differently, though I'm unaware whether any of them A/B'd directly in reaching this view.
 
I use my Lyr also with Grado RS1 (32-ohm) and Beyerdynamic T1 (600 ohm). It is my preferred amp with the RS1! (other amps I have are Concerto, Violectric V100, Little Dot 1+ hybrid and Meier Opera). Despite picturesque warnings contained in Schiit's witty FAQs page, normal careful use of the volume control and normal precautions when plugging in/out are all that's needed, as already said.
 
A final comment about the Lyr is that it's 6W power rating - 4W into 50 ohms - is not the whole story. It has surprising delicacy and finesse. This was noticeable even with the E88CC tubes which are the stock option, but which have a tendency to a slightly syrupy sound (with the Lyr) which may suit some but not others (me included).
 
Finally, as an owner of the LCD2 rev 1 - before there was a headband option - I think the headphone looks absolutely fine even without the leather option. This must really be just a matter of personal taste, although it occurs to me the money saved might be put toward an amp and especially DAC. Quite a lot of common wisdom/experience with the LCD2 goes that the 'phone is so transparent and revealing yet easy to drive that DAC rather than amp is by far the greater determinant of its sound. It's the old story: flaws are so easily revealed by these phones - I happen to agree - they are often blamed on the phones when actually it's something in the audio chain that's at fault.
 
HTH & good luck.
Quote:
Good advice all round, thanks everyone! As it stands i'm gonna get myself a nice shiny new LCD-2 over the next couple of weeks then make the other upgrades from there. As it stands it looks like it will be a Lyr / Bifrost (depending on reviews on release) combo. But maybe i will go for an all-in-one system for practicality. For some reason, as i've heard someone else say, there is something satisfying about having multiple units. 
 
A few final questions about the LCD-2 if anyone knows? Is it worth paying the extra $50 for a leather headband? Does it look much better / is it more comfortable? I'd like the whole thing to look as good as possible to be honest. 
Are all the LCD-2's for sale at the moment the Rev2 version? And finally, does anyone know where the best place to order is in the UK?
 
Thanks



 
 
Sep 5, 2011 at 3:20 PM Post #24 of 39
Thanks for the (very) detailed response AiDee! 
I'm definitely getting them brand new, i was wondering about how many of the Rev1's are still being stocked online, although yes, i suppose they probably will have all been sold by now!
Based on your advice here i think i'll get a DAC before buying another amp. I'm sure my MK V will do the job for the time being. Eagerly awaiting the release of the Bifrost so i can read up on some reviews. Ideally i'll like a Stagedac but it's a bit out of my price range.
 
Thanks again :)
 
Sep 5, 2011 at 3:28 PM Post #25 of 39
You're making the right choice getting the LCD2 first.  Generally you want to upgrade in the order of headphones -> source (DAC) -> amp.
 
If you find that the LCD2 isn't loud enough than you can get the Lyr first, but if there aren't volume issues, get the Bifrost after the LCD2.
 
Sep 5, 2011 at 3:35 PM Post #26 of 39
Not sure on the DAC yet, depends on how the Bifrost stacks up with reviews on release i suppose. I was originally gonna go for a Yulong but heard a few horror stories and they aren't quite as approachable as Schiit i wouldn't imagine. Those guys have got themselves a good work ethic / marketing campaign IMO
 
Nov 5, 2011 at 9:45 AM Post #27 of 39
I think its the tubes that contribute to the extra "slam" there was definitely a change between the concerto and the lyr in the overall sound profile.  That was the only major obvious change without actual A-B.
 
But the concerto has cross feed, and was PROBABLY a bit more more towards that digital neutrality.  It was a good amp, way better than the m-stage for the LCD-2's.  The M-Stage had a similar sound profile actually, but without gain or low gain volume control just was not right.  (The LCD-2's don't need exuberant amounts of gain)
 
Nov 5, 2011 at 3:09 PM Post #28 of 39
Having equalized SPL's more carefully (*), I do hear more difference between the Concerto and Lyr than I did previously. Still the same character as before. Lyr is warner (with 6BZ7 or my current favorite Matsu 6922), more earthy, a slightly thicker upper-bass and lower mids. These tubes are still close to neutral though, whilst the Concerto is unrelentingly neutral. Sometimes, the Concerto can seem "dry" as Kh3ct described it IIRC. However, to my ears listening to a classical piano recording last night (piano is the only instrument I play and "know" well), the Concerto was the more accurate.
 
Regardless, I find both are terrific amps for LCD2.
 
* Surprisingly, the pots are at about the same position (about 1030) to achieve 80dBA; about half-power for Concerto. I honestly think Jan under-stated his figures. My old Opera also states 500mA max and 10V peak output, yet the Concerto is undoubtedly more powerful.
 
Nov 5, 2011 at 9:16 PM Post #29 of 39
The concerto is definitely a more neutral amp, if you want the same neutrality and more current I would check out the Vioelectric which I will one day end up auditioning.
 
Nov 5, 2011 at 10:19 PM Post #30 of 39


Quote:
The concerto is definitely a more neutral amp, if you want the same neutrality and more current I would check out the Vioelectric which I will one day end up auditioning.



Violectric V200 and the LCD-2 is very good example of audio synergy!
 

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