[russdenney]

Given my current situation - headphones with way more high end SQ compared to my speakers, I do prefer listening with my cans. My speakers are quite decent though; they happen to run through the same setup and I do listen to them for non-critical, relaxed background music type sessions.

If I were in a situation where I could rock out with the speakers at a similar loudness to how I occasionally go with my cans, I would be using my speakers a bit more.

If I had the pinnacle of a headphone setup and the pinnacle of a speaker setup, with the freedom to play music as loud as I wanted to, I would be listening with my speakers a lot more. I was exposed to hifi speaker setups first and do harbour some resentment towards the closed in soundstage of headphones but high end headphone setups are quite a bit more affordable compared to high end hifi setups...

Very well said in every regard.
 
I struggle with the closed in sound of headphones - even my open back HD800S.

 

[nordkapp]

I was a die hard 2 channel guy for the last 21 years. No longer. Way too many variables (mostly room acoustics) w/speakers impacting the musical performance for me. Now it's just used for background stuff. There may be very minor trade-offs w/phones imo, but I prefer to hear everything within the recording when sitting down to just enjoy music. Just my opinion. 

 

[nordkapp]

 @russdenney
   Great thread. One that will likely hold my interest. 

 

[russdenney]

   @russdenney
   Great thread. One that will likely hold my interest. 

Thank you.
 
I know many have said it is not reasonable to compare headphones to speakers, but I would disagree. One is usually an alternative to the other for most. My interest is more centered around how many may actually prefer headphone listening (as it appears you do).

 

[zazex]

I like both, but lean towards headphones. About 70-30. 
 
Whether I listen to spkrs or headphones also depends on the type of music, who's around,
what I'm doing, and other factors.  For example, when I'm working with tools in my shop
I go for speakers; headphone cords are too much of a safety hazard.  When there are
guests over, obviously it would be weird to be listening to headphones under any usual
circumstances. Etc.

 

[russdenney]

  I like both, but lean towards headphones. About 70-30. 
 
Whether I listen to spkrs or headphones also depends on the type of music, who's around,
what I'm doing, and other factors.  For example, when I'm working with tools in my shop
I go for speakers; headphone cords are too much of a safety hazard.  When there are
guests over, obviously it would be weird to be listening to headphones under any usual
circumstances. Etc.

 
I have to agree with the type of music comment. There does seem to be certain genres where headphones are less inept (for lack of a better phrase). In some cases, I might even agree to the fact the certain music types sound as good on headphones as speakers - but never better. Again, for me, it is spatial sound issue.

 

[TWerk]

I prefer headphones.
 
I like the isolation of headphones - it's just you and the music, and with speakers - you don't have that isolation obviously.
 
Also, it's easier to try out different sound signatures with headphones and cheap/easy to buy/sell/ship them.
 
Also - Many of my headphones are so comfortable to wear, I actually enjoy the way they feel when they're on my head.
 
Kind of like some warm earmuffs or comfy PJ's.
 
I like to listen to everything with headphones when I can without disturbing others or having others hear what I'm listening to,
which goes along with isolation.
 
Lastly - the space requirement. I can have many headphones and they can all stay in my room - to have a speaker setup
takes up a lot of space/room.

 

[TWerk]

Also - I like to walk around with sound - with speakers, you need to be in the room. Headphones stay on your head and so you have mobility with your music/ whatever you listen to.
 
I'd probably like some good speakers a lot (actually) but it's something I've managed to stay away from. I've never really heard a really good home speaker set up, so maybe that's why. Headphones keep me busy enough for now.

 

[russdenney]

  I prefer headphones.
 
I like the isolation of headphones - it's just you and the music, and with speakers - you don't have that isolation obviously.
 
Also, it's easier to try out different sound signatures with headphones and cheap/easy to buy/sell/ship them.
 
Also - Many of my headphones are so comfortable to wear, I actually enjoy the way they feel when they're on my head.
 
Kind of like some warm earmuffs or comfy PJ's.
 
I like to listen to everything with headphones when I can without disturbing others or having others hear what I'm listening to,
which goes along with isolation.
 
Lastly - the space requirement. I can have many headphones and they can all stay in my room - to have a speaker setup
takes up a lot of space/room.

Good point indeed.
 
I was surprised when I saw one of the videos of a Head-Fi get together. People had dozens of different cans...I didn't realize there was such a niche audiophile market dedicated to headphones.
 
LOL on the comfy PJs comment...

 

[TWerk]

  Good point indeed.
 
I was surprised when I saw one of the videos of a Head-Fi get together. People had dozens of different cans...I didn't realize there was such a niche audiophile market dedicated to headphones.
 
LOL on the comfy PJs comment...

Haha once you start to accumulate dozens of headphones you reach a new problem as it is no longer so space efficient anymore!

 

[exsomnis]

Very well said in every regard.

I struggle with the closed in sound of headphones - even my open back HD800S.

That is the thing though, isn't it. For all the expanded soundstage qualities of cans like the HD800s, no headphone can yet properly do what speakers can achieve easily. The best we can hope for with headphones is that more music is recorded binaurally.

It's to the point that I've given to backing the Ossic 3D headphones Kickstarter project...just to see how that turns out. Who knows, someone might come up with a proper solution one day.

 

[TWerk]

That is the thing though, isn't it. For all the expanded soundstage qualities of cans like the HD800s, no headphone can yet properly do what speakers can achieve easily. The best we can hope for with headphones is that more music is recorded binaurally.

It's to the point that I've given to backing the Ossic 3D headphones Kickstarter project...just to see how that turns out. Who knows, someone might come up with a proper solution one day.

 
Just looked into this - seems very interesting. Wonder if it will be gimmicky in the end, or really something enjoyable and unique.
 
Seems like they're most interested to use it in gaming.
 
I guess we will see, right?

 

[WB2016]

This is very true. The 10 most expensive/best headphones in the world can out perform any affordable speaker for sheer sound quality.
 
Headphones such as Fostex TH900/Denon AH-D5000/7000 or Sennheiser HD800/700/650/600 or any of the high end planar's are equivalent to the sound quality of a  multi thousand dollar speaker system.
 
For other obvious reasons though - speakers and headphones shouldn't really be compared.

 


That is quite true. There used to be a ball park figure that you needed about 8-10x more for a speaker to reach the level of headphone in the audio install industry. This is actually a decent figure, when you get to the top tier equipment, especially in bigger rooms. We are talking not just purchase price but especially fixing issues with the room, room treatment, professional acoustic measurements, etc. speaker placement, power conditioning, real hifi cables per meter, much higher amplification needs, professional racks, equipment isolation, etc. etc. This figure in reality with wives who like a lot of marble and glass has been quite accurate in my experience

Few people often listen to music really critically, most of the time. Speakers give you that specific bass impact and stage, but in pure musical quality, you would be hard pressed to find something similar speaker wise to a good headphone setup. You can see this if you do professional room measurements or have the benefit of doing A/B listening with headphones from the same locations. Usually there are quite some flaws with almost all speaker setups but you quicklylearn to ignore them. Then you have listening fun most of the time

The rest applies, headphones in most circumstances are more convenient.

For critical listening and while playing with the turntables while standing I prefer the headphones a lot, even over equal music quality speakers

The only speaker systems that truely blew away headphones, were all over 400K GBP, so even with the Orpheus 2 that figure might hold. Really curious to hear them at the Munich Highend this year.

Cheers WB

 

[M Coupe]

I think the headphone/2 channel gear can co-exist quite happily as it does for me.  I am using Revel Studios through some great front-end/amplification gear and it is my absolute preference.  That being said, I know most folks want to have great sound on a smaller budget.  You can certainly do that with a much smaller headphone budget.   You won't get a 1/50th the sound stage of a good 2 channel setup even from the likes of the HD800 but really it is all relative.
 
One thought for those that have chosen iems/phones over a proper 2 channel stereo, is that it can be done on a smaller budget than you might think.  The argument that you have to own an island to compare to headphones in fidelity is nonsense.  As two examples among many;
1.  KEF LS50- Can be had new for 1500.00 or refurbished/open box for 1200.00.  These monitors are Stereophile Class A.  This inexepensive monitor is in the same category as the $200k+  Wilson speakers.
 
2.  Look at the Klang & Ton NADA.  You can buy the drivers/assembled crossover kit on Madisound for 1800.00 which includes Scanspeak illuminator drivers with a BE tweeter and premium Mundorf caps in the crossover.  Then have Taylor speakers build the cabinet and assemble for another grand.  Now you have a kit that has the drivers and crossovers found in crazy expensive speakers.  I have heard them and they are incredible.
 
My point is not to endorse gear but to say that it does not have to be an either/or.  You can have both!

 

[WB2016]

I think the headphone/2 channel gear can co-exist quite happily as it does for me.  I am using Revel Studios through some great front-end/amplification gear and it is my absolute preference.  That being said, I know most folks want to have great sound on a smaller budget.  You can certainly do that with a much smaller headphone budget.   You won't get a 1/50th the sound stage of a good 2 channel setup even from the likes of the HD800 but really it is all relative.


 


One thought for those that have chosen iems/phones over a proper 2 channel stereo, is that it can be done on a smaller budget than you might think.  The argument that you have to own an island to compare to headphones in fidelity is nonsense.  As two examples among many;


1.  KEF LS50- Can be had new for 1500.00 or refurbished/open box for 1200.00.  These monitors are Stereophile Class A.  This inexepensive monitor is in the same category as the $200k+  Wilson speakers.


 


2.  Look at the Klang & Ton NADA.  You can buy the drivers/assembled crossover kit on Madisound for 1800.00 which includes Scanspeak illuminator drivers with a BE tweeter and premium Mundorf caps in the crossover.  Then have Taylor speakers build the cabinet and assemble for another grand.  Now you have a kit that has the drivers and crossovers found in crazy expensive speakers.  I have heard them and they are incredible.


 


My point is not to endorse gear but to say that it does not have to be an either/or.  You can have both!

 


Like the KEF kit, had a R700, the LS50 is a good little monitor, especially for the price, but I would not put it in anywhere the same class as a Wilson XLF (I assume). Also it does not really cover lows very well, obviously around 65hz and above. (But I admit I am quite bias towards small speakers. Never understood why one would want a bookshelf speaker on a stand???? instead of a full size)

You can definitely go good audio with speakers for relatively little cash. But if you want to really go high end then speakers will require a lot, lot more money than headphones.

For that reason I like having more of a fun system for speakers. Something you can see films with, have friends over, have a party, a romantic mood, good highs and lows, something that can be on in the background and not over power, but also very energetic if needed, with good PRAT. Neutrality I don't give a fig about for my speaker system at home. If I want serious or focused listening I more often than not and try to go with headphones. But if you want good quality also in your speakers and the room is not very big the above examples are a very good and afordable choice. The Kland und Ton are quite nice, but again when I want speakers it should sound big with a good and low bass slam, that is really not cheaply done in speakers. You need size and amplification to do 20hz right, or a seprate sub will work OK.

Again, that's just me and its interesting to see how there are different strokes for different folks, but I also think having some good gear suggested is always a bonus

Cheers
WB