[Wodgy]

Quote:

Originally posted by KurtW I'd like to see even one good critical evaluation of the sound of different caps that are used in power supply filtering...if I've missed it, please someone send me the link. Sure, some people have spent a bunch of money on Cerafines or Black Gates, spent hours putting them in, and in declare that it sounds much better. Maybe it does, but this is not an objective analysis.

Very true. This isn't quite what you're looking for, but Walt Jung's "Picking Capacitors" article is somewhat related and a good read:
http://www.capacitors.com/pickcap/pickcap.htm

 

[PinkFloyd]

A few of you seem to be missing my point here. Creek advertise this amps components as:

"No expense has been spared to enable the OBH-11 headphone amp to faithfully reproduce a music signal. Only the highest quality components are used in its classic amplifier circuitry, to achieve low distortion and noise, with good stereo separation"

There are no high quality components on any Creek OBH11 circuit board neither past nor present.. there are certainly no "highest quality" components on show.

The creek PCB is adorned with the cheapest components I have yet come upon. You reckon stock Nichicon caps are good.. well I have news for you...... they may be classed as "acceptable" but they sure as hell aint "no expense spared finest quality caps"

You'll be telling me next that I can't purchase a SamWha capacitor for less than 4 pence (uk) and that they are high quality.

You can check whatever electronic suppliers lists that you have and you'll see that the components Creek use are not "high quality" as they state but indeed the "cheapest of the cheap"

Nichicon makes a good enough capacitor but certainly not "the best components on the planet"

Gotta stick with my initial evalualtion....... maybe upgrade it to £3 manufacturing cost....

A cheap and nasty piece of electronics dressed up as a lamb.. I really used to be proud to be British but these days would prefer to be german.

"there is no kidding a kidder"

Pinkie

 

[Wodgy]

You're just being silly. The retail price of the OBH-11 over here is $170. Creek has chosen the very best quality parts they could for that target price. Sure, they could have used Black Gates everywhere, but the amp would cost much more than $170.

If you can do better, you should start building and selling your own amps. I'm serious. There's a real demand for headphone amps, and if you can manufacture an equivalent headphone amp using only Black Gate capacitors, Holco or Vishay/Dale resistors, an Alps Blue volume pot, a regulated power supply, the very best transistors or opamps, and a real metal case with silkscreened printing, including assemby, all for $170, people will beat a path to your door.

 

[puppyslugg]

In a coupling situation, it does make a difference. I just replaced the cheapo coupling cap with a Blackgate in a cdp. It made a dramatic difference! Improved bass slam, a more stable soundstage. IMO, cap swapping is worth the effort.

In power supplies, IMO, a good low impedence cap, will 'track' the audio signal more closely. Resulting in 'less smearing' of the sound, and improved bass response.

It maybe just an placebo effect. But if your mind believes, then that's all that matters, no? And yes, I probably do need help!

If I owned a OBH-11, I'd be doing the same thing as PinkFloyd.

PinkFloyd, give us a report on your findings. I hoping I'm not the only one that's nuts! 'Nuts' like company.

 

[KurtW]

In a coupling situation, I'm sure caps do make a big difference. This is what the good article that Wodsy mentioned addresses. It's also why I don't use any caps for coupling if I can get away with it.

I bought some of Percy's high end caps to put into a modified Corda power supply because I had two at the time and could do an A/B comparison and find out for myself how much difference they made. Unfortunately they didn't fit as they tend to be much bigger, so the comparison never happenned. My gut feel is they help a little bit, but I have no evidence of this. So again, if you're building your own stuff why not use them. But I am not surprised or disappointed when commercial manufacturers don't use them, especially when they are selling something for under $200. I would say using them in gear that sells for less than $200 is irresponsible, as i'm sure the money could be better spent elsewhere.

 

[puppyslugg]

Even in more costly equipment, I am disappointd with some of the component selection. In the case of the obh-11, assuming that the topology is decent, it would not be unreasonable to upgrade the caps to allow the topology to perform at it's best. Is it worth it to upgrade the caps in the obh-11? We won't know until PinkFloyd changes out the caps.

I do agree, to expect boutique caps in relative low cost equipment, is unreasonable. I think PinkFloyd has an issue with what he perceives as misleading hype.

 

[ServinginEcuador]

I personally own an OBH-11, and look forward to reading what PinkFloyd thinks about this amp after he makes the changes!! I would also consider buying the replacement parts and having a friend who solders quite well install them for me. IMHO, if you can take a component and upgrade its sound a bit for little money it is definitely worth it. I had some IC sockets installed into my CDP to get rid of the cheap op amps it came with.

For those who upgraded their CDP with coupling cap changes, or for that matter anything else, can you post what you replaced them with, brand names, etc. and your opinion of the sound changes it (they) made?? I am seriously considereing changing my CDP's power supply caps to see how they sound, but want to make sure it is worth the effort and expense!!

I personally can't spend another $500 to sell my current CDP and buy something that would make a significant enough change to justify the spending, so I for one am all for making whatever changes I can to my stuff to bring it closer to that next step of sound quality I can't afford!!!

 

[PinkFloyd]

Sorry folks but I bought a Musical Fidelity X can V2 this afternoon and the first listen was enough to convince me that the Creek was indeed a bad buy.

Have been under the bonnet of the MF and it's like a chalk and cheese comparison... the MF "is" quality, absolutely brimming with good components. forget the "cheap potentiometer" cause MF put all their effort into the inside of this unit whereas the Creek attaches a large knob to the case... I could easily find a "big"knob to fit onto the MF.

I am in serious audition mode at the moment and, as such, am finding it hard to concentrate on the music as well as typing! I will give my opinions on the MF in due course but can honestly say it is built like a brick **** house with a high end design.

This baby has "real" potential


Pinkie

 

[puppyslugg]

PinkFloyd:

Are you going to return the Creek OBH-11?

 

[ServinginEcuador]

Quote:

Originally posted by puppyslugg PinkFloyd: Are you going to return the Creek OBH-11?

Yeah, PinkFloys, inquiring minds want to know!! I am waiting to read how these cap replacements affect the sound quality before I look into doing the same myself!!

If PinkFloyd doesn't do the mod, who's next on the list to take teh plunge and do it???

 

[PinkFloyd]

Quote:

Originally posted by ServinginEcuador Yeah, PinkFloys, inquiring minds want to know!! I am waiting to read how these cap replacements affect the sound quality before I look into doing the same myself!! If PinkFloyd doesn't do the mod, who's next on the list to take teh plunge and do it???

Well after looking under the bonnet of the MF I am not too sure if it's worth throwing good money after bad into the Creek.. there seems to be a hell of a lot more potential with the MF (see picture) and after only 20 hours burn in it sounds SO good... it would be a lot more sensible to put a bit of money into the MF just to see what it's capable of.

The Creek hasn't gone back yet and I still haven't totally ruled the modification out but every time I plug the phones into it after listening to the MF it seems to sound pretty crap to be honest

One things for sure, Musical Fidelity sure haven't skimped on components and for only £10 more than the Creek it really seems and sounds the better bargain. In fact, the circuitry looks very Class A and I think it would benefit from a sprinkling of higher quality components such as Black Gates and maybe a couple of Mullard E88CC valves.

I'll make my decision before the weekend

 

[PinkFloyd]

Another pic

 

[PinkFloyd]

and another

 

[Magic77]

PinkFloyd,

I have the X-Can v2 as well. I've opened up mine also, and Yes, it is well made and you can't beat the price for it's performance.

The only thing I wish it had is an ON/OFF switch. Do you have any suggestions for turning it ON/OFF instead of unplugging it all the time or using a power strip to turn it ON/OFF ??

 

[Hirsch]

The Mullard valves really do improve the X-Can v2. I prefer them to the various flavors of Amperex or Siemens that I tried.

Another interesting option is to upgrade the op amps. Based on some posts that I read (my apologies to the original poster, but I've forgotten the source), I replaced the op amps with a plug-in socket, and am now using Burr Brown OPA2228PA op amps.

Another key upgrade is the power supply. The Musical Fidelity X-PSU has been discontinued, but is sometimes available on audiogon or ebay. There are less expensive DIY options that reportedly improve on the original wall wart in the same way.

Each of these upgrades has resulted in a very appreciable increase in performance of the X-Can.

Hmm....Black Gates....hmmm....now that you've planted the thought...