[Bokyung]

What iPod really needs is drag and drop from out of the box. 

 

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Quote:

I have an iPod Nano from about 5 years ago. I've used it almost daily since I've owned it, for sometimes 12 hours in a day. It's all covered in dents, has been in the toilet and through the washing machine a few times. There seems to be no way to break it. It works at -35C outside even when my body is about to stop working. The battery still charges perfectly. The design is perfect, so simplistic and effective. It's so small and slim that I don't notice it in pocket and can even wear it in the elastic of my underwear if I have no pockets. It has outlived many pairs of lower quality IEMs. Both my stereo and car have built in support for it as an added bonus. It's a joy to use. I'd say it was one of my best purchases, but I even got it for free. I use PoddoX to transfer files. It's an older tiny app (407kB) which I keep on the iPod itself so I can easily use it on any computer I plug into. It does exactly what I need it to do and nothing more. It has to run in Windows XP compatibility mode but that's fine. iTunes sucks, synchronizing is stupid for a music player, I'd never use that lol. The only downside is having 4GB of space I have to change the music on it quite frequently. The database sometimes gets corrupted so I've also stored a copy of the filesystem so I can easily fix that (PoddoX wasn't finished or it should have a repair function

). Other than that I could think of a few improvements for my Nano but nothing I can't easily live without.
 
I'm the market for a new player but there is just nothing that can match my old Nano. All the players seem bloated or poorly designed. Big screens, touch screens, docking stations, bulky, bloated with features, demanding to use crappy and restrictive software, etc. These are all bad "features" and nothing that a smart power user is interested in. I want complete power over my player, and I don't want it to have a camera built in, etc. It seems the majority of players are designed for style for idiots to use, which is ironic because that's what was originally thought of the iPod, yet its turned out the best design I've seen.
 
I can't speak for sound quality, it may well be sub par for portable players (not sure) but it's not the most important thing for me in a portable player since there are so many other limitations on the sound quality already (mainly the environment and source files).
 
I'm also aware that my 2nd gen Nano might be a special case. I've seen some of the later Nanos (3rd or 4th?) which are square and frankly a stupid design that's too small for my hand and too wide for my pocket and has an inferior interface which is more designed for style than practicality. The classic iPods have a lot of storage but the cost is a really big size and they're less durable I imagine (never used one). Other apple products like the iPhone and iPad look like crap to me, they look like something loaded with useless features, lacking customization and power usage, and just waiting to break.

Sony NWZ-E354

 
Quote:

^^ And that is the pervading feeling, especially in America. George, I used to hate Apple, too, so we are strange bedfellows - in a way. I left the hate camp 3 years ago and moved on. You can stay where you are, that is no problem. I don't like iTunes, but it works like a dream for syncing, organising and tossing files every which way I want. I would feel better about iTunes if it left the application stuff way behind. Originally, I did not get my iPod touch for music, I got it for internet and it was the only realistic option back in 2007. The fact that it did everything I wanted (well, at the time, no volume buttons and it had hiss) in a portable was a surprise, especially for me, a dyed- in the wool iPod hater. It doesn't matter now and there is no reason to fight the Apple hate with Apple support as the two are incompatible camps. Another thing that isn't compatible is trying to prove to Apple haters that iPods actually sound good. They will never believe it, even if they do blind tests and see that it is very possible that they cannot detect a difference with volume-matched players playing the same earphones. Who knows, they might actually like the iPod - but that isn't even up for debate as to that group (that I was part of in a bigger way than you my friend as I hated everything that even closely resembled DAP's and Apple was the epitome of all that was wrong in the market) as it is easier to hate than to accept the fact that a device that represents all that is wrong, is actually an okay device. 
 
I had to eat my words and almost wanted to eat my socks.
 
Now, I am not a Jobs fan, nor a fan of iTunes (not really, though when open, it is fast and problem-free), nor would I want to flash my iPod if I went to the USA where everyone, it seems, has one. I also like to be 'an individual' by joining a group of like-minded non-conformists. But, I'd rather just listen to music without the fuss. There is only one platform that will allow me to do that: iPod and that is where I will stay unless someone else can make a player that: 
 
1. Doesn't hiss (or hisses as little as the iPod touch 2G)
2. plays gaplessly
3. has a goodly amount of storage
4. can drive low Ω phones well
5. can offer AAC
6. has hardware volume buttons
7. Good build quality
8. good battery life
9. doesn't tackle the lowest common denominator by marketing to audiophiles (who gobble marketing up)
 
Plus, with my iPod touch, I have a  5KG dictionary in the palm of my hand, references galore. It is true: I enjoy the non-music stuff a lot, but after years with the iPod touch, even originally as a hateful skeptic, I am amazed by what I hear when I listen with unbiased ears. 

Sony NWZ-X1061

 

[shigzeo]

The X1061 is not gapless and it hisses like a freaking tornado. I either own, have owned, or borrow all of the new players. Sony are so far off the rocker if you use sensitive earphones, that I won't be going back any time soon. 

 

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I thought my E436 has no distortion but my headphones are low sensitivity. Is there any mp3 player that doesn't hiss?

 

[shigzeo]

Every source will hiss, it just depends on how sensitive your earphones are. Currently, the least hissy source I've heard is the iPod shuffle 5G and after it, the iPod touch 2G. Not too far after is the S:Flo 2 and the Sansa Clip. The DACPort has very little hiss and strangely, so too does my Edirol FA66 sound interface. It all depends on your earphones. Some sources are so hissy (AMP3 Pro, Studio, and to a lesser degree, the Sony A845/A828/X) that I can hear their hiss with full size headphones and the ER4S.

 

[mr_diza]

 
of course apple has that novelty factor with all its great apps, games, marketing,status, user friendliness, etc its what it does better than the rest of any of the competition.. but arent you missing the point here - a player for audiophiles? it might be decent uneq'd, but decent is not what most are looking for
 
bottom line:
stock for stock with no eq- ipod<sony/cowon players
 
double bottom line:
with eq - ipod<<sony/cowon players

 

[shigzeo]

No, I litterally mean that the iPod is better than those players in several key areas. Firstly, iPods hiss less than cowons or Sony's. They also have little to NO bass roll off (something no cowon this side of 2006 has been able to do), much wider stereo separation under load and less tendency to boom. I litterally mean that unless you tweak the Cowon, you aren't getting anything special. 
 
In other words, if all you like in your music is EQ and effects, both platforms aren't up to the level of the iPod in terms of playing music as it is recorded. Sony models tend to have a mix: some drop off the bass, others add to it, so that there is no neutral point.
 
Of course, if you like warmer sounding players, Sony is better. But literally, I am saying that the iPod is better than Cowon or Sony for realistic sound performance and in that, sound quality. Where sony excels is adding warmth - that is their key. Cowon excel with special effects, but those effects don't mean they sound better in any technical sense, those effects just make their sound more pleasing to SOME people. More pleasing and better are two very different things.

 

[Bokyung]

About Sony hissing, I can confirm that. With my CK100, I can hear hiss, it's like a storm. And actually,just last night... I did mistake the hiss as rain storm and I ended up closing the windows before the rain gets in.
 
Lately, I've been going for EQ-less, and I know what Shigezo means. I have my iPod touch 2nd generation, and the hiss is subtle. It doesn't scream in my ears. Of course, I guess it all depends how sensitive your ears are + how sensitive your iems is?
 
Just my 0.02.

 

[Goosemama]

I love my ipod classic! I was a cowon D2 user for the past couple of years and recently bought an ipod classic mainly for the interface and space. I own a pretty decent set of iem's as well as couple of nicer headphones - rip all my music mp3 -320kbps (even with pretty decent home set-up I cannot tell the difference between flac and mp3 320) - compared to cowon D2 I actually prefer the sound coming from my ipod. granted cowon has a lot more tweaks available (and I use some), but I like the ipod better. cowon definitely is more powerful, it can drive higher impedance headphones a little better, but thats about it..... and you cannot beat the ipod classic interface!

 

[shigzeo]

I also came from Cowon D2. That was the last player I bought on headfier recommendations. I will only buy products I can test now, or like the ipod shuffle 5G, ones that have very specific purposes and intents. The D2 is a fine player for highΩ phones as it drives them pretty much like no load. The Classic is the same thing, of course, but iPods carry more overhead. After 90-95% of the volume, they get strained, whereas the Cowon goes well to 100% and the load of a high Ω headphone.
 
For low Ω headphones, the iPod is ahead. 

 

[Angelbelow]

I bought an Ipod 5 gen purposely to attempt to hack it so that it can play FLAC. But I did this without proper research. After already purchasing the ipod i realized that the IPOD amp isnt very good and that it doesnt really matter much if the files I put on there are FLAC.

 

[Hero Kid]

 

[matchuk28]

what i dont understand is the iphones use wolfson dacs right? they should sound good besides the horrid amp inside the phone, however when i have compared it to sansa and samsung products it seems so much worse? is that to do with the overall design inside the phone and not the dac itself?

 

[nwavguy]

I've only personally tested the iPod Touch 3G and the 3G original (now "classic" series). I can say the Touch 3G has very impressive audio performance. In fact, it comfortably outperforms even one of the new well regarded Cowon players. I was honestly kind of surprised it measured so well as Apple products tend to be more about amazing packaging (which can compromise performance) and being sexy on the outside rather than having the best hardware inside.
 
I'll be posting a review soon on my blog, but unless you already have one (or buy one used), it's not that useful as the 4G has replaced it and likely performs differently. I use it more as reference to compare other current players to.

 

[Young Spade]

I bought an Ipod 5 gen purposely to attempt to hack it so that it can play FLAC. But I did this without proper research. After already purchasing the ipod i realized that the IPOD amp isnt very good and that it doesnt really matter much if the files I put on there are FLAC.

Definitely. Yu have to have a good source before you worry about thr other things.

Source, bitrate, and headphones are the most important pieces.