[winders]

This is the answer I expected. Why? Because it makes sense. Building shipping charges into the upgrade cost would make upgrades more expensive from some than they should be. 

 

[Leigh]

  OK, I did.  These are the responses....

For what it's worth, I just got the multibit upgrade (and usb2) on my Buber and my receipt looked like this:
 

	Name​	Qty​	Price​	Item Total​
	Bifrost Multibit	1​	$250.00​	$250.00​
	USB Gen 2 Installation: Installed by Schiit	1​	$100.00​	$100.00​
	Subtotal​	$350.00​
	Shipping: FedEx Home Delivery​	$19.75​
	Total​	$369.75​

 
I'm pretty sure there wasn't an Amazon-like "Free shipping" option.

 

[ilcg1]

@ilcg1
, I apologize for giving you incorrect information...

Accepted.

 

[gvl2016]

   
A wallwart is just that, funnily Bimby doesn't run off a $2 wallwart as you noticed and yes I've done my homework fueling mimby off a way overkill 900g 2A 16VAC PSU. Ludicrous SQ improvement, rest assured that Mimby's utterly cripped by its el cheapo phone charger so comparing it to Bimby is as much of an apple/orange comparison as it gets as long as you run it off its stock wallwart IME.

 
Mimby's adapter outputs AC, in other words it is just a transformer. If someone wants to shell out $$$ for thicker copper wire they can go ahead but you won't be able to bypass the built-in AC->DC conversion circuitry anyway. 8W rated power handling on the transformer seems awfully adequate for a device like mimby. I suppose you can try feeding mimby with DC, not sure if this is a good idea tho, perhaps the designers can comment.

 

[bigro]

  You are essentially comparing a piece of hardware to a subscription service, which is not a like to like comparison. From that perspective, comparing Tidal to Starbucks is not a bad comparison. Very different things, but similar in the sense that both are consumables that must be purchased over and over again. Hardware is completely different.
 
I understand that from your perspective, the dolby upgrades of the world have consumers upgrading their hardware on almost a subscription type basis anyways, so why not make that comparison? But when I watched a video of you talking about that, you weren't so hot on having to suck up to dolby, were you? But that's essentially what you're saying here. You want someone to buy a product and continually send it to you for upgrades ($). Of course nobody wants you to stop making products or upgrades, we all want bigger and better and faster!
 
But the real reason that the bifrost makes sense from schiit's perspective, is that it keeps the money in house. If you buy a modi multibit and you sell it to later buy something else from schiit, some of the money changing hands hasn't been given to schiit. If you buy a bifrost and continually upgrade it, the only entity you give money to is schiit. The only benefit to schiit of going the modi route is that it's maybe another piece of schiit hardware in the hands of a consumer, improving brand recognition and loyalty.
 
So I understand. And I understand that the bifrost will one day be capable of sound far better than the mimby. But not only is the mimby still a better buy for the consumer, but we as the consumer are not guaranteed a single penny of extra worth of the bifrost. You say you will come out with these upgrades, and you almost certainly will, but we are not guaranteed that. Again, strictly from a business perspective, you always have to evaluate your upgrade paths. You have to take all these things into consideration.
 
So in my opinion, the only people that should buy bifrosts are people who will definitely want to upgrade later, do not plan on moving up to another schiit dac (gumby/yggy/future dac), and most importantly, are schiit fanboys who want to make sure that schiit makes as much money off of them as possible. Undoubtedly many will fall into this last category, but for most of us who like schiit purely on a value of their products basis, the mimby is such a better buy that the bifrost is entirely out of the question. 

You can use an original Bifrost with a brand new Transport and Amp or a 25 year old Amp with a 10 year Old Transport while using the first Bifrost with no upgrades.Sorry I fail to see how this is the same as with Dolby. As something even 5 years old may or may not work with the latest and greatest butif it does you lose functionality or features of the new gear. Their track record speak for itself On the Upgrades,  They Don't have to but they say they will and they do. Tech gets better they learn more and they make stuff to sell. It's they way they keep food on the table and roofs over their heads and their employees. They are a Business, they make money, Who does not?  The Bifrost 4490 is cheaper that the previous Gen Uber because Production costs came down and they lowered the price. They also could have not released the Mimby and Kept making Money on the Bimby because at that point is was practically the Lowest Cost MB dac out there.
 
Signed the Schiit Fan boy who would prefer to support the company that build great products, follows through on the promise to upgrade, honors warranties, supports their local businesses by sourcing from them, and support their neighbors by building stateside and employing them and passes production savings to the customer. Hmm I guess I may be An Obsolete Customer If I value those things.

 

[leeperry]

   
Mimby's adapter outputs AC, in other words it is just a transformer. If someone wants to shell out $$$ for thicker copper wire they can go ahead but you won't be able to bypass the built-in AC->DC conversion circuitry anyway. 8W rated power handling on the transformer seems awfully adequate for a device like mimby.

In other words you are giving us a broscience lecture on audio gear you haven't heard yourself, hats off 

 

 

[gvl2016]

  In other words you are giving us a broscience lecture on audio gear you haven't heard yourself, hats off 

 

 
A bare transformer doesn't exactly qualify as audio gear, and you can't hear a transformer anyway, unless you're talking about its hum.

 

[Jimster480]

  In other words you are giving us a broscience lecture on audio gear you haven't heard yourself, hats off 

 

Not really,
He is just explaining facts.
 
AC->DC is done inside the unit

 

[maxh22]

You can use an original Bifrost with a brand new Transport and Amp or a 25 year old Amp with a 10 year Old Transport while using the first Bifrost with no upgrades.Sorry I fail to see how this is the same as with Dolby. As something even 5 years old may or may not work with the latest and greatest butif it does you lose functionality or features of the new gear. Their track record speak for itself On the Upgrades,  They Don't have to but they say they will and they do. Tech gets better they learn more and they make stuff to sell. It's they way they keep food on the table and roofs over their heads and their employees. They are a Business, they make money, Who does not?  The Bifrost 4490 is cheaper that the previous Gen Uber because Production costs came down and they lowered the price. They also could have not released the Mimby and Kept making Money on the Bimby because at that point is was practically the Lowest Cost MB dac out there.

Signed the Schiit Fan boy who would prefer to support the company that build great products, follows through on the promise to upgrade, honors warranties, supports their local businesses by sourcing from them, and support their neighbors by building stateside and employing them and passes production savings to the customer. Hmm I guess I may be An Obsolete Customer If I value those things.

Schiit is making the audio world great again! I'm sure Donald would be very proud of Schiit, maybe someone should tell him about schiit so he could make a public endorsement as he did with other companies.

 

[leeperry]

so many EE's in here, I'm floored ^^
 
breaking news, all AC trannies aren't born equal: https://community.openenergymonitor.org/t/about-wave-distortion-of-an-ac-ac-adapter/1532/6
 
Wyrd also drastically benefited from a twice bigger wallwart for that matter but Regen Amber still killed it, c'est la vie. It wasn't the smartest move to fuel its USB repeater chip off bus-power, Regen doesn't do that mistake.

 

[Jimster480]

 
You can use an original Bifrost with a brand new Transport and Amp or a 25 year old Amp with a 10 year Old Transport while using the first Bifrost with no upgrades.Sorry I fail to see how this is the same as with Dolby. As something even 5 years old may or may not work with the latest and greatest butif it does you lose functionality or features of the new gear. Their track record speak for itself On the Upgrades,  They Don't have to but they say they will and they do. Tech gets better they learn more and they make stuff to sell. It's they way they keep food on the table and roofs over their heads and their employees. They are a Business, they make money, Who does not?  The Bifrost 4490 is cheaper that the previous Gen Uber because Production costs came down and they lowered the price. They also could have not released the Mimby and Kept making Money on the Bimby because at that point is was practically the Lowest Cost MB dac out there.
 
Signed the Schiit Fan boy who would prefer to support the company that build great products, follows through on the promise to upgrade, honors warranties, supports their local businesses by sourcing from them, and support their neighbors by building stateside and employing them and passes production savings to the customer. Hmm I guess I may be An Obsolete Customer If I value those things.

I understand both points but I feel the same way as the first guy.
 
I would rather sell my DAC later on (or add and just get another one) vs send my old one back for upgrades because I am essentially throwing away cash.
 
It would make more sense even to sell your entire bifrost and buy a new one again with multibit considering the very good resale prices than to mail it back and upgrade it.
 
I guess it really depends on how adept you are at selling things, for me I usually get most of my money back when I sell my stuff as I take impeccable care of it and understand how to market the stuff that I have to sell.

 

[gvl2016]

  so many EE's in here, I'm floored ^^
 
breaking news, all AC trannies aren't born equal: https://community.openenergymonitor.org/t/about-wave-distortion-of-an-ac-ac-adapter/1532/6
 
 

 
Huh? Feeding a modified sine wave into a transformer? What does it have to do with this discussion? Unless of course you think powering a DAC from UPS is a good idea.

 

[jimmers]

  so many EE's in here, I'm floored ^^
 
breaking news, all AC trannies aren't born equal: https://community.openenergymonitor.org/t/about-wave-distortion-of-an-ac-ac-adapter/1532/6
 

Especially love this:
 
"Interestingly, the transformer seems to be able to predict the future too! Note how the Red trace starts heading towards 0V before the Yellow trace."
 
Truly inspirational, perhaps with the right transformer we will be able to pick winning lottery numbers.

 
 
If I want to use the "100W 240V outlet in the boot of my Toyota" to power a Mimby I will revisit the post.

 

[ilcg1]

Deleted

 

[Baldr]

Audio is and has been a great pastime.

 
I understand both points but I feel the same way as the first guy.
 
I would rather sell my DAC later on (or add and just get another one) vs send my old one back for upgrades because I am essentially throwing away cash.
 
It would make more sense even to sell your entire bifrost and buy a new one again with multibit considering the very good resale prices than to mail it back and upgrade it.
 
I guess it really depends on how adept you are at selling things, for me I usually get most of my money back when I sell my stuff as I take impeccable care of it and understand how to market the stuff that I have to sell.

Have it your way!
 

Schiit is making the audio world great again! I'm sure Donald would be very proud of Schiit, maybe someone should tell him about schiit so he could make a public endorsement as he did with other companies.

Audio is and has always been a great pastime!