Review/Opinion, LCD-3, HE6, Liquid Fire and WA5LE.

[sillysally]

After comparing my two rigs using the LCD-3's, Liquid Fire and WA5LE with my Realiser in and out of the loop, there is a big difference in how these two amps sound using the LCD-3's. Using my Liquid Fire I would say that the LCD-3's are somewhat like the D7000's with there heavy bass attack somewhat over shadowing the mids. When I used my WA5LE with the LCD-3 the sound was more like the HD-650's, in that the heavy bass attack was lessened and the mids where in more control.
iow using the Liquid fire and LCD-3 there was much more dynamics than with the WA5LE that was much more laid back.
When I took my Realiser out of the loop using the LCD-3's and Liquid Fire it was a total disaster with poorly recorded audio, it was like using a boom box with the bass cranked up to high.
 
Using my HE-6 with both these combos the differences where not that much, the biggest difference being that the Liquid Fire is faster and has a little better attack using my HE-6. The sound-stage in both the LCD-3 and HE6 are close, but I would say the HE6 may have a slight edge. The bass attack with the HE6 is very strong but not to a point of distracting from the mids or to a point of ear fatigue. The mids are better with the HE6's and I would also have to give the edge to the HE6 for the highs. iow the HE6 is a better balanced headphone when it comes to blending/transition of highs, mids and lows. However I would have to give a slight edge to the LCD-3 in how the left and right cups are balanced..
 
imo what I liked at first with the LCD-3's was its dynamic range and impact, until I figured out that it was at the cost of the mids and that the heavy bass was giving me ear fatigue there by lessening my ability to hear the fine details that the LCD-3's are capable of. Also I don't really like the clamping action or the added weight of the LCD-3's.
 
imo the LCD-3's are on the right track of becoming a great headphone, but there needs to be more fine tuning by Audeze to bring the lows. mids and highs into harmony with each other. I think in a way from what I have read, Purrin's mod has help in this endeavor. Hopefully when Audeze comes out with there LCD-4's and addresses the flaws in the LCD-3's, the LCD-4 will justify the lofty price that is being ask for the LCD-3's.
 

 

[purrin]

Great write up. Thanks for sharing and offering impressions of various combinations.

 

[johnwmclean]

Thanks for sharing, great read.

 

[grokit]

Good job SS, interesting that the LCD-3/LF combo isn't that great without the Realizer. Would you say that it was a completely different story with well-recorded material?

 

[Maxvla]

Interesting how different we can all hear. I disagree on almost every point you mention. Even the feel of the weight.

While I know the LCD3 is technically heavier, the abominable fit of the HE-6 (and all Hifiman full size headphones) make them feel twice as heavy as the LCD 2-3 on my head. The weight is distributed very well on the LCDs whereas on the HE-6 it's all smashed on 2 small points, and to add to that, the adjustment sliders don't work all that well, so you are forced to wear them how the headphones want to be instead of how you want them to be.

 

[sillysally]

Quote:

Good job SS, interesting that the LCD-3/LF combo isn't that great without the Realizer. Would you say that it was a completely different story with well-recorded material?

I would say the LCD-3/LF isn't that great but still very good with well recorded material when compared to the HE6, its just that without the Realiser poorly recorded material is worse.
And as I was saying that I was not impressed with how the LCD-3/WA5LE combo was, when in both cases compared to the HE6's on both those amps and using the tubes I show in my profile.
 
 

 

[Jian]

Nice write up. I respectfully disagree on some of the points.

 

[zenpunk]

Quote:

Interesting how different we can all hear. I disagree on almost every point you mention. Even the feel of the weight.
While I know the LCD3 is technically heavier, the abominable fit of the HE-6 (and all Hifiman full size headphones) make them feel twice as heavy as the LCD 2-3 on my head. The weight is distributed very well on the LCDs whereas on the HE-6 it's all smashed on 2 small points, and to add to that, the adjustment sliders don't work all that well, so you are forced to wear them how the headphones want to be instead of how you want them to be.

You must have a very weird melon 

 The HE-6 was my heaviest can but also the most comfortable. The headband exactly followed the shape of my head (small one). I haven't tried the LCD3 but the LCD2  had the worst fit from all the headphones I tried. Thankfully I didn't like their sound so no conundrum.

 

[MacedonianHero]

Great write up Peter.

I can understand your conclusions coming from primarily the HE-6s (fantastic headphones no doubt), but I would classify the Audeze sound a bit different. But as they say...different strokes.
 
Still, very well written and thought out.

 

[Golfnutz]

Nice job SS. It's always nice to read someone else perspective.
 
For some of the same reasons you've mentioned, I've sold my LCD-2. I just couldn't get past their weaknesses. That doesn't mean their not world class, I just prefer something else.
 
Here's someone else perspective, if anyone hasn't read these comparisons: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/comparing-world-class-headphones
 
Thanks again.
 
 

 

[mwilson]

Nice writeup Peter. Not having heard the HE6 or the Smyth, I can only chime in saying that by far the LF/LCD-3 is the best combo that I have personally listened to. To provide a context to what I heard, I owned the LCD-3 and 2 (rev 1 and 2) as cans, LF, WA22, RWA AE, Leben as amps, Wyred DAC-2, Cambridge 840c, Resolution Audio Cantata as sources.

 

[grokit]

^ Maybe you guys are using different tubes? Perhaps SS's tube selection is more flattering to the sound of the HE-6.

 

[sillysally]

Quote:

^ Maybe you guys are using different tubes? Perhaps SS's tube selection is more flattering to the sound of the HE-6.

Yes you are right, imo my systems are optimized for the HE6 and there for are very neutral. In both my Liquid Fire and WA5LE I use some world class tubes that are very well matched and very strong nos.
 
Its not that I am saying the LCD-3's are bad headphones, its just that for the difference in money from what I paid for both the HE6 and the LCD-3 ($1000usd difference) I feel that I am not gaining anything after weighing the + and - of both headphones. And yes if I wanted to I could use the Liquid Fire at low volume for extended period of time and not get ear fatigue from the extended bass of the LCD-3's. But in my case I am a detail junkie and love a 3D sound-stage, so for me low volume levels are unsuitable for what I like to hear.
 
imo purrin's $1 simple mod  lends credence to the opinion expressed by a few that maybe Audeze should have spent more time tweaking the LCD-3's there for justifying there $1000 price increase. Of-course this is just business on the part of Audeze,  as a business man myself I can understand why a small enterprise like Audeze whats to make money when the sun shines.
 
Bottom line is that I have spent 6 months getting to the point that I am at with the Liquid Fire, HE6 and the rest of my gear. So I don't feel like chasing after the Holy Grail of sound I want with the LCD-3's only to have Audeze roll out a new improved LCD-4 or LCD-3v2 (per Audeze).
 
 
 
 

 

[MacedonianHero]

Quote:

Yes you are right, imo my systems are optimized for the HE6 and there for are very neutral. In both my Liquid Fire and WA5LE I use some world class tubes that are very well matched and very strong nos.
 
Its not that I am saying the LCD-3's are bad headphones, its just that for the difference in money from what I paid for both the HE6 and the LCD-3 ($1000usd difference) I feel that I am not gaining anything after weighing the + and - of both headphones. And yes if I wanted to I could use the Liquid Fire at low volume for extended period of time and not get ear fatigue from the extended bass of the LCD-3's. But in my case I am a detail junkie and love a 3D sound-stage, so for me low volume levels are unsuitable for what I like to hear.
 
imo purrin's $1 simple mod  lends credence to the opinion expressed by a few that maybe Audeze should have spent more time tweaking the LCD-3's there for justifying there $1000 price increase. Of-course this is just business on the part of Audeze,  as a business man myself I can understand why a small enterprise like Audeze whats to make money when the sun shines.
 
Bottom line is that I have spent 6 months getting to the point that I am at with the Liquid Fire, HE6 and the rest of my gear. So I don't feel like chasing after the Holy Grail of sound I want with the LCD-3's only to have Audeze roll out a new improved LCD-4 or LCD-3v2 (per Audeze).
 
 
 
 

Peter, just some history with the LCD-2 rev. 2. It was released to account for the failures they had with their latest batch of rev. 1 drivers. They needed to change the drivers to design out the possible causes of the failures. It had nothing to do with an improvement in sound like the SR007 MK1 vs MKII. Had there been no failures of rev. 1 drivers produced in mid-2011, then the LCD-2 rev. 2 would never have been released. The improvements in sound quality were a nice side effect of the changes made to make the drivers more robust.
 
Kinda like the "unintended side effect" that was observed when there was no improvement in hair growth on men when testing Viagra.

 

 

[grokit]

 
Quote:

Peter, just some history with the LCD-2 rev. 2. It was released to account for the failures they had with their latest batch of rev. 1 drivers. They needed to change the drivers to design out the possible causes of the failures. It had nothing to do with an improvement in sound like the SR007 MK1 vs MKII. Had there been no failures of rev. 1 drivers produced in mid-2011, then the LCD-2 rev. 2 would never have been released. The improvements in sound quality were a nice side effect of the changes made to make the drivers more robust.
 
Kinda like the "unintended side effect" that was observed when there was no improvement in hair growth on men when testing Viagra.

Great point. And lol