[perhapss]

   

 
if you think I'm being rude or non-factual,
Look what subscription/financial elite community of the NY Phiharmonic did to Mahler when he came to conduct for them.

 

[Claritas]

  Classical music and opera were a big part of American culture up through the 20s and was only supplanted when Jazz swept in. Almost every household had a piano with Chopin sheet music in the bench and a Victrola packed with Red Seals of Caruso, Galli-Curci and Stokowski. Every decent sized city in the country had its own symphony orchestra.
 
Classical music split in the fifties and sixties when American composers who worked in familiar forms were brushed off by critics in favor of avant garde ones who created music less for the common man than for critics and other avant garde composers. The same split happened in Jazz between the figs and the boppers. Ultimately both lost their audience to new forms of music based on different threads of music. In a sense, both classical and jazz committed suicide because they turned their backs on the people in the seats and focused on conceptualism and theory instead.
 
Film soundtracks mined traditional classical music for things to repurpose. It ended up being a lot more interesting than the contemporary classical music.

 
+ NBC Symphony, Reader's Digest, &c.
 
When my Dad was a real youngster in the 40s, he wanted to hear something by Beethoven because he had heard somewhere that Beethoven was a great composer. His neighbor's family owned a record player and had bought the Toscanini Beethoven set to have "something of culture" in the house. He still remembers putting on the record of that work with the French name Eroica and being stunned by the opening chords. Young Americans today don't have that chance.

 

[bigshot]

There used to be subscription services for binders of 78s "Great Men of Music" that were sold by newspapers and delivered by paper boys. You can still find hundreds of these records in thrift stores.

 

[bigshot]

  "Almost every household had a piano with Chopin sheet music in the bench and a Victrola packed with Red Seals of Caruso, Galli-Curci and Stokowski."
Actually this was only the case in some households of a certain class. "Almost every" is a gross exaggeration.

 
No it isn't. If you go to thrift stores, they are packed with copies of the sextette from Lucia and the quartet from Rigoletto for a buck apiece. Those records sold millions of copies over the years. Caruso was a superstar and everyone listened to radio broadcasts from concert halls all over the country. Fats Waller, the great stride pianist grew up in Harlem and was poor, but he studied Bach on the piano. Classical music WAS mainstream back then. Now, it's marginalized itself by becoming something for upper income people looking for culture. Pretty sad state of affairs.

 

[perhapss]

   
+ NBC Symphony, Reader's Digest, &c.
 
When my Dad was a real youngster in the 40s, he wanted to hear something by Beethoven because he had heard somewhere that Beethoven was a great composer. His neighbor's family owned a record player and had bought the Toscanini Beethoven set to have "something of culture" in the house. He still remembers putting on the record of that work with the French name Eroica and being stunned by the opening chords. Young Americans today don't have that chance.

"Young Americans today don't have that chance."
 
Actually young Americans today have the internet which provides infinitely more listening and educational opportunities.

 

[Claritas]

  Actually young Americans today have the internet which provides infinitely more listening and educational opportunities.

No one to guide them to the classics. Society no longer believes that better music--real music--exists. Just the opposite: society says there's no good and bad, "it's all a matter of taste."

 

[perhapss]

   
No it isn't. If you go to thrift stores, they are packed with copies of the sextette from Lucia and the quartet from Rigoletto for a buck apiece. Those records sold millions of copies over the years. Caruso was a superstar and everyone listened to radio broadcasts from concert halls all over the country. Fats Waller, the great stride pianist grew up in Harlem and was poor, but he studied Bach on the piano. Classical music WAS mainstream back then. Now, it's marginalized itself by becoming something for upper income people looking for culture. Pretty sad state of affairs.

 
These were if fact the technological wonders of their day admittedly.
The role Classical music played in popular culture of the time was important as well.
 
How that makes for their superiority somehow eludes me....

 

[perhapss]

 
No one to guide them to the classics. Society no longer believes that better music--real music--exists. Just the opposite: society says there's no good and bad, "it's all a matter of taste."

 
"No one??"
There are MANY people with youtube channels available to do this in a MUCH easier fashion than back in the day.
All it takes is a little interest.
The things I had to do to get hold of information on classical music looked like prehistory compared to today.
 
"Society?"
Unfortunately society today constantly inundates young people with many messages regarding good and bad.
After all, I wouldn't even know who Justin Bieber is otherwise...

 

[Claritas]

  "No one??"
There are MANY people with youtube channels available to do this in a MUCH easier fashion than back in the day.
All it takes is a little interest.
The things I had to do to get hold of information on classical music looked like prehistory compared to today.
 
"Society?"
Unfortunately society today constantly inundates young people with many messages regarding good and bad.
After all, I wouldn't even know who Justin Bieber is otherwise...

 
It was better when society told people: "Music of the court. Good. Village idiot music. Bad."

 

[perhapss]

   
It was better when society told people: "Music of the court. Good. Village idiot music. Bad."

 
You left out the Christian Church's role in what western society says is good.
After all, the foundation of western classical music was very much their business.

 

[perhapss]

On another note:
 

 

[Claritas]

On another note:

That version of no. 1 and also Richter's.

 

[perhapss]

That version of no. 1 and also Richter's.

 
Agreement at last!

 

[Claritas]

Agreement at last!

Definitely.

 

[perhapss]

Bigshot got me thinking about life in 1914.
Actually a very remarkable year:
 
 http://www.historyorb.com/events/date/1914