Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › [Review] Brainwavz HM5, A New Neutral Champ
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[Review] Brainwavz HM5, A New Neutral Champ - Page 12

post #166 of 1678

Not quite. Neutrality has an odd definition in that nothing is really 100% about neutrality other than flat mids. Some "neutral" headphones roll off the 2khz frequency area, while other "neutral" headphones maintain the same emphasis on those areas. Some neutral headphones roll off the lower bass like many dynamic flagships, while other keep it extended like the LCD-2 and other orthodynamics or the electrostatics. Sometimes the treble is rolled off for a smooth "neutral" sound, other times the upper treble isn't for a bright "neutral." There's no true consensus besides having the mids flat up to 1khz.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by atomikn00b View Post

 

interestingly enough, i was thinking why are people trying to match the sound to the graph? listen and judge. your ears are not the same as the measuring equipment. i compared what i heard to the brainwavz m2 graph (when i had it) and it was similar but nowhere near the same.

but w/e. like i said. i'll speak once i get the chance to listen.

anywayz.

what's a general consensus on what neutrality sounds like. i assume it's pretty much hearing everything evenly?

 



 

post #167 of 1678

Don't forget FA-003s were at one point LFF's favourite cans, for his mastering work. But he has since moved on to his fully modded T50RPs. T50RPs have the potential to sound like $1000 headphones. Jude said the Thunderpants sound as good as some other top-tier flagships, only with a bit less technicality.

 

There's also sample variance with the same product, differences in our own hearing frequency response, and preferences in music genres and sound signature. We, audiophiles, like to think our prefered sound signature is neutral...


Edited by kingpage - 12/26/11 at 9:19pm
post #168 of 1678
Thread Starter 

When trying to determine whether a headphone is neutral or not, I usually put on something with fantastic mastering, usually a MFSL remaster, or similar. Rage Against the Machine's first album is great for this even, it has excellent production.

post #169 of 1678
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingpage View Post

Neutrality is different from person to person. And when FA-003 was reviewed by LFF and other people, the graphs at innerfidelity were not available to influence what people think of the cans. Although I do think FR curves are very useful and indicative of the 'phones actual sound, there is merit when people say we shouldn't read too much into the graphs. It's interesting that nobody focused on the dips and peaks of the FA-003s before all the measurement.

 

Now that we have at least three different FR graphs for the FA-003, it is not surprising that we would "hear" what the graphs say.


I do agree that graphs don't tell the whole picture, but they serve a verse useful purpose. Sometimes they help point out off spots that your ears may have had trouble detecting. Of course, it's not wise to follow the graphs blindly. As I've said, graphs don't tell the whole picture. It's good to be objective, I think, but no amount of measurements can exactly describe how your individual ears/brain will interpret the sound.

 

That said, I personally never looked too hard at the FA-003 graphs before hearing my HM5s. When I put them on, I was confused by how far off they sounded from being "neutral". Had I gotten a broken pair? Were my ears entirely broken? I then took a harder look at the FA-003 graphs, which just happened to match up with what I was hearing. Any bass hump like that with a dip at 300Hz adds a very particular characteristic to the sound signature, which I've imitated before while playing around with EQ on other headphones. That's what I was hearing with the HM5, just like the FA-003 graph indicated. 

 

Honestly, I'm not sure how everyone is hearing neutrality on these. It sounds like I'm the only one that hears these as having overly bloated bass with a slightly strange sound signature.

 

post #170 of 1678

I just hope they sell the HM5 here in the Philippines.

post #171 of 1678

Well, I also heard the bloated bass, but like I mentioned before it has gone largely away with burn in. The bass is still boomy or fluffy on its own, but it's contained within its own area where it's not interfering with the rest of the sound if that makes sense. In any case, the overall balance between bass mids and highs is very even to my ears, and by "even" I don't just mean a type of balance which suits my own personal tastes. I mean pretty much equal. They are neutral on that plane. I plan to use them for mixing and mastering myself and I believe they will serve this purpose very well because of that quality. I can work around the uneven bass response. At least they don't have a peaky midrange or any weird spikes in the treble, those are the real deal breakers for me.


Edited by manveru - 12/26/11 at 11:59pm
post #172 of 1678
Quote:
Originally Posted by ironstar View Post

I just hope they sell the HM5 here in the Philippines.



mp4nation does worldwide shipping.

post #173 of 1678

Thanks manveru. I think I'll just ask the store I bought the hm3 if they will sell the hm5 here. smile.gif

post #174 of 1678

Quote:

Originally Posted by manveru View Post

Well, I also heard the bloated bass, but like I mentioned before it has gone largely away with burn in. The bass is still boomy or fluffy on its own, but it's contained within its own area where it's not interfering with the rest of the sound if that makes sense. In any case, the overall balance between bass mids and highs is very even to my ears, and by "even" I don't just mean a type of balance which suits my own personal tastes. I mean pretty much equal. They are neutral on that plane. I plan to use them for mixing and mastering myself and I believe they will serve this purpose very well because of that quality. I can work around the uneven bass response. At least they don't have a peaky midrange or any weird spikes in the treble, those are the real deal breakers for me.


Yes, the mids and highs are actually pretty solid in the HM5. But, in my case, the bass definitely interferes with the sound overall. I don't know how to describe it, but it sounds like someone took a neutral sound signature and added a low "wah" or "wuh" sound over the entire thing. It's like the "wow" sound you get if you continuously plug and unplug your ears in a smooth fashion, if you know what I'm talking about. 

 

Sadly, 50 hours of burn in did nothing for me. I'd go longer, but I only ever hear very mild changes at most after burning in headphones.

 

post #175 of 1678
How is the sound of fully modded T50RP, the 70 tag makes me very skeptical, thanks
post #176 of 1678
Thread Starter 

Claims from many indicate T50RP have the potential to sound as good as $1,000 headphones. I've never heard any of the modded ones with claims as high, but the unmodded ones are definitely very clean sounding.

post #177 of 1678

From what I can see from the impressions at Head-Fi meets, the waterfall CSD plots, and the overall FR, it certainly seems like they can compete at that level if modded well, in the same discussion as the LCD-2 and high end HiFiMen. I have a gut-feeling they're surprisingly close to that level, but not quite there, with a powerful amp and equalizer, but I don't have proof to that yet. 
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by keanex View Post

Claims from many indicate T50RP have the potential to sound as good as $1,000 headphones. I've never heard any of the modded ones with claims as high, but the unmodded ones are definitely very clean sounding.



 

post #178 of 1678

i speak...

 

in regards to the bass. 

please note. no burn in. opened the case, put it on my ears, and played a few tracks. turned into a 3 hr listening session. forgot i had it on.

 

hm5 with no amp = slightly boomy bass. contained in it's own little section. (i know i said don't pay too much attention to the graph but i'm thinking of that 300hz dip). probably amplified in hans's ears because of being accustomed to those darn modded t50 rp's. the hm5 is only $140 US. everything else is clear.

 

hm5 with a measly e5 amp = bass is controlled and tight. high end slightly harsh at first listen. but only with "modern rap/hip-hop" so maybe those are being mastered with slightly bassy headphones. idk. time will tell with that high.

 

subbass. TO MY EARS. it's there. but. that cello doesn't sound quite right. it's got that good car audio with no subwoofer kind of subbass. but then again. the brainwavz m4 iems have kinda spoiled me with subbass that's just right.

 

P.S. covering those vents hans spoke of with my fingers made the sound "plasticy" to my ears but definitely less bass like he said.

and. separation didn't blow me away like i wanted it to. but it's preeeetty good.

 

AND REMEMBER. NOT BURNED IN YET.

post #179 of 1678
Quote:
Originally Posted by atomikn00b View Post

i speak...

 

in regards to the bass. 

please note. no burn in. opened the case, put it on my ears, and played a few tracks. turned into a 3 hr listening session. forgot i had it on.

 

hm5 with no amp = slightly boomy bass. contained in it's own little section. (i know i said don't pay too much attention to the graph but i'm thinking of that 300hz dip). probably amplified in hans's ears because of being accustomed to those darn modded t50 rp's. the hm5 is only $140 US. everything else is clear.

 

hm5 with a measly e5 amp = bass is controlled and tight. high end slightly harsh at first listen. but only with "modern rap/hip-hop" so maybe those are being mastered with slightly bassy headphones. idk. time will tell with that high.

 

subbass. TO MY EARS. it's there. but. that cello doesn't sound quite right. it's got that good car audio with no subwoofer kind of subbass. but then again. the brainwavz m4 iems have kinda spoiled me with subbass that's just right.

 

P.S. covering those vents hans spoke of with my fingers made the sound "plasticy" to my ears but definitely less bass like he said.

and. separation didn't blow me away like i wanted it to. but it's preeeetty good.

 

AND REMEMBER. NOT BURNED IN YET.



Thanks for the impression!

 

I'm still eagerly awaiting my preorder.

post #180 of 1678

Would Anybody be interested in doing this hearing test with their HM5s and another pair of headphones. http://www.digital-recordings.com/cgi-bin/www-ht-pro.cgi

Remember to choose manual instead of auto, after the calibration. You also have the option to change from 5dB to 1dB increments.

 

Pianist did the test with his FA-003s, SRH750 DJ and SM3. Here's the post.


Edited by kingpage - 12/28/11 at 2:13am
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Headphones (full-size)
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › [Review] Brainwavz HM5, A New Neutral Champ