[rgs9200m]

Thanks for that. I'm always on the fence with EQ. I actually have played a lot with Jriver EQ (it's fun!) and have multiple settings for many phones (I think I have 25 curves set up), but even after all this, I prefer a setup where I turn the EQ off.
Sometimes EQ is necessary for a particular track and headphone, but still I most often prefer flatness. 
I only use EQ to remove glare or fatigue in the highs and mids. I just tune things by ear; maybe there is a disciplined way to do this but I don't know. I just twiddle.
(My Rudi amp is the RP010B by the way. Usually I listen to a PS1000e or an LCD4 or an HD650. Sometimes an Ether but it's a little bright sometimes.)

 

[JaZZ]

  Thanks for that. I'm always on the fence with EQ. I actually have played a lot with Jriver EQ (it's fun!) and have multiple settings for many phones (I think I have 25 curves set up), but even after all this, I prefer a setup where I turn the EQ off.
Sometimes EQ is necessary for a particular track and headphone, but still I most often prefer flatness. 
I only use EQ to remove glare or fatigue in the highs and mids. I just tune things by ear; maybe there is a disciplined way to do this but I don't know. I just twiddle.
(My Rudi amp is the RP010B by the way. Usually I listen to a PS1000e or an LCD4 or an HD650. Sometimes an Ether but it's a little bright sometimes.)

 
I have no real recommendation to offer when it comes to an EQ strategy. I found my own curves by trial and error – initially by relying on published FR graphs (mostly Inner Fidelity) –, but soon had to discover that they can't entirely be trusted, particularly for the treble, even from the range above 1 kHz on. As with my own speaker projects (when I was into speaker building years ago) which took me months to find the ideal crossover tuning, I changed my headphone EQ settings almost on a daily basis during weeks and months till I reached a point where the changes have become rare and marginal. Most important is to take fine steps. 1 dB is already a large step in my book. Of course everything is based on my ears as well – measurements are of no use, there are enough available on the net already. It's about your own ears.
 
Just one hint: To my ears most of the Inner Fidelity curves clearly understate the range between 1 and 4 kHz and clearly overstate the range between 6 and 9 kHz (by 3-6 dB).
 
BTW, replacing a preamp in my speaker system with a stepped attenuator had the same effect of aggravating the sensitivity to tiny flaws of the crossover tuning as now a signal path as direct as possible in a headphone system has to equalizing.

 

[rgs9200m]

Thanks for that info. Yep, when I was mainly listening to speakers (Kharma 3.2s) I could hear everything (at least it felt like that) and always used a decent preamp (a passive one like the Placette never worked well for me).

 

[miketlse]

Are any of you considering getting a TToby to partner with your Hugo TT?

 

[Duncan]

I'm now toying with the idea of upgrading the Hugo to the TT after getting myself a new pair of headphones (Pioneer SE Master 1)...

Damn, is this hobby a curse to the finances...

 

[Whazzzup]

I'm now toying with the idea of upgrading the Hugo to the TT after getting myself a new pair of headphones (Pioneer SE Master 1)...

Damn, is this hobby a curse to the finances...

You said it bro, I'm thinking about picking up gsx mk2 to go with my TT.

 

[ubs28]

I'm now toying with the idea of upgrading the Hugo to the TT after getting myself a new pair of headphones (Pioneer SE Master 1)...

Damn, is this hobby a curse to the finances...

My finances won't like it either when the Chord Hugo 2 or Chord Hugo TT 2 is released 

. I'm obviously going to upgrade then.

 

[Duncan]

My finances won't like it either when the Chord Hugo 2 or Chord Hugo TT 2 is released  . I'm obviously going to upgrade then.

I'm truly spellbound by what the Hugo can do with the M1s, so can only sit and wonder (or is that anticipate!) as to what improvement the TT can offer...

An over used cliché I am well aware, however - I have never heard music sound this good - the M1s have undoubtedly breathed new life into my love of music, so - looking at the next logical upgrade...

I swear I could be a junkie and spend less money than I do here

 

[x RELIC x]

I'm truly spellbound by what the Hugo can do with the M1s, so can only sit and wonder (or is that anticipate!) as to what improvement the TT can offer...

An over used cliché I am well aware, however - I have never heard music sound this good - the M1s have undoubtedly breathed new life into my love of music, so - looking at the next logical upgrade...

I swear I could be a junkie and spend less money than I do here

Just think, you could be like me and consider the DAVE. :eek: TT is a bargain in comparison.

Never mind Hugo (never heard it), the Mojo is enough for me to consider skipping the TT..... I know, I'm nuts!!

 

[AlanYWM]

If you think that speaker amps alter the sound more than headphone amps, that's an inappropriate assumption. After all headphone amps have the better precondition due to the lower power requirements, at least with respect to the price.

As already mentioned, I absolutely advocate tayloring the sound of your gear to your liking. I'm not strictly against re-amping the signal if you like the resulting sound. I'm just telling that you don't improve it objectively, in the sense of high fidelity, by doing so. It all depends on your sonic ideals. If you like a more pleasing and forgiving interpretation of the original recording, it's certainly a logical approach. But if you're interested in a sound as close to the original recording as it gets and nevertheless without unnatural harshness (but with preserved harshness if it's in the recording), there are alternatives waiting to get explored (if you dare).

And BTW, apart from equalizing there's another component that has an often underestimated impact on the sound: cables. You would be surprised how much a good/matching headphone cable contributes to an ear-friendly sonic experience. Since no cable is absolutely neutral and none of them can be called more neutral than any other, you're in fact entitled to use any cable without questioning the degree of coloration or smoothing it adds.
[/quote]


Actually I did not mentioned anything about speaker amps altering the sound more than headphone amps. All I mentioned was that if you fear transparency loss using a headphone amp, the same should also apply when using speaker amps. You will be introducing speaker cables into the equation besides the amp and speakers. All these will surely colour and affect transparency. The theory may indicate that you cannot improve the sound but the reality is different. If I am not wrong some folks over at the Dave forum are already talking about improvements using a yet to be announced headphone device. In the end, it is my ears that will be the final judge as to what sounds better. Lastly, I always maintain that if one prefers the sound from the TT alone, then so be it. You are fully entitled to your opinion.

 

[Jawed]

If I am not wrong some folks over at the Dave forum are already talking about improvements using a yet to be announced headphone device.

That's a power amp for speakers.

 

[JaZZ]

 
Quote:

 

I am with you, rgs9200m. For me the argument against using an amp for the TT and even the Dave is very weak. Many things affect the sound in an audio chain. Even Chord has come out with amps for their dacs. Surely that would impact transparency since these amps are meant to drive speakers. To me, there is no such thing as perfect sound. It is all about what is pleasing to our ears and enjoying our music. Theory is just that. I dont listen to theory. I enjoy listening to my TT with my amp. The TT alone is fine but I enjoy it more with my amp in balanced mode. Does it matter if someone thinks otherwise? Absolutely not. But I am totally fine with anyone just preferring the TT alone. To each his own. If anything, I would like to hear the argument against using an amp from Chord directly

 
If you think that speaker amps alter the sound more than headphone amps, that's an inappropriate assumption. After all headphone amps have the better precondition due to the lower power requirements, at least with respect to the price.
 
As already mentioned, I absolutely advocate tayloring the sound of your gear to your liking. I'm not strictly against re-amping the signal if you like the resulting sound. I'm just telling that you don't improve it objectively, in the sense of high fidelity, by doing so. It all depends on your sonic ideals. If you like a more pleasing and forgiving interpretation of the original recording, it's certainly a logical approach. But if you're interested in a sound as close to the original recording as it gets and nevertheless without unnatural harshness (but with preserved harshness if it's in the recording), there are alternatives waiting to get explored (if you dare).
 
And BTW, apart from equalizing there's another component that has an often underestimated impact on the sound: cables. You would be surprised how much a good/matching headphone cable contributes to an ear-friendly sonic experience. Since no cable is absolutely neutral and none of them can be called more neutral than any other, you're in fact entitled to use any cable without questioning the degree of coloration or smoothing it adds.

 
Actually I did not mentioned anything about speaker amps altering the sound more than headphone amps. All I mentioned was that if you fear transparency loss using a headphone amp, the same should also apply when using speaker amps. You will be introducing speaker cables into the equation besides the amp and speakers. All these will surely colour and affect transparency. The theory may indicate that you cannot improve the sound but the reality is different. If I am not wrong some folks over at the Dave forum are already talking about improvements using a yet to be announced headphone device. In the end, it is my ears that will be the final judge as to what sounds better. Lastly, I always maintain that if one prefers the sound from the TT alone, then so be it. You are fully entitled to your opinion.

 
I see no contradiction to what I wrote. Well, I don't fear a loss of transparency by adding a (needless) amplification stage, but the loss is certain (and clearly audible to my ears) and I want to avoid it. In turn your approach is the opposite: You explicitly want the loss of transparency by introduced colorations. That's your personal decision based on your sonic ideals, and I respect it. I just don't think it's a particularly clever approach. You could just as well use a plugin for your audio player emulating the sound of different amps by adding specific doses of harmonic distortion. Maybe you won't get exactly the same coloration as now, but maybe you'd like the resulting sound even better, moreover the effect is variable (e.g. for different headphones). Yes, for driving speakers you can't avoid the additional amplification, so you have to live with the sonic consequences. That's not the case with headphones, so renouncing the amp in favor of signal accuracy is the logical choice – or adding another amplification stage is a priori an absurd idea, resp. Note that with the added distortion you refuse to benefit from Rob Watts' puristic approach with his creations with the spectacularly low harmonic distortion as a result.

 

[JaZZ]

 

If I am not wrong some folks over at the Dave forum are already talking about improvements using a yet to be announced headphone device.

 
That's a power amp for speakers.

 
It's also possible that he meant the «headphone device» based on High Fidelity Cables' magnetic conduction technology. I don't know how this would fit in with the actual debate, though. But it could certainly also be of interest for TT users (just to find back on topic).
 

If I am not wrong some folks over at the Dave forum are already talking about improvements using a yet to be announced headphone device.

 
If you really mean Chord's new line of digital amps for the connection to DAVE: This will be the great breakthrough in that those amps won't degrade the signal in any way (at least that's what it looks like and has been promised), in contrast to conventional amps.

 

[miketlse]

I'm now toying with the idea of upgrading the Hugo to the TT after getting myself a new pair of headphones (Pioneer SE Master 1)...

Damn, is this hobby a curse to the finances...

 
I have only recently bought a Mojo, but I have been imagining that an upgrade path could be a hugo TT driving a power amp - but what power amp had become the big question.
I think I need to savour the Mojo for a few months first - but contemplating 'what ifs' brings much pleasure.
 
Listening to music through a good DAC, just seems to make everyone want to hear ever more of it.  

 

[Whazzzup]

 

I'm now toying with the idea of upgrading the Hugo to the TT after getting myself a new pair of headphones (Pioneer SE Master 1)...

Damn, is this hobby a curse to the finances...

 
I have only recently bought a Mojo, but I have been imagining that an upgrade path could be a hugo TT driving a power amp - but what power amp had become the big question.
I think I need to savour the Mojo for a few months first - but contemplating 'what ifs' brings much pleasure.
 
Listening to music through a good DAC, just seems to make everyone want to hear ever more of it.  

enjoy mojo and yes TT makes a fine desktop  dac, possibly end game ( unless dave is in your price range) and I'm still not convinced it needs an amp, except if your a balanced user preference. I have hugo and much prefer TT although hugo is my go to portable for iem and headphones in the garden like my modded th900. take your time, their seems to be new products introduced every so often.