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SeaWorld tragedy: Can whales murder?

post #1 of 79
2/26/10 at 12:42am
Thread Starter 
We had a little debate about this at work and just wondering what other people think. Can a killer whale be a "killer" whale? If an animal kills for food, that can be defended as self-preservation, but what if an animal kills for sport? Does that make it, like a human, a true "killer"?
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post #2 of 79
2/26/10 at 12:47am
Sure. Lots of things can be killers. Mice can be killers.

Only standard humans can murder. No animal has the capacity of mind for moral thought, ergo, no animal can commit murder, irrespective of the motivation for any individual act which results in the death of something else on its part.
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post #3 of 79
2/26/10 at 12:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duggeh View Post
Sure. Lots of things can be killers. Mice can be killers.

Only standard humans can murder. No animal has the capacity of mind for moral thought, ergo, no animal can commit murder, irrespective of the motivation for any individual act which results in the death of something else on its part.
an animal with mens rea, that would be scary
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post #4 of 79
2/26/10 at 12:58am
I dunno bout yer fancy words and thinkings, but I say if a whale be a killin, he be a murderin
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post #5 of 79
2/26/10 at 1:13am
Animals can easily be man-killers. There are enough well documented cases of big cats killing humans and then developing a taste for it and becoming serial killers to prove that any large predatory animal has it within its nature to become a man-killer (though they aren't necessarily born with the instinct). However, as Duggeh has mentioned, of what we know about the mental though processes and behavior of animals in general, animals do not have the mentality to understand murder or be capable of committing murder. For murder to take place, the 'murderer' needs to be capable of understanding what they are setting out to do and what the ramification of doing so is, and animals do not have that ability.
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post #6 of 79
2/26/10 at 1:18am
Well, in a common law state yeah, whales can murder. The mens rea is just extreme recklessness or depraved heart, or in other words, a reckless killing that exhibits indifference to the value of human life. That whale didn't give a damn about the value of the life of his/her trainer so, yeah, thats depraved heart. Can you imagine the whale testifying though
prosecution: "could you please state your name for the record?"
Whale: "killer whale"
Prosecution: "no further questions"
Something tells me a jury would nullify though.

Edit: not to mention PETA would go ballistic.
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post #7 of 79
2/26/10 at 1:31am
I'm glad the animals aren't having the same debate about us.







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post #8 of 79
2/26/10 at 1:40am
wow that picture is huge. I always wondered how rabbits feet were made.
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post #9 of 79
2/26/10 at 1:49am
whoa...
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post #10 of 79
2/26/10 at 1:54am
stop it jax, ur making me hungry
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post #11 of 79
2/26/10 at 2:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by El_Doug View Post
stop it jax, ur making me hungry
Me too. For Hasenpfeffer.

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post #12 of 79
2/26/10 at 2:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jax View Post
I'm glad the animals aren't having the same debate about us.
Exactly. Humans think they are above everything, when in truth we are animals.

I've heard they torture these performing animals, from making them more domesticated to shocking them for sperm.

If the question really is can the whale be held responsible, my answer is of course not.
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post #13 of 79
2/26/10 at 2:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graphicism View Post

I've heard they torture these performing animals, from making them more domesticated to shocking them for sperm.
Ah, so marriage IS torture.
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post #14 of 79
2/26/10 at 2:44am
That should keep those dirty vegetarians away.
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post #15 of 79
2/26/10 at 2:54am
Dolphins kill, apparently for sport; and orcas are just supersized dolphins.
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