Feliks-Audio ELISE...New thread.
Oct 13, 2015 at 12:07 PM Post #256 of 13,856
  Well guys, it would appear it's time I tried to give a clearer, more 'objective' overview of my and JV's experience with the rather unconventional mix of driver tubes - viz ECC31/FDD20 - for those who may be interested in going off mainstream.
 
It is, of course, self-evident that in the main, mixing of non-identical tubes is fraught with possible problems and probably not even worth bothering with. However, an important lesson I learned from my time over at the Little Dot thread (and with the Elise!) was that sometimes it can pay dividends to experiment, even in the face of friendly scepticism - the sort I had hoped would migrate over to things Elise.
Despite approaching such a project with a healthy doubt, the lengthy burn-in necessary for our NOS tubes has shown a very clear similarity between them...much more so even than often between other tubes of the same type. And has been tested over a wide range of genres - no overnight quickies here, lol!
At first it appears they may not merge properly, but gradually any disparities do indeed fade and a synergy develops that is actually most unexpected...and I use the word advisedly here - "expectation" has been removed from the equation as much as possible, as has wishful thinking.
 
And so we have both come to this conclusion through careful, prolonged scrutiny...neither of us has only just started out in this area. And most importantly...through actual personal trial and assessment, not supposition. This, of course, can be the only way to gain any kind of meaningful impression as to what is being delivered by the tubes...and everything else! 
 
Which does actually bring me to the rather tricky subject of hearing. I suspect there are in fact very few (lucky) people with precisely the same range of frequency response in both ears, let alone volume levels. This will, naturally, impact upon the balance of sound we experience - our entire perception in fact. And must therefore differ from one person to the next...for better or worse! Which is just one reason why music appreciation especially is such a personal experience, of course.
 
And then there's the question of just how well balanced the drivers and powers are in toto!
 
In other words, there are a good many things that will influence anyone's experience in such an undertaking...and requires an open, unprejudiced mind; a willingness to try things new and/or unconventional...plus the patience not to judge by initial impressions, but give a fair trial. Only from such personal involvement and experience can a truly valid opinion be given.
 
And so, folks, I look forward to the honest findings of others prepared to fly in the face of convention, and take risks in the pursuit of "that extra mile"...which is also part of the fun to be had in this (mad?!) hobby of ours. Not everything suits everyone, but if at least a few discover something unexpected that they can enjoy/appreciate, then the quest must surely be worthwhile?...
 
So HAPPY LISTENING!
beerchug.gif

 
ps. Neither I nor JV will be in the slightest upset if your findings don't exactly match our own...given fair trial, lol!

Like gibosi says ears and gear i posted in another  thread regarding some owners having a hard time with Senns HD800 upper end, i said that the Senns upper end wasnt a problem for me and that i had decades in a noisy Machine Shop and loud music in between to thank for that so no anax mod for me lol. So that's why we have to experiment for ourselves one solution doesnt necessarely fit everybody  Happy Listening indeed. 
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 12:10 PM Post #257 of 13,856
And so, folks, I look forward to the honest findings of others prepared to fly in the face of convention, and take risks in the pursuit of "that extra mile"...which is also part of the fun to be had in this (mad?!) hobby of ours. Not everything suits everyone, but if at least a few discover something unexpected that they can enjoy/appreciate, then the quest must surely be worthwhile?...

So HAPPY LISTENING! :beerchug:

ps. Neither I nor JV will be in the slightest upset if your findings don't exactly match our own...given fair trial, lol!!


Well said H1,

Also don't underestimate psycho acoustic affects. If you read this article in full, in gives insight as to why this particular tube combo, pleases:

http://getthatprosound.com/hacking-your-listeners-ears-9-psychoacoustic-sound-design-tricks-to-improve-your-music/

.
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 12:55 PM Post #258 of 13,856
   
Hi UT...probably all depends on what sort of EMI/RFI  you have flying about - and thus whether you're lucky, or cursed, lol!!
wink_face.gif
(I do hope it's the former...).


I don't have EMI/RFI problems here. Best country in the world remember?
wink_face.gif
biggrin.gif

 
Reason for getting a power cable is because Lukasz may not be able to source me a quality one for the type used down under. I have a lot of spare unused PC power cables so will give that a go first. I just realise my DV is using a generic black cable with no untoward effects.
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 12:56 PM Post #259 of 13,856
I don't have EMI/RFI problems here. Best country in the world remember? :wink_face: :D

Reason for getting a power cable is because Lukasz may not be able to source me a quality one for the type used down under. I have a lot of spare unused PC power cables so will give that a go first. I just realise my DV is using a generic black cable with no untoward effects.


Think you'll be fine. The one supplied with the Elise was in no way 'fancy' and no problems, here.

.
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 1:16 PM Post #260 of 13,856
  Well guys, it would appear it's time I tried to give a clearer, more 'objective' overview of my and JV's experience with the rather unconventional mix of driver tubes - viz ECC31/FDD20 - for those who may be interested in going off mainstream.
 
It is, of course, self-evident that in the main, mixing of non-identical tubes is fraught with possible problems and probably not even worth bothering with. However, an important lesson I learned from my time over at the Little Dot thread (and with the Elise!) was that sometimes it can pay dividends to experiment, even in the face of friendly scepticism - the sort I had hoped would migrate over to things Elise.
Despite approaching such a project with a healthy doubt, the lengthy burn-in necessary for our NOS tubes has shown a very clear similarity between them...much more so even than often between other tubes of the same type. And has been tested over a wide range of genres - no overnight quickies here, lol!
At first it appears they may not merge properly, but gradually any disparities do indeed fade and a synergy develops that is actually most unexpected...and I use the word advisedly here - "expectation" has been removed from the equation as much as possible, as has wishful thinking.
 
And so we have both come to this conclusion through careful, prolonged scrutiny...neither of us has only just started out in this area. And most importantly...through actual personal trial and assessment, not supposition. This, of course, can be the only way to gain any kind of meaningful impression as to what is being delivered by the tubes...and everything else! 
 
Which does actually bring me to the rather tricky subject of hearing. I suspect there are in fact very few (lucky) people with precisely the same range of frequency response in both ears, let alone volume levels. This will, naturally, impact upon the balance of sound we experience - our entire perception in fact. And must therefore differ from one person to the next...for better or worse! Which is just one reason why music appreciation especially is such a personal experience, of course.
 
And then there's the question of just how well balanced the drivers and powers are in toto!
 
In other words, there are a good many things that will influence anyone's experience in such an undertaking...and requires an open, unprejudiced mind; a willingness to try things new and/or unconventional...plus the patience not to judge by initial impressions, but give a fair trial. Only from such personal involvement and experience can a truly valid opinion be given.
 
And so, folks, I look forward to the honest findings of others prepared to fly in the face of convention, and take risks in the pursuit of "that extra mile"...which is also part of the fun to be had in this (mad?!) hobby of ours. Not everything suits everyone, but if at least a few discover something unexpected that they can enjoy/appreciate, then the quest must surely be worthwhile?...
 
So HAPPY LISTENING!
beerchug.gif

 
ps. Neither I nor JV will be in the slightest upset if your findings don't exactly match our own...given fair trial, lol!!


Hi H1, let me first of all congratulate and applaud you for having the spirit of discovery and experimentation. The world wouldn't have been the same if Christopher Columbus didn't set out in his voyage of discovery. The maturity of a thread is how well we support and share ideas in our pursuit of better sound with lower cost without prejudice.
 
I have too many tubes right now to burn in, assess and listen to. I intend to do that in the course of my enjoying music. It won't be a rushed through exercise, Given time I might be willing to experiment anything or I might not. I might find that with one of those tubes I have found audio nirvana and therefore decided that's my utopia.
biggrin.gif

 
What we are doing here is very mild as compared to the things happening in the mod thread for LD MK6/8. We haven't even open up Elise yet !!! 
biggrin.gif

 
Keep up the good work. It's your quest and desire for better sound that led to the birth of Elise.
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 1:39 PM Post #261 of 13,856
  Like gibosi says ears and gear i posted in another  thread regarding some owners having a hard time with Senns HD800 upper end, i said that the Senns upper end wasnt a problem for me and that i had decades in a noisy Machine Shop and loud music in between to thank for that so no anax mod for me lol. So that's why we have to experiment for ourselves one solution doesnt necessarely fit everybody  Happy Listening indeed. 


Mike you're supposed to wear a noise cancelling top of the line headphone in the noisy machine shop. Your productivity would have been better.
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 1:43 PM Post #262 of 13,856
 
  Like gibosi says ears and gear i posted in another  thread regarding some owners having a hard time with Senns HD800 upper end, i said that the Senns upper end wasnt a problem for me and that i had decades in a noisy Machine Shop and loud music in between to thank for that so no anax mod for me lol. So that's why we have to experiment for ourselves one solution doesnt necessarely fit everybody  Happy Listening indeed. 


Mike you're supposed to wear a noise cancelling top of the line headphone in the noisy machine shop. Your productivity would have been better.

I knew that but they didnt lol
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 1:55 PM Post #263 of 13,856
  Couldnt agree more just listen to the first few seconds of the song Reflektor by Arcade Fire  incredible low end                              

Very good indeed. I shouldn't be bobbing my head at 5am in the morning but I am.
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 3:49 PM Post #267 of 13,856
Hi,
 
Quoting myself from a different thread:
 
 
Regarding trusting other reviewers opinions, I have come to the following conclusions after reading hundreds of posts on a couple of threads:
 
If you have a dedicated group of people, a consensus will emerge about which items are in the top tier.  Not every tube is for everybody, but a few perform much better than the rest. It is also possible to find the best price/performance ratio through these reviews.
 
Reading many posts from the same person, and comparing it with your own impressions, allows you to find people that have the same taste as you, and hear things the same way you do. So if these people come up with something that you did not try, you can rely on what they say.
 
Then you have people that consistently hear things differently than yourself, but you understand what they like, so you can rely on their opinion as well, knowing that it is not your own preference. Of course, you have to respect their taste - they write honestly what they prefer.
 
Then you have, unfortunately, angry people (hopefully not too many and not too often), that attack anybody who has a view different than theirs and make fun of and criticize sincere reviewers.
 
Hopefully, the true purpose of a thread like this is to help each other to find the best tubes and mods that let us listen to the music that is so much a part of our lives.
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 4:39 PM Post #268 of 13,856
Thanks guys...and so who's gonna be the first to open her up and start some modding?!...Please don't tempt me - I think that might just push poor Lukasz over the edge, lol!!! :wink:


That's what I'm talking about \m/

I'm still not sure if some personal PMs are being talked about in here that made you write a disclaimer or something entirely different. I would want everyone to concentrate on Elise ' s evolution, thanks!
 
Oct 13, 2015 at 6:51 PM Post #269 of 13,856
These arrived this morning all the way from UK !!! They looked good and NOS. Pretty strong readings too.   7.5/2.8 ; 7.5/2.6  and 6.5/2.4 ; 6.5/2.5
 
Am not wiping it. Those wordings will come off if wiped with a wet cloth. Haven't got a clue how old these are.
 

 

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