Cayin i5 Lossless Android DAP with AKM4490 DAC supporting 32/384 PCM + 64/128 DSD
Feb 23, 2017 at 11:14 PM Post #2,867 of 3,742
I've used it in my Ford Expedition with Sync, and it works. It was kind of finicky at first, but it works.


Mm I drive a corolla 2016 model if anybody drives one and knows how to.
 
Feb 24, 2017 at 1:42 AM Post #2,868 of 3,742
We have conducted multiple test on the Tidal Stuttering issue at both online and offline conditions, and the results are very similar. While the DNS setting "might" affect the streaming performance, but it certainly won't affect the offline playback of Tidal download filed. In fact, the video that illustrate the Tidal stuttering issues are all recorded in offline mode, and the stuttering problem is noticeable, so I am not convinced that DNS setting is causing the problem.

 
Agree why DNS setting would affect offline Tidal playback.
 
My Tidal playback is essentially entirely offline for their HiFi content, and my finding is that NOT every albums I downloaded has stuttering problem, one or two I have downloaded recently were entirely stutter free and in fact sounded very nice, while other downloads were so full of stutters, rendering them unlistenable. 
triportsad.gif
 

 
Feb 24, 2017 at 5:54 AM Post #2,869 of 3,742
Agree why DNS setting would affect offline Tidal playback.

My Tidal playback is essentially entirely offline for their HiFi content, and my finding is that NOT every albums I downloaded has stuttering problem, one or two I have downloaded recently were entirely stutter free and in fact sounded very nice, while other downloads were so full of stutters, rendering them unlistenable. :triportsad:  


Not sure if this is related, but the bitrate of lossless 16/44.1 can ranged from 5xx bps to well over 1000 bps, some of the HiFi tracks at lower bit rate might cause less pressure to the CPU loading.
 
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Feb 24, 2017 at 6:14 AM Post #2,870 of 3,742
Wow, Cayin and the Cayin user community is quite lucky to have both Andy, and as a software partner, Joe Bloggs, involved.

I did some consulting work with a computer audio related firm.  We did try to work with Tidal on something, and it was akin to pulling teeth.  So I can really empathize with Cayin on that.

I suppose the good news is that once HiBy and its hardware partners crack the code on Android for hifi; that knowledge base will be portable to future hardware.


See knowing this makes me want to cancel my Tidal subscription. It is expensive to start with, and knowing they really don't want to work with others to improve the end user experience just rubs me the wrong way.


When subscriber contact Tidal and kind of "complaint" about the stuttering problem, he is entitled to Customer support service and handled by properly trained CS staff. When I contact Tidal, I am not their customer, and my questions probably will be redirected to technical service or corporate liaison function, not surprised that the efficiency and service commitment are very different.

We learned a lot from the i5 project, and we definitely can position ourselves better in our next attempt. To tell you the truth, the i5 will possibly be an one-off entry for a long time, we probably will not commit to DAP with Google Play again in foreseeable future. The fact that Google Play is NOT available in mainland China has make life very difficult to our software development team.
 
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Feb 24, 2017 at 6:29 AM Post #2,871 of 3,742
Dear Andy, after upgraded to Firmware 2.2, I tried to connect i5 to my DAC through USB cable.  My DAC is Cambridge Audio 851N which is also a network streamer.  However, the DAC got no signal after the connection, but it works properly with USB connections with other devices (including my mobile).  I have also followed the instructions (i.e. turn on i5 before plugging in USB cable and connect the player to the DAC) and tried all the settings in i5.

Any advice?


When you said the DAC got no signal after the connection, I assume you men i5 got no signal after the connection?

I have checked out the Cambridge Audio 851N briefly, apparently this player only provide digital out from its coaxial and Toslink connections (maybe the AES/EBU on top right corner as well). The USB ports on top left are probably designed for "storage" purpose. There is a USB-B connectors but that is marked as USB Audio INPUT only.



Please check with Cambridge Audio if 851N supports USB Audio output, and ask if they have setup or special instruction to enable this function.
 
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Feb 24, 2017 at 6:54 AM Post #2,873 of 3,742
Please try several times!

I downloaded it three times and got the correct file (201, 678, 848 byte).



Thanks!
Already did it (from other sources)  - works great with my dacportable.


The domestic (Chinese) version firmware is located at our web-server in Mainland China, and from what I understand, most Internet Service Providers won't devote a lot of resource to build a data backbone to and from China, so the connection is kind of unreliable.

For the benefit of our oversee users, we have established an off-shore service to host the International version firmware in Hong Kong, so you should have similar problem with the International version firmware. If anyone wants to try out the domestic version firmware, you can contact me by PM, and I'll download the firmware and put it up on my Google drive for short term.
 
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Feb 24, 2017 at 8:29 AM Post #2,874 of 3,742
  For other devices (including mobile) which works OK, I connect to the "USB Audio In" near the bottom right-hand corner of your photo.  


On Cayin i5, make sure you set Connect Mode to USB mode.
There are USB, MTP and DAC modes as well.
 
Feb 24, 2017 at 8:43 AM Post #2,875 of 3,742
Yeah, that has happened to me sometimes too. I think it's a memory management issue. Hopefully it will be corrected in a future update.


You are quite right that this most of the system crash in android are related to memory management issue. My i5 does crash occasionally, by occasionally I mean roughly one to two times per week.

Base on my personal experience, installing more third party application does increase the frequency of system crash. I don't know for sure but one of the Android customization of i5 related to the memory structure: the internal memory of i5 are split into 4GB system + 32GB Data. this might introduce incompatibility to certain app or hidden background tasks, especially the latter which are normally hidden in the system memory. This is a design that improve the performance of the stock HiBy Music Player and Cayin has put priority on native playback over compatibility of third party applications.
 
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Feb 24, 2017 at 8:47 AM Post #2,876 of 3,742
Yep, that one!
EDIT: Today I'm experiencing the first issue with the 256 GB card. The cover art of many albums doesn't show after a while in the "Artist" tab navigation. I think it's a memory related problem, so not a big deal, but I report it nonetheless. I would recommend everyone obesessed with cover tagging to choose jpg's no bigger than 500kb for the tag. It seems to reduce the impact of this issue a lot.


What is the resolution of your album art files? i5 has suggested resolution upto 1000x1000 in our specification. Higher resolution might works, but will become unstable occasionally.
 
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Feb 24, 2017 at 9:13 AM Post #2,877 of 3,742
As part of the UK Tour Leg of the Cayin i5 World Tour my turn has finally come. I've got the i5 now and have been listening to what was left on there and my 256Gb card. ABing with the Aune M1S- in my opinion it thrashes the M1S. ABing with the Ibasso DX100 - that is much much closer. The DX100 wins narrowly for SQ. For everything else - speed, versatility, looks. battery life it's a no contest win for the i5. Price wise - there's £100 between the i5 and the DX100 second hand. It's a dead heat for me between the 2. I shall if time permits do a sound file of all 3 - but the i5 has impressed me greatly.


That's a very good start, looking forward to a detail impression.

By the way, I was a DX100 user, hang on with DX100 for a long time and finally replaced that by N6, and that's how I hooked up with Cayin. Although I don't have the DX100 to compare side by side right now, but the DX100 does offer better sound quality when compare with i5 base on my memory. By the way, the designer of DX100 has developed a new ES9018 based DAP recently, check out the Oriolus DP100 if you had the opportunity, probably not exactly your expected DX100 successor but it certainly worth checking out.
 
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Feb 24, 2017 at 9:52 AM Post #2,878 of 3,742
just subbed after hearing more of this on a different thread.
kudos to cayin for one of the nicest layouts (pics, illustrations, explanations) on the i5.
http://en.cayin.cn/products_info?itemid=87

currently using an ipod touch 6 paired with either a dragonfly red or chord mojo.
(love the ipod as it allows me to stream my tidal hifi and play the offline songs,
in additon to alac, flac etc)...but i am open to a new DAP if it can match
my current combo's SQ and versatility.
(would be nice to just have one great sounding, lightweight, versatile device)


ipod touch 6 + Chord mojo, that's not a popular transport by today's standard, but I think it'll work very well sounds very good for the price. I guess if you are not interested in Hi-Res or DSD experience, the Cayin i5 probably won't offer better sound quality then your current stack, but it will sound very different, to a level that you probably need some time to adjust to it. Check out Glassmonky's review (#Audio Quality) or our previous discussion on this topic, this will give you some insight to the sound signature of i5 DAP.

But if you are looking for an alternative from lightweight and versatile perspective, then i5 should perform very well under these headings. :beerchug:
 
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Feb 24, 2017 at 9:56 AM Post #2,879 of 3,742
For other devices (including mobile) which works OK, I connect to the "USB Audio In" near the bottom right-hand corner of your photo.  


The Cambridge Audio 851N has built-in DAC, the USB Audio in connector will accept USB digital signal INTO the network work and decode it with its internal DAC, it won't, theoretically, output USB Audio signal from that connector, that's why the i5 is not responding, because there is no audio bit-stream coming from Cambridge Audio 851N to Cayin i5 with the way you connected.
 
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Feb 24, 2017 at 10:11 AM Post #2,880 of 3,742
The Cambridge Audio 851N has built-in DAC, the USB Audio in connector will accept USB digital signal INTO the network work and decode it with its internal DAC, it won't, theoretically, output USB Audio signal from that connector, that's why the i5 is not responding, because there is no audio bit-stream coming from Cambridge Audio 851N to Cayin i5 with the way you connected.
I think I have misunderstood the function of the new firmware. Is it that i5 cannot be digital source for the music to be played through an external DAC via USB connection?
 

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