GUSTARD H10 High-current Discrete Class A output Stage Headphone Amplifier
Jun 4, 2016 at 5:25 PM Post #5,041 of 5,553
   
 
@zilch0md I had the same initial impressions. Bursons to me had the nice sparkly treble which make the sparkos sound rolled off in comparison. but the overall presentation was a lot more organic and balanced. So i don't actually miss the sparkly highs anymore. 

 
Hi zachO,
 
Actually, now that they have had a few hours of burn-in, and I've spent some time swapping back and forth between the Burson V5 Dual and the Sparkos SS3602 - back and forth - back and forth - with several favorite tracks, the differences between them are shrinking (compared to what I heard when the Sparkos were new.)
 
Again, this might still be premature, as they could still be settling in, but at this point, the greatest distinction is that the Sparkos are more dynamic - punchier.  Next in line for magnitude of distinction would be the Sparkos having a wee bit more bass energy, which is really welcome with both the HD800 and the DT880 600 Ohm.  These differences are so subtle that they wouldn't rule out using the the SS3602 with a bass-heavy headphone.  My LCD-2 isn't turned into a boombox.  :)
 
Regarding the treble differences, I am beginning to think the Sparkos isn't so much rolled off as it is simply smoother, yet still every bit as detailed - a remarkable feat.  When I listen to Eva Cassidy's "Blues In The Night," for example, her most shrill high notes are completely, utterly sweet with the Sparkos, despite the HD800's 6kHz spike, and all the while, the cymbal brushes stay just as nicely defined as with the Burson V5s.  Switching back to the V5s, Eva's siren blasts are immediately noticeable as being almost grainy - they have always been easier to enjoy with my LCD-2, but only by nature of the LCD-2's shelved highs. Now, with the Sparkos SS3602, my HD800 have none of that brittle edginess, and the DT880 600 is smoother still.  If I could marry the DT880 treble with the HD800 mid and bass, I wouldn't need the Sparkos SS3602.  As is, I'm really happy with what the Sparkos do for the HD800 treble.  And again, the detail is there - just not as "crystalline" as the Burson V5.  It's not as if the Sparkos lacks sparkle - it's more like the sparkle is just more palatable.
 
Again, it might be too early yet, but I've put the lid on my PB2 for the first time in several weeks (which is a nice perk).
 

 
 

 
 

 
As you can see in these photos, the SS3602 don't actually sit fully down into the PB2's sockets.  The gain jumpers and battery pack are just too close to the sockets for the SS3602, and if I insert a DIP8 extender under each op-amp, they will sit squarely, but then they are too high to put the lid back on - as with the Burson V5.  
 
tongue.gif

 
Fortunately, the pins are long enough that I'm getting a good connection, electrically, and they show no signs of coming loose when I shake the amp vigorously.  On the subject of the SS3602's pins, I've not measured them with a micrometer, but it's easy to tell that they are skinnier than any other DIP8 pins I've seen on other op-amps. Their diameter being less, I have some DIP8 extenders in which they have hardly any "grip" at all.  Sparkos Labs includes a DIP8 extender with each op-amp, that looks like this:
 

 
The spring clips do a great job of gripping the Sparkos pins - better than the extenders that have round holes on top - but, in my case, I can't use either style (not without leaving the lid off my case.)
 
 
Again, it might be too early yet, but as I write this, for my gear and my tastes, I prefer the Sparkos SS3602 to the Burson V5 Dual, but it's a very close race. I have several lesser op-amps that exhibit a much greater difference in performance.  In other words, the Sparkos SS3602 has taken things from maybe 95% to 97% of perfection. (Or maybe it's 92% to 94% - who knows where perfection is?)
 
At this point, I'm really glad I bought them, but I wouldn't feel right encouraging someone to replace Burson V5s they already own. That's my thinking, with my gear.  YMMV.  I do, however, feel comfortable advising anyone who has neither, to get the Sparkos SS3601 or SS3602 (single or dual).  It's rated to handle up to 22V, and will probably run a lot cooler, given its open construction. (It's not embalmed in a foam-filled red plastic coffin.) 
 
biggrin.gif

 
I forgot to mention, too, that the Sparkos SS3602 has a little more gain than the Burson V5 Dual.  I match the volume of components when testing. I use an inexpensive Scosche SPL Meter inserted between the headphone pads at rest on the table top, while playing a white noise file, to adjust to the volume to 85 dB. I put transparent tape around the volume knob, then mark both positions with a fine point marker - on the tape. This ensures that I'm not giving one component a volume advantage over the other.  
 
 
http://sparkoslabs.com/discrete-op-amps/
 
http://sparkoslabs.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/SS3601_SS3602.pdf
 
More later, especially if the sound changes...
 
Mike
 
Jun 4, 2016 at 5:33 PM Post #5,042 of 5,553
   
Hi zachO,
 
Actually, now that they have had a few hours of burn-in, and I've spent some time swapping back and forth between the Burson V5 Dual and the Sparkos SS3602 - back and forth - back and forth - with several favorite tracks, the differences between them are shrinking (compared to what I heard when the Sparkos were new.)
 
Again, this might still be premature, as they could still be settling in, but at this point, the greatest distinction is that the Sparkos are more dynamic - punchier.  Next in line for magnitude of distinction would be the Sparkos having a wee bit more bass energy, which is really welcome with both the HD800 and the DT880 600 Ohm.  These differences are so subtle that they wouldn't rule out using the the SS3602 with a bass-heavy headphone.  My LCD-2 likes isn't turned into a boombox.  :)
 
Regarding the treble differences, I am beginning to think the Sparkos isn't so much rolled off as it is simply smoother, yet still every bit as detailed - a remarkable feat.  When I listen to Eva Cassidy's "Blues In The Night," for example, her most shrill high notes are completely, utterly sweet with the Sparkos, despite the HD800's 6kHz spike, and all the while, the cymbal brushes stay just as nicely defined as with the Burson V5s.  Switching back to the V5s, Eva's siren blasts are immediately noticeable as being almost grainy - they have always been easier to enjoy with my LCD-2, but only by nature of the LCD-2's shelved highs. Now, with the Sparkos SS3602, my HD800 have none of that brittle edginess, and the DT880 600 is smoother still.  If I could marry the DT880 treble with the HD800 mid and bass, I wouldn't need the Sparkos SS3602.  As is, I'm really happy with what the Sparkos do for the HD800 treble.  And again, the detail is there - just not as "crystalline" as the Burson V5.  It's not as if the Sparkos lacks sparkle - it's more like the sparkle is just more palatable.
 
Again, it might be too early yet, but I've put the lid on my PB2 for the first time in several weeks (which is a nice perk).
 

 
 

 
 

 
As you can see in these photos, the SS3602 don't actually sit fully down into the PB2's sockets.  The gain jumpers and battery pack are just too close to the sockets for the SS3602, and if I insert a DIP8 extender under each op-amp, they will sit squarely, but then they are too high to put the lid back on - as with the Burson V5.  
 
tongue.gif

 
Fortunately, the pins are long enough that I'm getting a good connection, electrically, and they show no signs of coming loose when I shake the amp vigorously.  On the subject of the SS3602's pins, I've not measured them with a micrometer, but it's easy to tell that they are skinnier than any other DIP8 pins I've seen on other op-amps. Their diameter being less, I have some DIP8 extenders in which they have hardly any "grip" at all.  Sparkos Labs includes a DIP8 extender with each op-amp, that looks like this:
 

 
The spring clips do a great job of gripping the Sparkos pins - better than the extenders that have round holes on top - but, in my case, I can't use either style (not without leaving the lid off my case.)
 
 
Again, it might be too early yet, but as I write this, for my gear and my tastes, I prefer the Sparkos SS3602 to the Burson V5 Dual, but it's a very close race. I have several lesser op-amps that exhibit a much greater difference in performance.  In other words, the Sparkos SS3602 has taken things from maybe 95% to 97% of perfection. (Or maybe it's 92% to 94% - who knows where perfection is?)
 
At this point, I'm really glad I bought them, but I wouldn't feel right encouraging someone to replace Burson V5s they already own. That's my thinking, with my gear.  YMMV.  I do, however, feel comfortable advising anyone who has neither, to get the Sparkos SS3601 or SS3602 (single or dual).  It's rated to handle up to 22V, and will probably run a lot cooler, given its open construction. (It's not embalmed in a foam-filled red plastic coffin.)
 
biggrin.gif

 
More later, especially if the sound changes...
 
Mike

Wonderful to hear Mike. For me it's easy to recommend the Sparko's to those who have been experiencing melting V5's. Simply because you end up spending more time listening and enjoying your music and equipment than replacing melted opamps. It truly frustrated me to no end. At the end of the day, I can't fault burson's sound quality and it's a matter of personal preference which one you'd go for. Sparkos are definitely more solid and have a smoother presentation. Burson's are more sparkly in the top end. But again, if you've replaced your melted burson's with more melted burson's, I strongly suggest giving the sparkos a chance. 
 
Jun 4, 2016 at 7:25 PM Post #5,045 of 5,553
I am a fan of Burson's SS op-amps.  I own versions 1,2 and 4.  I have to say that I think the cover on the V5 is a poor design.  All the op-amps I have get pretty hot when installed in a class A amplifier.  I don't believe the V5's melting is caused by the H10's internal heat but due to the heat of the covered V5 itself.  It makes me wonder what is under the red cover?  If amplifier ,op-amp or any kind of heat is the problem, why not sell the V5 without the cover?
 
Jun 4, 2016 at 10:11 PM Post #5,047 of 5,553
...
 
Jun 4, 2016 at 10:16 PM Post #5,048 of 5,553
Hi zachO,

Actually, now that they have had a few hours of burn-in, and I've spent some time swapping back and forth between the Burson V5 Dual and the Sparkos SS3602 - back and forth - back and forth - with several favorite tracks, the differences between them are shrinking (compared to what I heard when the Sparkos were new.)

Again, this might still be premature, as they could still be settling in, but at this point, the greatest distinction is that the Sparkos are more dynamic - punchier.  Next in line for magnitude of distinction would be the Sparkos having a wee bit more bass energy, which is really welcome with both the HD800 and the DT880 600 Ohm.  These differences are so subtle that they wouldn't rule out using the the SS3602 with a bass-heavy headphone.  My LCD-2 isn't turned into a boombox.  :)

Regarding the treble differences, I am beginning to think the Sparkos isn't so much rolled off as it is simply smoother, yet still every bit as detailed - a remarkable feat.  When I listen to Eva Cassidy's "Blues In The Night," for example, her most shrill high notes are completely, utterly sweet with the Sparkos, despite the HD800's 6kHz spike, and all the while, the cymbal brushes stay just as nicely defined as with the Burson V5s.  Switching back to the V5s, Eva's siren blasts are immediately noticeable as being almost grainy - they have always been easier to enjoy with my LCD-2, but only by nature of the LCD-2's shelved highs. Now, with the Sparkos SS3602, my HD800 have none of that brittle edginess, and the DT880 600 is smoother still.  If I could marry the DT880 treble with the HD800 mid and bass, I wouldn't need the Sparkos SS3602.  As is, I'm really happy with what the Sparkos do for the HD800 treble.  And again, the detail is there - just not as "crystalline" as the Burson V5.  It's not as if the Sparkos lacks sparkle - it's more like the sparkle is just more palatable.

Again, it might be too early yet, but I've put the lid on my PB2 for the first time in several weeks (which is a nice perk).












As you can see in these photos, the SS3602 don't actually sit fully down into the PB2's sockets.  The gain jumpers and battery pack are just too close to the sockets for the SS3602, and if I insert a DIP8 extender under each op-amp, they will sit squarely, but then they are too high to put the lid back on - as with the Burson V5.  

:p

Fortunately, the pins are long enough that I'm getting a good connection, electrically, and they show no signs of coming loose when I shake the amp vigorously.  On the subject of the SS3602's pins, I've not measured them with a micrometer, but it's easy to tell that they are skinnier than any other DIP8 pins I've seen on other op-amps. Their diameter being less, I have some DIP8 extenders in which they have hardly any "grip" at all.  Sparkos Labs includes a DIP8 extender with each op-amp, that looks like this:




The spring clips do a great job of gripping the Sparkos pins - better than the extenders that have round holes on top - but, in my case, I can't use either style (not without leaving the lid off my case.)


Again, it might be too early yet, but as I write this, for my gear and my tastes, I prefer the Sparkos SS3602 to the Burson V5 Dual, but it's a very close race. I have several lesser op-amps that exhibit a much greater difference in performance.  In other words, the Sparkos SS3602 has taken things from maybe 95% to 97% of perfection. (Or maybe it's 92% to 94% - who knows where perfection is?)

At this point, I'm really glad I bought them, but I wouldn't feel right encouraging someone to replace Burson V5s they already own. That's my thinking, with my gear.  YMMV.  I do, however, feel comfortable advising anyone who has neither, to get the Sparkos SS3601 or SS3602 (single or dual).  It's rated to handle up to 22V, and will probably run a lot cooler, given its open construction. (It's not embalmed in a foam-filled red plastic coffin.) 

:D

I forgot to mention, too, that the Sparkos SS3602 has a little more gain than the Burson V5 Dual.  I match the volume of components when testing. I use an inexpensive Scosche SPL Meter inserted between the headphone pads at rest on the table top, while playing a white noise file, to adjust to the volume to 85 dB. I put transparent tape around the volume knob, then mark both positions with a fine point marker - on the tape. This ensures that I'm not giving one component a volume advantage over the other.  


http://sparkoslabs.com/discrete-op-amps/

http://sparkoslabs.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/SS3601_SS3602.pdf

More later, especially if the sound changes...

Mike

Thanks for the feedback on the Sparkos guys. Much appreciated.
 
Jun 5, 2016 at 9:59 AM Post #5,049 of 5,553
  I am a fan of Burson's SS op-amps.  I own versions 1,2 and 4.  I have to say that I think the cover on the V5 is a poor design.  All the op-amps I have get pretty hot when installed in a class A amplifier.  I don't believe the V5's melting is caused by the H10's internal heat but due to the heat of the covered V5 itself.  It makes me wonder what is under the red cover?  If amplifier ,op-amp or any kind of heat is the problem, why not sell the V5 without the cover?


That's also what I am thinking. What purpuse/function does the cover have, except preventing physical damage? Can the V5 be used without the cover?
 
Jun 5, 2016 at 2:11 PM Post #5,051 of 5,553
 
That's also what I am thinking. What purpuse/function does the cover have, except preventing physical damage? Can the V5 be used without the cover?

 
Bumping my earlier post, the H10 would likely run much cooler with a couple of these large, $13.50 heat sinks resting on top of the closed case:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/735828/gustard-h10-high-current-discrete-class-a-output-stage-headphone-amplifier/4980#post_12601242
 
Jun 5, 2016 at 4:43 PM Post #5,052 of 5,553
Bumping my earlier post, the H10 would likely run much cooler with a couple of these large, $13.50 heat sinks resting on top of the closed case:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/735828/gustard-h10-high-current-discrete-class-a-output-stage-headphone-amplifier/4980#post_12601242


The H10 can handle all that heat plus the extra coming from any op-amps installed. I run mine with the V4, closed case for over a day before with no problems. The problem here is the V5, the red cover and yellow stuff inside that melts.
 
Jun 5, 2016 at 5:27 PM Post #5,053 of 5,553
HI guys.  I hate to say it, but the SS3601 are not compatible with the Gustard Amplifier.  Its about the only piece of gear that it just doesnt work in.  Im not sure why, as I have never saw a schematic of the Gustard.  It seems like it is a closely guarded secret.  
 
Jun 5, 2016 at 6:38 PM Post #5,054 of 5,553
  HI guys.  I hate to say it, but the SS3601 are not compatible with the Gustard Amplifier.  Its about the only piece of gear that it just doesnt work in.  Im not sure why, as I have never saw a schematic of the Gustard.  It seems like it is a closely guarded secret.  

 
Thanks for the warning!  
beerchug.gif
 
Can we assume the SS3602 (duals) are compatible with the H10, even though the SS3601 (singles) are not?
 
Mike
 
Jun 5, 2016 at 6:44 PM Post #5,055 of 5,553
The H10 can handle all that heat plus the extra coming from any op-amps installed. I run mine with the V4, closed case for over a day before with no problems. The problem here is the V5, the red cover and yellow stuff inside that melts.

 
Oh, I agree, completely.  
 
 
[snip]
 
[The SS3602 is] rated to handle up to 22V, and will probably run a lot cooler, given its open construction. (It's not embalmed in a foam-filled red plastic coffin.) 
 
[snip]
 
 

 
But for those who already have the V5 and like the sound, "enabling" the V5 by helping it to stay cool inside the H10 is certainly worth trying.
 

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