GTA meet 1/30/16
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Feb 1, 2016 at 10:10 AM Post #2 of 41

 
Enjoying the Audinst HUD-MX1 with unmodified AKG-K240s
 

 
Some of Pavel's superfine chord-ology.
 

 

 

 

 
Feelin' the heat! Pavel's handmade cans are in the foreground.
 

 
The bar doubled as a workbench.
 

 
Good company and amazing audio from the evangelists of team 3E-HA1!
 
And no, I have not modified my AKG's...yet.
 

 

 

 
Feb 1, 2016 at 8:39 PM Post #3 of 41
Thanks for posting the pics, Jerry (JrHam) and to meet a recording engineer with similar listening preferences. DISCLOSURE: I was there with a contingent with a prototype music server (the 3E black box) and
prototype 3E head-amp. It was good to see that the next generation of audiophiles full of energy and curiosity.

In Jerry's pics, Ray is the fella in the black top in the 3rd last pic of his set. Others may recall seeing some newbie carrying around a Timmy's cup
for pretty much the whole meet...ratio of cofee:water_refill was about 1:6. I came in from the back of the building from Yonge Street and met Pavel (pics 5 and 11 in collage, below) relaxing outside
after having set-up the tables and his gear(more later).

I normally take pictures of equipment but I was interested in talking to the attendees to find out what they looking for in a the way of a music server and better amplification. So with out further delay, here is a collage of most of the attendees from that day:


The collage photos are numbered upward starting from the top right edge and going clockwise. The numbering continues upwards by spiraling away from the edge toward the center. Enjoy. I also add in a higher rez version of this collage (5000 pixels across and 3.3MB file) later. Click above image for 1600x1200 rez.

I had interesting chat with Robin (pic 6 in collage) and how he finally settle down on his Audeze LCD-XC phones. The superb finish and heft gave you that Lexus on your head feeling and the sound did not disappoint when powered through his Audio-gd integrated DAC/HA setup. The back story about Robin hauling his gear down to Bay Bloor Radio and going through their headphone inventory to settle down on the Audeze reminded me of a time in the eighties when I hauled my turntable and NAD 3020 to stores to find my second pair of speakers (made by Camber). I pointed him to the 3E prototype (music server and head-amp) corner when he mentioned that all he wanted was a the same refinement he had when using his outboard Audio-gd DAC (s/pdif inputs and no USB input...model number unknown).

The next station I sat down at was Jerry's (on left in pic 3) Audinst HUD-MX1 with a David Bowie playlist already loaded and driving the AKG K-240...pretty sweet. In the November local meet in 2015 impression thread, I came across his enthusiasm, and that of the attendees, for this humble headphone. I have a pair of HD-424 (also from the eighties) and it served as my early reference until I could find a similar sounding pair of speakers. I also have a pair of AKG K-240. I was interested in how they sounded in comparison to the current headphones of favor (HiFiman, Audeze, Sennheisers, etc) that are much raved about. I found his system to be very neutral and revealing. No favors were given to poorer recordings and the good stuff sang.

In the back left corner of the room (from the main entrance OR pic 8) was a Bottlehead looking head-amp (I'm dating myself a decade back when they were all the rage) with a pair of Beyer headphones. From the name tags in other pics, the four fellas are Chris, Chris, Robin and ???. They had a pretty technical discussion (bordering on engineering) on the certain aspects of amplifier design.The setup had that tube warmth and body and a total lack of any digital glare or hardness. Definitely pleasant to listen to. I got the feeling that I could stick them on and not have the feeling of listening fatigue. Before I go on, I'll mention that at the TAVES 2016 audio show, There was one retailer with a lot of uber-end gear on display. It might have been the electrical grid but even the likes of the JPS Abyss powered by Woo amplification sounded unbalanced to me...maybe it was my high expectation and different listening preference. In general, I had a better impression, overall, of most of the setups from the weekend meet. To shorten this already long post, I'll just highlight some of pics.

Pic 1: I missed noticing that someone had setup a Cavalli based head-amp setup. That was unfortunate as Its reputation precedes it. Next time. Seems like Wilson is enjoying Chris's setup.

Pic 2: I missed the names and could not read the name tags of these two young fellas but I was dismayed when I could not recognize most artists on the their Samsung phone-based server into the Fiio amp.
They had a rotation of gear in there and at one point late in the afternoon I got to listen to a compact tubed based amp (previously raffled by Pavel at an earlier meet) driving the HE-400i.
It made one of Jerry's favorite cuts (Ray Price singing "For the Good Times)
feel as if I was sitting down by a nice warm fireplace with a scotch. Howard's golden ears picked up a little Essssing but again pretty enjoyable.

Pic 3: Collectively, Jerry and Howard must have twinned ears...they hear and describe the sonic signature of gear using very similar terms.

Pic 4 Jeff, Robin and Chris enjoying moments away from gear

Pic 5: Pavel talking with the Aaron who brung the HE-1000 phones. I missed my chance to hear them through familiar electronics :frowning2:

Pic 7: Better look at Pavel's setup with Chris giving it the thumbs-up. The setup was quite interesting. A S/PDIF signal to a Buffalo DAC with digital volume control feeding a fixed gain stage (7x amplification) headamp called the Dynalo. That DAC output signal was also fed two other amps with their own volume control. It got interesting when someone listening to the fix gain stage adjusted the volume and inadvertently altered the downstream amps (Bijou on left and Torpedo center). Good setup for shoot outs where you want to have an apples to apples comparison of gear. Back to the HD-800 and my first listen to these cans that serve as the reference for many. You cannot complain the build. The sound was great. The DAC was a Buffalo III with a 32 bit digital volume control as described to me by Pavel. I sort of understand the approach and that in theory, you could put attenuate a 0 dB Redbook signal by 96 dB and still have all the bits! On my short gut evaulation, the DAC and matching fix gain stage sounded grea on a female piano vocal by Mary Chapin Carpenter. It would be good for Pavel to explain his choice of coming into the DAC with a S/PDIF signal instead of via USB.

Pic 9: You might call this the "3E" corner. The two fellas on the left have done much of the voicing of the server and headamp. The sonics of the server have been quite stable for some time in terms of voicing and work is proceeding on finalizing the interface design. The headamp is a much latter development but will probably be the fastest to get to some production worthy state. I like to thanks all of those that provided feedback and time listening to the units with the favourite phones.

Pic 10: That's Jeff (aka Greyhorse) with the scarfed photographer. She was one of two girls at the meet.

Pic 11: The two cables guys (Pavel and Henry) and the photographer(???). At the time they had an interesting discussion as to why it is that "guys" outnumber women in certain creative endeavours. I had to draw the line when then grouped the activities of creating music and creating hardware under the same umbrella. Could it simply be, as someone put it, that "when boys outgrow their moms...they are seeking to woo a replacement their own age" :rolleyes: .It was interesting to see a soldering iron a stones throw away from the drinks and Timbits.

Pic 12: That's an obligatory shot of Nima who got there around 6pm when a lot of people had already left. Next time...come earlier. Timbits were still available.

Pic 14 : Jerry, Kim, Fiona and Taras. I made it a point to get Fiona into a shot (the second of two girls). She revealed that she was the one who pulled her male friend to the meet. Her requirements are a clean detailed mid-treble and a balanced bass.

One observation I had was the amazing number of people running the same music server software...aka as Foobar.

I apologize right up front for not talking to more people but I tend to just bump around like a pin-ball. I saw the HE-1000 and made a point to listen to them but they never made it onto my ears. The one saving grace was the little brother, HE-400, did :)

P.S. If you can identify yourselves in the photos, I'll replace the references to ??? with proper names. Ditto for the equipment references.
P.P.S. Came in to fix a few typos and noticed that certain keywords have been link to Amazon by a code robot created by Viglink...do not click...I do not support this type of behavior by Head-fi/Amazon. Sad Day. Keywords altered in this post are ( amp, DAC, headphone, Audeze, speakers, FiiO, and HE-400)

cheers,
Ray
 
Feb 3, 2016 at 8:25 AM Post #6 of 41
Great summary Ray. Thanks for the pictures. It was a blast hanging out with you.
...

Yeah...it was a bit like chewing the fat by the firepit.  I put "For the Good Times" on the big rig (speaker set-up) and it was not quite the same "fun" as someone put it when it came to that orthodynamic sound we had with the HE-400. Will try again today after it has had some time to warm up.  I found that my wife had a version of that song sung by an artist of that era with the initials DM.  I have a couple of articles for you about a local recording engineer named Peter Moore that I think you will enjoy. I will PM when I find them or put the link here later.
 
UPDATE:  Here is the link mentioned, above, to interesting article about sound recording engineer/mixer Peter Moore from "Sound on Sound" magazine title Cowboy Junkies 'Sweet Jane' .  It should be of interest to you as it Peter was one of rare people who spent time recording venues using a dummy head via the Ambisonic recording process targeted toward the headphone experience. The article mentions the early days of digital recording where equipment had to be hacked together.  The most interesting part is the use of the Calrec microphone used to make the Trinity Sessions recording and how the mixing was basically done on the spot by moving musicians back and forth during a song depending on whether they were playing a verse or not. There is a mention of Fostex which gave birth to MrSpeakers that are making the rounds.
 Don't worry I'll be bringing the HE-1000 again, and next time we'll make sure you get to audition them as much as you like

Thanks Zida/Aaron. 
 
I came across a comparison by Jerg of the HE-1000 and HD-800 in an earlier meet impressions thread that describe the HD-800 as a savant in certain genres of music and HE-1000 as more rounded performer for all genres.  The good thing is that my friends had a listen to it (HE-1000) on their prototype 3E headamp.  It has a reputation of needing a bit of voltage gain to deal with the lower sensitivity (3x voltage ~= 10x power == sounds twice as loud) . I remember asking you if I could move it over to that station and that I borrowed a balanced to single-ended cable from Henry to allow them to evaluate. Where else could we do that other than a local meet....thanks!
 
I did have an interesting talk with Pavel in his 20 minute session with the the headamp prototype. He loved the extended smooth "highs", thought the mids were bloomed up too much and that the bass was not at a level that he was accustom to. Forgot to ask him about which headphone he used but I think it was his reference HD-800.  Again, kudos to you all.
 
Feb 3, 2016 at 8:50 AM Post #7 of 41
It was a great meet, and the great thing is that on top of the "regulars', we are seeing more and more new faces.
 
The gear is great as always, and I get to learn something everytime.
 
Special shout-out to 3E, those plastic boxes were amazing, sounds phenomenal.  Now put it in a nice aluminum case and market that thing!  You owe the world this great amp.
 
Feb 3, 2016 at 10:36 AM Post #8 of 41
Definitely was a fun meet - I was only able to stay for 3 hours, but was itching to stay longer when I had to leave! Thanks again to Pavel for hosting - hosting duties are always under-appreciated, and it was good to see he was able to relax once the meet was going and have some good listening sessions.
 
Really liked listening to Chris' (@ChrisKTO) Cavalli Liquid Carbon. We both briefly compared the output to my Centrance HiFi-M8 (was not a perfect comparison as we didn't have a separate DAC so we were essentially using the DACs from his Fiio X5 / my iPhone 6S) but I think we both agreed we liked the sound of the Liquid Carbon better. With only a short listening session, I couldn't quite put my finger on why it was, just that I preferred the LC's sound.
 
Had a long, extremely helpful conversation with Julian about IEMs, and their place vs over-ear headphones (and open vs closed) based on our individual listening situations (ie. usually on the go, living situation, etc.). I was mentioning that now that I have my end-game over-the-ear headphone (MrSpeakers Ether C), the only other thing I want is a solid IEM for when I'm really on the go. He gave me some great insights into the balanced armature vs dynamic driver differences. Unfortunately I wasn't able to try his JH Roxannes, but another time! 
 
Also was able to have a good chat with Robin (@RobinK) comparing his LCD-XC's with my Ether C's. We both had good listening sessions with each, and our general impressions were that they were very similar, but both agreed that the base "quantity" was definitely higher in his LCD-XCs. Also a good discussion about his loudspeaker setup and his Salk speakers.
 
I wasn't able to hear @Zida's HE-1000 this time around, but got to hear it 2 meets ago. Maybe next time :)
 
Another great meet - hope to see everyone at the next one!
 
Feb 3, 2016 at 10:03 PM Post #9 of 41
I did enjoy listening to the 3E-HA1 and the chat with the designer.
 
The impression is correct - the highs are very detailed but not shrill, I thought the mids were blooming and overly pronounced and with a lacking bass. The headphones I used were the ones at the table, something not overly great. My reference isn't the HD800. I have the HD650 that I adore.
 
Feb 3, 2016 at 10:39 PM Post #11 of 41
It was a great meet, and the great thing is that on top of the "regulars', we are seeing more and more new faces.


 


The gear is great as always, and I get to learn something everytime.


 


Special shout-out to 3E, those plastic boxes were amazing, sounds phenomenal.  Now put it in a nice aluminum case and market that thing!  You owe the world this great amp.

 



Thanks "ambchang",
Me being a newbie I decided to have a look at your profile and I see that you have cycled through a lot of revered gear over the last few years. Many of them recognizable as respected names in the industry so I take your complement with some serious mojo !!!. I was wondering what headphones you tried. The one's at the station were the AKG K240 but did you try others. My intention before the meet was to try it with the HE-1000, HD-800 and Ether C ...all three were there at the get-together but I was tied up in trying them on the other setups....time flies when you're having fun.

Out of curiosity, would you mind naming your top three reference songs typically used to assess the gear and reach conclusions? Thanx.



Cheers...
 
Feb 3, 2016 at 11:12 PM Post #12 of 41
I did enjoy listening to the 3E-HA1 and the chat with the designer.


 


The impression is correct - the highs are very detailed but not shrill, I thought the mids were blooming and overly pronounced and with a lacking bass. The headphones I used were the ones at the table, something not overly great. My reference isn't the HD800. I have the HD650 that I adore.

 
 


Thanks. The phones on the table were most likely the AKG K240 (an open air design). I find them to be pretty neutral or as they said in my day "east coast sound" but I'm not the sort too pull out a Bach organ recital, either. It would have been interesting to have tried your reference HD-650 phones on the headamp but the need of balanced outputs probably made this a no go. Be good if someone else chimed in who went to the trouble of using adapters on single ended cables using those phones. Again, curious as to what reference cuts you were using ? Thanx in advance.



For those that had a chance to listen, are there some impressions of the Bijou amplifier? I'd really love to know how it stacks up against the others. :)
 



Your table had three amplifiers. I only listened to the one on the far right supporrting the Buffalo DAC. If that was the Bijou, it put a smile on my face when I listened to it using the Sennheiser phones. I think both the HD-650 and HD-800 were there. Someone probably took a picture of your setup...perhaps Jerry.
 
Feb 3, 2016 at 11:30 PM Post #13 of 41
I don't know if I would call the HD650 my "reference" headphones, but they really are my all time favourites that I've always had around. I don't know if I really have a reference headphone, but I guess the HD650 is as close to that as it comes.
 
The right side was the Buffalo 3 + Balanced Dynalo and that's my everyday main setup. :)
 
Feb 4, 2016 at 2:31 PM Post #14 of 41
 
  It was a great meet, and the great thing is that on top of the "regulars', we are seeing more and more new faces.
   
  The gear is great as always, and I get to learn something everytime.
   
  Special shout-out to 3E, those plastic boxes were amazing, sounds phenomenal.  Now put it in a nice aluminum case and market that thing!  You owe the world this great amp.

 



Thanks "ambchang",
Me being a newbie I decided to have a look at your profile and I see that you have cycled through a lot of revered gear over the last few years. Many of them recognizable as respected names in the industry so I take your complement with some serious mojo !!!. I was wondering what headphones you tried. The one's at the station were the AKG K240 but did you try others. My intention before the meet was to try it with the HE-1000, HD-800 and Ether C ...all three were there at the get-together but I was tied up in trying them on the other setups....time flies when you're having fun.

Out of curiosity, would you mind naming your top three reference songs typically used to assess the gear and reach conclusions? Thanx.



Cheers...

 
 
Please don't look at the gear, I cycle through things to try, and I usually look for used equipment that I can sell for without significant loss at a later time just to try things out.  Look at it more of a rental with a deposit way of me to look for things.
 
That said, I am pretty much settled on my gear, and the only two headphones I really want to go for are the Grado HP1000 (or anything with blackstar drivers, really), and the HE6.  The HE6  I can see myself getting in the future, but the HP1000 is just way out of reach.
 
I tried the HA-1 on the HE500, Ether C and LCD-XC, and I enjoyed the LCD-XC the most.  The details at the top were great, and it's funny because I actually have the opposite view as Pavel on the amp.  I find the highs too etchy, and the mids and lows just right.  As time goes on, I find out I am more of a mids guy (thus the HE500), and I am sure Pavel have different taste.  Given that you have two guys saying opposites about the amp, I can say that the amp pretty much nails it.
 
That said, I have tin ears, I readily admit to it.  I can tell the difference between a CMOY and a top of the line amp, but I can't tell differences between cables, power supplies or anything like that, so really, my input is of minimal value.
 
As for test tracks, I listen to a lot of rock, and ironically, most of the stuff is pretty poorly recorded.  I use Kid Rock stuff to test in ears precisely because it's so sibilant, I want to make sure I can actually listen to poorly recorded music for a long period of time.  For serious testing, I listen to Buena Vista Social Club a bit, some flaming lips, some Radiohead (later stuff), Eagles.
 
Feb 4, 2016 at 8:23 PM Post #15 of 41
 
 
Please don't look at the gear, I cycle through things to try,...
 


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I tried the HA-1 on the HE500, Ether C and LCD-XC, and I enjoyed the LCD-XC the most.  The details at the top were great, and it's funny because I actually have the opposite view as Pavel on the amp.  I find the highs too etchy, and the mids and lows just right.  As time goes on, I find out I am more of a mids guy (thus the HE500), and I am sure Pavel have different taste.  Given that you have two guys saying opposites about the amp, I can say that the amp pretty much nails it.

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As for test tracks, I listen to a lot of rock, and ironically, most of the stuff is pretty poorly recorded.  I use Kid Rock stuff to test in ears precisely because it's so sibilant, I want to make sure I can actually listen to poorly recorded music for a long period of time.  For serious testing, I listen to Buena Vista Social Club a bit, some flaming lips, some Radiohead (later stuff), Eagles.

 


Yes, I bolded your comments about the LCD-XC. Thanks to Robin for bringing something very special...probably a tier above the HD-800, HE-1000 and K240 as a group IMO. My friend said they were very LS3/5a like with the glorious mid-band. I would say that I tend to favor well recorded tracks to tune/voice gear. My finding is that a lack of phase coherence in equipment can result in false detail or brightness...so long term listening, as you do, is useful in that regard. I call it trusting your emotional gut. I'll have to give Kid Rock a try in the future but well recorded piano, horns, human voice, violin recordings are things I can relate to from playing in high school band orchestras: They are my staples. . I gather your comparisons might have actually had "Kid Rock" on the playlist that day. I understand your comment about tin ear but a lot can be said from whole being bigger than the sum of individual parts of the spectrum....sometimes it is just the vocabulary. Wish I got I chance to chat with you at the last meet...next time.
 
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