[Left Channel]

My DAC has a light that is supposed to indicate whether or not the file has approval of the studio or artist. Blue is approved and Green not approved

I think approval can also mean someone at the current label signed off on the release, without input from the artists or original recording engineers. In the example I was thinking of above, I can't imagine the original team would ever have agreed to make the bassist louder than the star musicians on sax and guitar. But In that case most of those involved have already passed away, and the remaining headline artist is 86 years old. Listening to the MQA version, I can't believe anyone thought carefully about this issue.

 

[stoneglad]

I am definitely constantly defending MQA! Most people seem to be of the opinion that MQA is awful based al ost solely off of either what they have read on various threads and blogs or based upon an opinion they’ve come to after listening to one or two MQA / Tidal Masters albums via a non MQA DAC and only hearing the SW partially unfolded version.
First, the SW partially unfolded version is not going to compare to the fully unfolded version of a good MQA DAC such as mine (Brooklyn DAC). Second Tidal Masters, just as all other recordings will vary greatly based upon the master / recording quality of the “Tidal Master” album you are listening to. So, for example you select a few MQA albums that are new 2017 releases created from albums with DR6 (as seems to be the norm DR level for most garbage the record labels are pumping out these days), and it’s going to sound like crap! Especially when only being half unfolded, but any version of that album is going to sound equally as bad anyhow. Same thing goes for any album that was recorded in the ‘70’s whereas the original release had DR 15 and then the 2017 “Deluxe Edition , newly remastered” has DR 7, so the MQA version that was created from of that new piece of crap remaster is going to sound just as awful as any other version.
Now take some MQA albums from the 2L Label, our a John Coltrane or Otis Redding, or Aretha Franklin, etc where the MQA version was created from a well recorded album that has still retained its original master recording’s high DR, and that MQA album on Tidal, played back from an MQA FAC (and not the Explorer 2 or the Dragonfly Red, but a “Audiophile quality DAC”).
Most of the Tidal Masters albums sound amazing to me played via my Brooklyn DAC and many sound better to me than the original CD Rios and / or HDTracks 24bit versions of the same albums I own. (As stated, I would never choose to listen to a 2017 new release hip hop album in MQA and think to myself “this is going to sound great”, I already know that it will sound like crap!

 

[captblaze]

I think approval can also mean someone at the current label signed off on the release, without input from the artists or original recording engineers. In the example I was thinking of above, I can't imagine the original team would ever have agreed to make the bassist louder than the star musicians on sax and guitar. But In that case most of those involved have already passed away, and the remaining headline artist is 86 years old. Listening to the MQA version, I can't believe anyone thought carefully about this issue.

I was hoping that at least a review of the master and engineering notes was part of the certification. If not it is a bit disingenuous and makes it seem a bit more shady (like there wasn't that cloud already).

 

[Left Channel]

@stoneglad & @captblaze some "liner notes" about the source and process would go a long way towards reassuring consumers and help us avoid drawing broad conclusions, don't you think? This is not a problem unique to MQA, of course: provenance and other transparency issues have been long part of the discussion around high-resolution music in general.

I have a full MQA DAC, and have listened to hundreds of MQA tracks. Not thousands, because really I could live with or without it, but I do feel I've been open and fair in my listening. Sometimes I don't like the sound, but I have no way of knowing if Meridian made changes or if that sound originates from a specific version of the master. Sometimes I find the sound pleasant, at least initially, and other times I can't at tell the difference at all between the MQA release and a recent remastered CD release.

I do appreciate that Tidal Master streams do not have the audible watermarks that sometimes mar even CD-quality and high-res streams from other services. But transparency would help me understand why I should spend more money on this, especially downloads.

 

[captblaze]

I think some of the issue is the industry. There is no continuity from studio to studio or engineer to engineer, and in reality you cant standardize something as subjective as how sound should sound. In the case with MQA particularly it becomes more and more apparent that a single technology cant blanket the entire industry and as the digital age progresses I doubt the industry will ever embrace a single technology as a solution for everything (especially if they have to pay to license it from a competitor)

 

[Luke Thomas]

I'm on the fence myself. I'm thinking good with planar headphones. So so with no planar dynamic cans. I'm using 400i and Focal Clear

 

[DarwinOSX]

True for sure but I lost interest in defending MQA to people who have never heard it or have pre-suppositions about it or make incorrect statements about it. I've read all the pro and con arguments. All I know is it sounds better to me in most cases. I see it is coming to iOS Android and mobile shortly as well as Roon supporting it.
Also agree the full unfold is better and about the Brooklyn vs Meridian Explorer 2. The Meridian is a good deal though at $200 plus it does the full unfold and the Dragonfly are renderers.

I am definitely constantly defending MQA! Most people seem to be of the opinion that MQA is awful based al ost solely off of either what they have read on various threads and blogs or based upon an opinion they’ve come to after listening to one or two MQA / Tidal Masters albums via a non MQA DAC and only hearing the SW partially unfolded version.
First, the SW partially unfolded version is not going to compare to the fully unfolded version of a good MQA DAC such as mine (Brooklyn DAC). Second Tidal Masters, just as all other recordings will vary greatly based upon the master / recording quality of the “Tidal Master” album you are listening to. So, for example you select a few MQA albums that are new 2017 releases created from albums with DR6 (as seems to be the norm DR level for most garbage the record labels are pumping out these days), and it’s going to sound like crap! Especially when only being half unfolded, but any version of that album is going to sound equally as bad anyhow. Same thing goes for any album that was recorded in the ‘70’s whereas the original release had DR 15 and then the 2017 “Deluxe Edition , newly remastered” has DR 7, so the MQA version that was created from of that new piece of crap remaster is going to sound just as awful as any other version.
Now take some MQA albums from the 2L Label, our a John Coltrane or Otis Redding, or Aretha Franklin, etc where the MQA version was created from a well recorded album that has still retained its original master recording’s high DR, and that MQA album on Tidal, played back from an MQA FAC (and not the Explorer 2 or the Dragonfly Red, but a “Audiophile quality DAC”).
Most of the Tidal Masters albums sound amazing to me played via my Brooklyn DAC and many sound better to me than the original CD Rios and / or HDTracks 24bit versions of the same albums I own. (As stated, I would never choose to listen to a 2017 new release hip hop album in MQA and think to myself “this is going to sound great”, I already know that it will sound like crap!

 

[stoneglad]

No question that the Merridian Explorer 2 and the Audioquest Dragonfly are incredible bargains and an inexpensive way to get MQA fully unfolded files on a budget!
My only point was that people were using them as the sole point of reference in regards to the sound quality of MQA, and my point was just to state the obvious, which is that no $99 or $199 DAC is going to show any format at its absolute best, it’s just not possible. For example, I know some folks who have top of the line Audiophile DACs that have bought a Dragonfly or Explorer 2 as w way to sample MQA, and then they tell me MQA does not sound good, and I’m like “Yeah”, your Benchmark DAC 2 playing FLAC 16/44 is going to sound better then a Dragonfly playing MQA!!
I personally own a Dragonfly Red as my headphone / desktop DAC (Mytek Brooklyn in my main stereo), so I am a fan and not negating them.

 

[captblaze]

I personally own a Dragonfly Red as my headphone / desktop DAC (Mytek Brooklyn in my main stereo), so I am a fan and not negating them.

I just pre ordered a Mytek Clef as the MQA portable to my Brooklyn +. I am hoping Tidal gets around to MQA on mobile apps (before they go bust)

 

[stoneglad]

@stoneglad & @captblaze some "liner notes" about the source and process would go a long way towards reassuring consumers and help us avoid drawing broad conclusions, don't you think? This is not a problem unique to MQA, of course: provenance and other transparency issues have been long part of the discussion around high-resolution music in general.

I have a full MQA DAC, and have listened to hundreds of MQA tracks. Not thousands, because really I could live with or without it, but I do feel I've been open and fair in my listening. Sometimes I don't like the sound, but I have no way of knowing if Meridian made changes or if that sound originates from a specific version of the master. Sometimes I find the sound pleasant, at least initially, and other times I can't at tell the difference at all between the MQA release and a recent remastered CD release.

I do appreciate that Tidal Master streams do not have the audible watermarks that sometimes mar even CD-quality and high-res streams from other services. But transparency would help me understand why I should spend more money on this, especially downloads.

I agree! I would like to see the same from HDTracks as well! I’ve been burned too many times by them there too!
I’ve come to learn that everything comes down to the version of the master being used to create either the MQA or HDTracks 24-192, etc. Also that DR # matters significantly in regards to sound quality! (Of course, the better the original recording and the Better the master of that recording that is used to produce a particular version / release/ format, the higher the DR it will have as a result anyhow. ) I refer to the Dr.Loudness-war.info database before I make any purchases or downloads now. If I don’t see DR 12 or above, I don’t bother wasting my time, I already know it won’t sound good! I also stay far away from any new releases, any “remastered”, any deluxe edition”, etc they all are code words for “This will sound like total crap because we squashed the DR on this remaster” !
Best to find cd Rips from late ‘80’s and early ‘90’s CD’s, Vinyl Rips made from original first press vinyl and ripped by someone with good equipment and knowledge of how to remove clicks and hiss, etc, or my personal preference, DSD (ripped from
SACD’s). Also sticking to Jazz, Classical, and classic Rock, etc from the late 50’s to late 70’s is also going to be
More likely to have a better original recording and a master with higher dynamic range! The above all applies equally to which MQA albums will sound the best!

 

[DarwinOSX]

I just pre ordered a Mytek Clef as the MQA portable to my Brooklyn +. I am hoping Tidal gets around to MQA on mobile apps (before they go bust)

MQA is supposed to be on Mobile in a week or so. See DarKo on this.
Also Roon is supposed to be close to working with MQA. If I can play MQA via Roon using their direct connect to my Kef LS50W speakers that would be amazing.
I do think the Meridian Explorer 2 and Dragonfly Red are bargains but I wanted a full decoder not a renderer which is why I chose the Meridian over the Dragonfly at the same price. I was interested in the iFi Nano iDSD BL until I found out it too is only a renderer. I'm very interested in the Mytek Clef which was just released I believe and is a full decoder.

 

[Luke Thomas]

So are we still thinking tidal might go under? Is there a good alternative

 

[captblaze]

It was in enough financial publications to lend it some credence. Unfortunately most people don't care much about Hi Res audio, so the market is niche. I find it amusing though because whenever I have friends over I get asked how I can make the music sound "live". when I explain it, I generally get the same look Homer Simpson would get when he talked to his dog. So unless there is a change in the pricing model I doubt any Hi Res audio streaming service can survive long term.

Although I myself find the $30 / month I pay for Tidal Hi Fi Family is a decent deal (main account plus 5 subs)

 

[Luke Thomas]

The tidal \ Roon setup is convenient. I hope a good alternative can be acquired.

 

[captblaze]

I will ride their horse to the bitter end, as for an alternative... I didn't much care for Deezer and I can't access Quobuz due to regional restrictions (although there is always the VPN trick)