Gustard X20 DAC | Page 42 | Headphone Reviews and Discussion - Head-Fi.org

WB2016 · Apr 18, 2016 at 12:39 PM

Hi G,

well if you really go TOTL tapes, 1" there is nothing better. At the moment the United Home Audio Tape Decks such as their Phase 12 is currently and also in the future the non-plus-ultra. Digital will not match that no matter what you do for the simple reason that you can listen to the "actual" (improved copies) master tapes. It is considered the top source component in existance. The tapes are what is recorded on then you need to transfer it to digital meaning digitalize and something always gets lost. The amount of information on a good master tape is just mindboggling and it is all analog. They are truely magical.

However a big caveat emtor as you mentioned it is a lot of work and the tapes are really expensinve. Not something to do with friends or when you have had a few drinks... But the tapes are what are turned into digital or even vinyl or cds or SACDs it is worth it to go to a highend show and hear it. Own it is a matter of having the funds and I would always have a digital setup and some vinyl at home.

Again IMO it comes down to how to enjoy your music and not loosing that childlike abandon when listening to music. I like longer listening sessions so continuously getting up and interupting is not ideal. Hey I like having a remote on my office setup should tell you something :wink:

If you can loose yourself in music that is quite something priceless.

Yeah analog is much more involving, but that is also what gives the music value. The haptic of holding the record and the buying and owning give it a different value and makes you listen to a whole album that is easily lost on digital if not careful. However knowing that I will also go for a HP setup in the office due to space, coworkers, clients, convenience and not being able to interupt what I am doing every song :wink:

Closing this argument I am really pleased that in digital for midfi prices we are beginning to encroach on highend while maintaining the convenience of digital. We do most of this to be able to value and experience the music so whatever works for you to experience it the most go for it.

There used to be a rule of thumb for installers, to get the same sound quality on speaker setup compared to a HP setup you will often spend about TEN times as much! This includes room treatment, measurement, pleasing wives, power provision and conditioning, long runs of cables, sufficiently big amps to fill a room, equalizing, installer payments, resonance and EM control, etc. Of course especially today there are plenty of exceptions but if you want 20hz-45khz perfect in a speaker setup sometimes building a custom room is the least expensive option. Or as the evil joke goes getting rid of the wife/GF/partner is the most cost effective :wink:

So for anyone on a budget HPs and digital is the way to go, add some tubes if you like the analog feeling and you will be 95% satisfied. Spend the rest on what makes you happy, e.g. more music or other hobbies or your partner. Noone will be 100% satisfied for long. You will always chase the dragon, so enjoy the path not the goal :wink:

To end this, from what I am hearing on other boards, such as the Elise the Gustard X20 when properly burned in (>300h) will give you most of the benefits of a highend sabre dac, which includes a minimization of trebble and diggity sound issues, while giving you the benefits of the 9018 chip in detail and soundstage. Also seems to work well with tubes and on SE, which was essential for my Feliks Elise that is about to come :wink:

So it is looking more and more as if I will take the plunge next month. Gives the R2R Dacs a run for their money unless you are looking for that sound and with good tubes you want the detail in the source and the coloration later IMO.

Cheers
WB

ginetto61 · Apr 18, 2016 at 3:14 PM

Hi !
Unfortunately given my current situation analog is not an option.
I read comments from the audio fairs on the tapes you mention. There must be really something.
Now i am concentrate on digital in order to get a decent performance that for me means above all low listening fatigue.
I had some digital sources and after some listening i used to get nervous. The sound was not relaxing.
On this basis now i look for digital with relaxed sound.
And i have to say that with HPs is even easier to get nervous because HPs are not able to give a soundstage that is natural. There is no mixing between the two channels.
One element of the chain that i am focusing now, as i have already some dacs to try, is the usb to spdif converter.
I am following a very interesting thread here. If i get a very good converter able to mitigate the usual problems with a pc source that could come the corner stone of my digital rig.
Even if i will change dac i could always go on using it.
I understand that the execution quality of the usb port in the dacs is not always top notch.
A good interface should cost around 300USD. Even if i will save money for this very interesting Gustard i could always use it if better than the usb port on the X20.
However i see also another cheaper Gustard ... the x12.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/GUSTARD-DAC-X12-DAC-ES9018-OPTIC-Coaxial-XMOS-USB-Asynchronous-384KHZ-DSD64-128-/121187114115?hash=item1c37509c83:g:A8AAAOSw0e9Uw3bn

Maybe in a average system could be just fine enough.
Great Brand this Gustard and with product of excellent quality/price ratio.
Thanks again, gino

WB2016 · Apr 18, 2016 at 6:21 PM

ginetto61 said:
Hi !

Unfortunately given my current situation analog is not an option.

I read comments from the audio fairs on the tapes you mention. There must be really something.

Now i am concentrate on digital in order to get a decent performance that for me means above all low listening fatigue.

I had some digital sources and after some listening i used to get nervous. The sound was not relaxing.

On this basis now i look for digital with relaxed sound.

And i have to say that with HPs is even easier to get nervous because HPs are not able to give a soundstage that is natural. There is no mixing between the two channels.

One element of the chain that i am focusing now, as i have already some dacs to try, is the usb to spdif converter.

I am following a very interesting thread here. If i get a very good converter able to mitigate the usual problems with a pc source that could come the corner stone of my digital rig.

Even if i will change dac i could always go on using it.

I understand that the execution quality of the usb port in the dacs is not always top notch.

A good interface should cost around 300USD. Even if i will save money for this very interesting Gustard i could always use it if better than the usb port on the X20.

However i see also another cheaper Gustard ... the x12.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/GUSTARD-DAC-X12-DAC-ES9018-OPTIC-Coaxial-XMOS-USB-Asynchronous-384KHZ-DSD64-128-/121187114115?hash=item1c37509c83:g:A8AAAOSw0e9Uw3bn

Maybe in a average system could be just fine enough.

Great Brand this Gustard and with product of excellent quality/price ratio.

Thanks again, gino

Yeah that is jitter sensitivity. The HP are direct, there is no natural reverb and dispersion so you really need to make sure that your source for the sourece :wink:

like that but its true, is good. There is Wired 4 Sound's has some solutions Remedy??? or called something similar that I have heard are a good option, but first make sure that inputs and signal is goodm into the DAC.

Not sure if you are using a desktop, but be sure to connect to the usb ports closest the motherboard. You will get a lot of jitter when you connect to the usb ports on the front of a tower for example.

Getting a X12 I cannot comment on but making sure you have the supply sorted will affect everything down the chain.

Make sure to get some relaxed and not bright headphones, for a low budget the X2s by Fidelio are a good option and have a nice bass and treble for 250$ although they are not neutral more V shape.

Good Luck
WB

ginetto61 · Apr 19, 2016 at 12:21 PM

wb2016 said:
Yeah that is jitter sensitivity. The HP are direct, there is no natural reverb and dispersion so you really need to make sure that your source for the sourece

like that but its true, is good.

Good evening ! Even if i am forced to use HPs for various reasons i love HPs a lot. The only thing i really miss is the front image. I can get now the sound nicely out of my head but not coming from the front.
I have learnt that without some kind of processing this is impossible to get. For now i have to live with that. In the future maybe ...

There is Wired 4 Sound's has some solutions Remedy??? or called something similar that I have heard are a good option, but first make sure that inputs and signal is goodm into the DAC.
Not sure if you are using a desktop, but be sure to connect to the usb ports closest the motherboard. You will get a lot of jitter when you connect to the usb ports on the front of a tower for example.

Thanks a lot for the valuable advice. I have one desktop and one laptop. I will follow your instructions for sure.
USB is a strange beats. At the beginning there were a lot of positive comments and now i see many disappointed.
I think that is important to take of the isolation from the pc power and noises as a first.
Also the XMOS chips of last generations are very good indeed from what i understand.
So my understanding is that a decent pc with the right usp to spdif converter can be an excellent digital source indeed.

Quote:

Getting a X12 I cannot comment on but making sure you have the supply sorted will affect everything down the chain.

i have found a review on youtube. The tester was mentioning the extreme lack of noise, a very good thing and quite uncommon with digital. Often there is a high Hz hiss when the volume is raised to max
I think that this brand is outputting very good products with an excellent quality/price ratio indeed. It would cost me around 500 USD. But first i would like to give a chance to what i have already.

Make sure to get some relaxed and not bright headphones, for a low budget the X2s by Fidelio are a good option and have a nice bass and treble for 250$ although they are not neutral more V shape.
Good Luck
WB

I read great things about them in this forum and i like them a low aesthetically .. the build quality seems very high indeed
I am using now the AKG k501 that i love a lot. Even more than the k701.
But i keep high on the list of most wanted the Fidelio. They are very nice.
Thanks a lot again, gino

Triplefun · Apr 20, 2016 at 7:25 AM

There's an interesting review of PS Audios latest NuWave DSD DAC based on the Sabre32 Hyperstream DAC chip. It supports DSD128 for both native and DoP. See the review on page 111 of Stereophile May 2016. Cost is US$1299. The sound is similar to the PS Audio DirectStream. Would be interesting to see it compares to the X20u. Better still, to know what plans Gustard have for the Hyperstream?

WB2016 · Apr 20, 2016 at 7:58 AM

ginetto61 said:
Good evening ! Even if i am forced to use HPs for various reasons i love HPs a lot. The only thing i really miss is the front image. I can get now the sound nicely out of my head but not coming from the front.
I have learnt that without some kind of processing this is impossible to get. For now i have to live with that. In the future maybe ...

Thanks a lot for the valuable advice. I have one desktop and one laptop. I will follow your instructions for sure.
USB is a strange beats. At the beginning there were a lot of positive comments and now i see many disappointed.
I think that is important to take of the isolation from the pc power and noises as a first.
Also the XMOS chips of last generations are very good indeed from what i understand.
So my understanding is that a decent pc with the right usp to spdif converter can be an excellent digital source indeed.

Quote:

i have found a review on youtube. The tester was mentioning the extreme lack of noise, a very good thing and quite uncommon with digital. Often there is a high Hz hiss when the volume is raised to max
I think that this brand is outputting very good products with an excellent quality/price ratio indeed. It would cost me around 500 USD. But first i would like to give a chance to what i have already.

I read great things about them in this forum and i like them a low aesthetically .. the build quality seems very high indeed
I am using now the AKG k501 that i love a lot. Even more than the k701.
But i keep high on the list of most wanted the Fidelio. They are very nice.
Thanks a lot again, gino

As you know there a 3D options but there will be differences non the less.

USB is convenience and a standard but many developers hate it due to noise and that being the limiting factor to a DAC and the power supply. Also if you get power over usb or only info makes a big difference. Still the standard and what people will measure a DAC by. Yeah you can go SPDIF but that will limit you to 96/24 which is good enough unless you have a lot of high res. Often sounds better as well because the least amount of processing is required. Lost of options worst IMO is getting signal and power from your usb. Also another factor is not running CPU above 40% if possible, which should not be an issue for most. For me it still is the measure of a DAC how it handles USB. I want to use the other inputs for CD, TV etc. I want to use USB for computer based input. But that is just me.

XMOS should be good some prefer Aamareo??? but as long as it is handled well who cares.

Well you need to save some money a good chasis is expensive and European styling often comes at a price. But you will likely get 90%+ of the X20 by going with the X12, a bigger impact will be handling of noise than the difference in models. Spend the savings on something else such as a headphone and clean source, will have more impact.

Cheers
WB

taxman2 · Apr 20, 2016 at 10:27 AM

Hi, I've just signed up to head-fi. I've received the X-20 yesterday. Previously I was using SMSL M8 with iMac 2009 and A+. I was very exited over the new upgrade. I do not upsample and use usb connection and DoP. It is very strange (usually with SMSL M8 the top left corner of A+ shows bit depth 32 and sample rate 44.1 kHz when playing flac) with X-20 it shows - 16/ 44.1 kHz. In the Audio MIDI Setup it shows xCORE USB Audio 2.0 Output (0 in/2 out). No input and Output max depth is 2 channel 24bit Integer. Under SMSL M8 shows xCORE USB Audio 2.0 (2 in/2 out) Output max depth - 2 channel 32bit Integer. I wonder whether there is something wrong with xCore USB card. I will appreciate your advice and experience. Thank you in advance for your time of helping me out.

Quadman · Apr 20, 2016 at 3:20 PM

I have now had my X20u for over 6 weeks and I wanted to update my experience with this vastly underrated DAC. My X20u is no longer stock as I have performed almost all of the Mods Ric does in his level 1 mod package (tweakaudio.com) click on Gustard Mods. Some of these mods are very easy to perform and just require opening the top and some common sense, others require a good soldering iron and good soldering skills and patience and will void your warranty, but really are you going to send this dac back to China to get repaired? If you want to take this DAC to its highest level I suggest getting the level 1 Mod package.

Let me preface any further comments with how I listen to this DAC. I built a dedicated windows 10 pro audio computer, with a small 120 Gb SSD for OS and audio programs, 8 Gb ram, and an i7-4790 processor. The motherboard is a gigabyte H81n with a dac-up usb port. My music is stored on an external USB attached HDD. I use an AQ Jitterbug at the dac-up usb port and a modest usb cable from the jitterbug to an uptone regen at the dac input. For audio programs I use Roon integrated with HQPlayer and Tidal. I up sample all music signals to DSD128. Looking forward to the day I can do DSD 256 and hopefully DSD512.

I am blessed to have a very high-resolution stereo playback system. Both Vinyl and digital based. The TT is a well-known English table with a $5K cartridge. I have been a friend with Wally, from Wally set up tools for over 25 years and I am highly skilled in TT and cartridge set up. My vinyl is very good. Digital is as described above. Speakers are actually designed by Wally with input from many very knowledgeable engineers. They use Audio technology drivers and Raal ribbon tweeter in a D'appolito configuration. They can extend down to 20Hz and are very transparent. My amps are the wonderful Wyetech 211C, single ended and capable of 18 watts per channel with 70-watt peaks. The speakers are very amp friendly and we run only the mids and tweeter with the SE amp, the bass is handled by a 250 watt custom SS amp, we also EQ only the bass signal. I have been an audiophile for over 25 years with many systems and rooms over the years; this is not my first rodeo.

I apologize for the long preamble, but felt it necessary to back up what I am about to say and so you can understand how I run this dac. This DAC in its level 1 modification state is a paradigm shift in my listening experiences. I now experience music at a level, I previously thought took mid 6 figures to achieve. The transparency, layering of information, palpable presence of ALL performers, geometrical size of sound stage (both width and depth), tonality, dynamics, density of information… go down the check list are all there. I performed the last of level 1 mod about 10 days ago and since all listening has left me gob smacked (love that word). I hear everything; even that percussionist in the far back of the orchestra has a presence, depth and clarity that before were just a blend with the music. A perfect example I was listening to a Sibelius Violin concerto, conducted by Walter Hendl with the Chicago symphony and Jascha Heifetz on Violin, this was a reference LP for me, one I have heard hundreds of times. About half way thru a tympani comes in and with the LP you were clearly aware of it and its location. The musician keeps striking the tympani softly as the movement progresses, on vinyl you heard the soft rumble of the tympani to the right and deep in the stage. With the Gustard you are now aware of each soft strike of the mallet on the skin of the tympani and the expansion of air within the kettle, layers and layers of information. My jaw dropped as I never heard that level of resolution and presence before thru any other system. I hear the same type of effect on jazz, rock, blues what ever. Musicians that before blended into the musical soundscape now had presence and body with precise location and clarity. I now hear music in an entirely different way, paradigm shift.

Now I have not compared this dac to other mega or mid-priced dac’s as Knoxville has a very quiet audiophile group, if one at all. Best I can do is compare it to my LP playback system and previous dac the NAD M51. On poorer and older CD’s originals from the 80’s the LP still has a edge, but it is close. On better digital recordings I have to give it to the DAC, soundstage size is superior, Transparency is superior, dynamics are superior, location within the sound field is superior and yes even tonality I give an edge to the DAC.

I have to ask myself, why am I shouting to the high heavens about a DAC made in China, that has no dealer network or support for in the USA. I guess it comes down to value and bang for the buck and my excitement about its performance. This dac proved to be a paradigm shift for me, yet because of it’s price it will NOT be taken seriously by audiophiles. How could it possibly be as good as the Vega, yggy, PS Audio Direct Stream on and on….. without comparing I don’t know, except no other audio product in my 25+ years and trade shows have shifted my perception on music playback like this piece does. I believe Marty when he did his mini dac shootout and called the Gustard the best (and his was stock) and that the Vega just missed the little details. The Gustard does not miss the little details.

My next step is to try to get up to DSD512 and that new F1 card based on the new Xmos xCORE200 series chip that has been released sounds very promising. There is supposed to be an all in one DDC coming out in May based on this card that may give the Gustard a chance to play DSD512 via I2S with a board that is SOTA. I can’t wait to see where this goes. Then we can go play with the T&A Dac 8DSD and see where the Gustard stands. It is WAY above its price point.

WB2016 · Apr 21, 2016 at 2:10 PM

quadman said:
I have now had my X20u for over 6 weeks and I wanted to update my experience with this vastly underrated DAC. My X20u is no longer stock as I have performed almost all of the Mods Ric does in his level 1 mod package (tweakaudio.com) click on Gustard Mods. Some of these mods are very easy to perform and just require opening the top and some common sense, others require a good soldering iron and good soldering skills and patience and will void your warranty, but really are you going to send this dac back to China to get repaired? If you want to take this DAC to its highest level I suggest getting the level 1 Mod package.

Let me preface any further comments with how I listen to this DAC. I built a dedicated windows 10 pro audio computer, with a small 120 Gb SSD for OS and audio programs, 8 Gb ram, and an i7-4790 processor. The motherboard is a gigabyte H81n with a dac-up usb port. My music is stored on an external USB attached HDD. I use an AQ Jitterbug at the dac-up usb port and a modest usb cable from the jitterbug to an uptone regen at the dac input. For audio programs I use Roon integrated with HQPlayer and Tidal. I up sample all music signals to DSD128. Looking forward to the day I can do DSD 256 and hopefully DSD512.

I am blessed to have a very high-resolution stereo playback system. Both Vinyl and digital based. The TT is a well-known English table with a $5K cartridge. I have been a friend with Wally, from Wally set up tools for over 25 years and I am highly skilled in TT and cartridge set up. My vinyl is very good. Digital is as described above. Speakers are actually designed by Wally with input from many very knowledgeable engineers. They use Audio technology drivers and Raal ribbon tweeter in a D'appolito configuration. They can extend down to 20Hz and are very transparent. My amps are the wonderful Wyetech 211C, single ended and capable of 18 watts per channel with 70-watt peaks. The speakers are very amp friendly and we run only the mids and tweeter with the SE amp, the bass is handled by a 250 watt custom SS amp, we also EQ only the bass signal. I have been an audiophile for over 25 years with many systems and rooms over the years; this is not my first rodeo.

I apologize for the long preamble, but felt it necessary to back up what I am about to say and so you can understand how I run this dac. This DAC in its level 1 modification state is a paradigm shift in my listening experiences. I now experience music at a level, I previously thought took mid 6 figures to achieve. The transparency, layering of information, palpable presence of ALL performers, geometrical size of sound stage (both width and depth), tonality, dynamics, density of information… go down the check list are all there. I performed the last of level 1 mod about 10 days ago and since all listening has left me gob smacked (love that word). I hear everything; even that percussionist in the far back of the orchestra has a presence, depth and clarity that before were just a blend with the music. A perfect example I was listening to a Sibelius Violin concerto, conducted by Walter Hendl with the Chicago symphony and Jascha Heifetz on Violin, this was a reference LP for me, one I have heard hundreds of times. About half way thru a tympani comes in and with the LP you were clearly aware of it and its location. The musician keeps striking the tympani softly as the movement progresses, on vinyl you heard the soft rumble of the tympani to the right and deep in the stage. With the Gustard you are now aware of each soft strike of the mallet on the skin of the tympani and the expansion of air within the kettle, layers and layers of information. My jaw dropped as I never heard that level of resolution and presence before thru any other system. I hear the same type of effect on jazz, rock, blues what ever. Musicians that before blended into the musical soundscape now had presence and body with precise location and clarity. I now hear music in an entirely different way, paradigm shift.

Now I have not compared this dac to other mega or mid-priced dac’s as Knoxville has a very quiet audiophile group, if one at all. Best I can do is compare it to my LP playback system and previous dac the NAD M51. On poorer and older CD’s originals from the 80’s the LP still has a edge, but it is close. On better digital recordings I have to give it to the DAC, soundstage size is superior, Transparency is superior, dynamics are superior, location within the sound field is superior and yes even tonality I give an edge to the DAC.

I have to ask myself, why am I shouting to the high heavens about a DAC made in China, that has no dealer network or support for in the USA. I guess it comes down to value and bang for the buck and my excitement about its performance. This dac proved to be a paradigm shift for me, yet because of it’s price it will NOT be taken seriously by audiophiles. How could it possibly be as good as the Vega, yggy, PS Audio Direct Stream on and on….. without comparing I don’t know, except no other audio product in my 25+ years and trade shows have shifted my perception on music playback like this piece does. I believe Marty when he did his mini dac shootout and called the Gustard the best (and his was stock) and that the Vega just missed the little details. The Gustard does not miss the little details.

My next step is to try to get up to DSD512 and that new F1 card based on the new Xmos xCORE200 series chip that has been released sounds very promising. There is supposed to be an all in one DDC coming out in May based on this card that may give the Gustard a chance to play DSD512 via I2S with a board that is SOTA. I can’t wait to see where this goes. Then we can go play with the T&A Dac 8DSD and see where the Gustard stands. It is WAY above its price point.

Wow those are some bold statements! Especially the comparison to the TT. Just curious what is the English TT, SME 20 would fit with the rest if I took a guess? Neutrality monster and probably the swiss watches of manufacturing TTs.

Agree with you on the perception of value through spending. Simple psychological phenomenon that also works in initiation rituals and the accompaning hazing, or when joining the army, the more you have to pay and suffer the more you will value the membership. A form of cognitive dissonance sets in that has to justify the suffering and in turn makes you value something more. If you don't have that you don't value something. Similar phenomenon happens with digital music in general vs vinyl. The investment makes the thing valuable, the time attention, money, etc. Extremely difficult to fight those psychological affects. Reading comments such as this might help :wink:

Interesting you also "just" using a jitterbug and uptone regen and getting very good results. Any power and voltage conditioning to the rest of the chain?

Thanks for the post, well towards the end of the month I will try to make the plunge and try it out.

Cheers
WB

Triplefun · Apr 21, 2016 at 2:39 PM

Thanks for the review. It has made my day!

Quadman · Apr 21, 2016 at 3:00 PM

@WB2016 It's a 30MK2 (it replaced a 20), I thought long and hard about making those comments, because for years I was 95% vinyl and enjoyed it very, very much it always was more organic and whole than digital. One of the first big differences I noticed was with analog all the performers, even to the side and back had a 3D type (palpable presence) image, it was not flat like you hear with digital. The main center performer on both formats had that 3D, palpable presence but digital just did not match vinyl throughout the stage, flatter and less involving. Density of information was lacking in digital. Then along comes this DAC and its modifications (trust me when I say diode change and coax cable change really opened it up). The stage is huge now with layers and layers of information all with wonderful palpable presence. Highs are pristine, bass has incredible tonality, definition and extension. I have only heard one other system that has a stage similar to this and that was a $300K+ system in a bigger room than mine with the speakers pulled out 11 feet from back wall (mine are only 8 1/2 ft from back wall). It truly was a paradigm shift for me.

Stock the Gustard is really good, modded it transcends; at least in my system/room combination.

Really nothing special on the AC front, Furutech outlets at wall, really nice home made AC power strips (no filtering) homemade ac cables with furutech or watt gate plugs. Have made pretty nice linear PSU's for my HDD, Regen and preamp. I do have a lot of homemade acoustical treatment up in the room and have a very nice reverb time of around .38 seconds as measured by audiomatica's clio system. Picture below. Of course your results may vary, how much of it is the amp/speaker/room interface? but I have not had another piece do what the X20u does in that room or any other room.

Triplefun · Apr 21, 2016 at 4:35 PM

Great set up and obviously the source for great enjoyment. It's a shame Gustard don't have a presence on this forum and make available a 'modded' X21. Most of the mods would not add much to the production process. Makes me wonder how many X20 units they have actually sold. Their only real marketing is word of mouth and this forum.

fperra · Apr 21, 2016 at 5:41 PM

triplefun said:
Great set up and obviously the source for great enjoyment. It's a shame Gustard don't have a presence on this forum and make available a 'modded' X21. Most of the mods would not add much to the production process. Makes me wonder how many X20 units they have actually sold. Their only real marketing is word of mouth and this forum.

I suspect there is a large market in Chine.

WB2016 · Apr 21, 2016 at 8:46 PM

quadman said:
@WB2016 It's a 30MK2 (it replaced a 20), I thought long and hard about making those comments, because for years I was 95% vinyl and enjoyed it very, very much it always was more organic and whole than digital. One of the first big differences I noticed was with analog all the performers, even to the side and back had a 3D type (palpable presence) image, it was not flat like you hear with digital. The main center performer on both formats had that 3D, palpable presence but digital just did not match vinyl throughout the stage, flatter and less involving. Density of information was lacking in digital. Then along comes this DAC and its modifications (trust me when I say diode change and coax cable change really opened it up). The stage is huge now with layers and layers of information all with wonderful palpable presence. Highs are pristine, bass has incredible tonality, definition and extension. I have only heard one other system that has a stage similar to this and that was a $300K+ system in a bigger room than mine with the speakers pulled out 11 feet from back wall (mine are only 8 1/2 ft from back wall). It truly was a paradigm shift for me.

Stock the Gustard is really good, modded it transcends; at least in my system/room combination.

Really nothing special on the AC front, Furutech outlets at wall, really nice home made AC power strips (no filtering) homemade ac cables with furutech or watt gate plugs. Have made pretty nice linear PSU's for my HDD, Regen and preamp. I do have a lot of homemade acoustical treatment up in the room and have a very nice reverb time of around .38 seconds as measured by audiomatica's clio system. Picture below. Of course your results may vary, how much of it is the amp/speaker/room interface? but I have not had another piece do what the X20u does in that room or any other room.

Sounded like your setup would match with SME very well, the 30 MK2 is very nice indeed and shows the level of analog we are talking about here and why I can really give a different weight to your statements regarding the DAC. Also to the overall balancing of the system and the room conditioning, placement and the matching shows either a very good installer and/or very knowledgable with good ear, so this to me gives a different weight to those statements that have to be taken with a grain of salt. I think you have me and most other people sold at his point :wink:

The ex-installer (actually just a humble mostly ex-employee of a very high-end discreet clientel installer friend of mine) in me would be curious how that would compare to a TotalDac tube MK2 or even a whole system Totaldac twelve. I consider that the non-plus ultra of R2R dacs giving all the details of the best sabre implementations. Any experinece there, usually go very well with SME systems. We often install both together frequently even though the Chronos got a bit of hype this year.

By the way nice system, budget conscious high end. Meaning nowing where to spend the money to have the desired effect and not shying back from testing. Congrats.

That was quite a journey, and then risking such a change and putting yourself out there, hats off to you.

Take Care,
WB

WB2016 · Apr 21, 2016 at 8:58 PM

quadman said:
@WB2016 It's a 30MK2 (it replaced a 20), I thought long and hard about making those comments, because for years I was 95% vinyl and enjoyed it very, very much it always was more organic and whole than digital. One of the first big differences I noticed was with analog all the performers, even to the side and back had a 3D type (palpable presence) image, it was not flat like you hear with digital. The main center performer on both formats had that 3D, palpable presence but digital just did not match vinyl throughout the stage, flatter and less involving. Density of information was lacking in digital. Then along comes this DAC and its modifications (trust me when I say diode change and coax cable change really opened it up). The stage is huge now with layers and layers of information all with wonderful palpable presence. Highs are pristine, bass has incredible tonality, definition and extension. I have only heard one other system that has a stage similar to this and that was a $300K+ system in a bigger room than mine with the speakers pulled out 11 feet from back wall (mine are only 8 1/2 ft from back wall). It truly was a paradigm shift for me.

Stock the Gustard is really good, modded it transcends; at least in my system/room combination.

Really nothing special on the AC front, Furutech outlets at wall, really nice home made AC power strips (no filtering) homemade ac cables with furutech or watt gate plugs. Have made pretty nice linear PSU's for my HDD, Regen and preamp. I do have a lot of homemade acoustical treatment up in the room and have a very nice reverb time of around .38 seconds as measured by audiomatica's clio system. Picture below. Of course your results may vary, how much of it is the amp/speaker/room interface? but I have not had another piece do what the X20u does in that room or any other room.

Hi,
Quadman, forgot to comment on the electricity treatment, which is good but not excessive, meaning having a not overly finicky system and that the X20 would also likely not be excessively finicky to current, which can be a bit of an issue for some dacs.

Still prefer the feeling of vinyl mostly but its becoming exceedingly difficult to justify the hype, work and cost. Now just stay away from tape decks. By the sound of it that would be the only thing that could get you back to analog it seems. The UHA decks are very nice indeed :wink:

Keep us posted on the dsd512.

Cheers WB

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