Recommendations for DACs/Amps with Android phones and HD600s

[scsarson]

Hi. First post although I have lurked here on and off over the years.
 
I have recently switched from iPhone to Android - I currently have a Motorola Moto G - and want to set myself up for using the phone to drive my HD600s as well as possible. I assume I want a solution that can send a digital feed from the USB socket on the phone and use outboard gear to convert to analogue and drive the headphones.
 
What I already have is: Android phone running Marshmallow (as I say, Moto G and not particularly keen to change just for better internal DAC); FiiO E12 Mont Blanc (bought essentially to allow any headphone feed to drive the HD600s and perfectly happy with this if worth retaining); Sennheiser HD600s (love them, no desire to change).
 
I mostly envisage listening in the house so portability not critical (HD600s not very portable anyway). But a set up that would also work for listening on the move would be good - I also have a pair of Shure in-ears that would probably do a decent set up justice.
 
My music is on a NAS in Apple lossless format. Essential is that the set up can play these files when loaded on my phone, but a solution that would allow me also to stream from the NAS when in the house would be good too.
 
From reading various other posts, I am forming some initial conclusions.
 
It sounds like I should invest in the USB Audio Player PRO app for the phone (will this let me stream from the NAS?). I currently use PowerAmp which plays Apple lossless but I don't think this will send audio via the USB?
 
It looks like I will also need a special USB cable to run from my phone into whatever outboard DAC I end up going with. Is that right? Is there anything to watch out for in buying these?
 
I’m unclear on whether I should be looking to replace the FiiO E12 with a combined DAC/amp or whether I should keep the FiiO amp and just buy a DAC to sit between the phone and the amp. I guess that is where the choice and different opinions/prices come in!
 
So I would welcome views/advice on my best options. I don’t really want to spend too much (maybe up to £150/$250). But would still be interested in views about what the full range of options are.
 
Sorry for long post. Hope relatively clear. Thanks for reading.
 
Stuart
UK

 

[thejammonster]

I don't know much about your phone's DAC or your amp. Generally I would say that if you like how it sounds then why change it? If you're itching to upgrade I would recommend a Schiit Modi 2 (Uber) DAC at $99 ($149). The Uber offers coax and optical inputs so that you can use more than just your phone over USB. For the cable you'll just need a USB Micro-B to USB Type B (like a printer cable) cable. I used an AmazonBasics cable for this when I still had my LG G4.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

 
Pangea HP101 - $99 on Amazon. The dock for my Android was roughly $15, plus a $10 case that I bet would (and did) fit in it. Short USB cable from Monoprice was $5, OTG cable was roughly $3 from a local store.

 

[scsarson]

Thanks guys. Those both look interesting. Anyone able to compare those two options? It doesn't look like I can buy the Pangea in the UK though. The Schiit stuff looks really nice and good value.
 
Now seriously considering selling the FiiO and going for the Magni/Modi stack which looks like it would do just what I want. If anyone has this setup with HD600s would welcome opinions (and on whether works as you would want with Android devices). Any benefits for my proposed use of going for the Uber models? Looks like I would just get extra features that I don't really need but no better sound quality.

 

[swesko]

My current set up is the s7 edge exynos (Wolfson dac) but I use the oppo ha-2 dac and poweramp works fine with the usb port of the dac. Poweramp supports up to 32bit which is more than enough for me no need to buy the usb player pro imo

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

[west0ne]

I've tried a couple of DACs with a couple of Android devices and found that what worked on one didn't necessarily work on the other. Whatever you decide on I suggest asking first for confirmation that someone else has tried it and that it is a working combination.

Fiio Q1 works on S7 and Motorola G but needed hub for S5. iBasso D14 doesn't work on Motorola G but is OK on S5 and S7. Topping NX2 plays sound on all but not properly on S5. Modi worked with S7 with powered hub. I know this isn't extensive but it gives you an idea of the potential issues.

Key message - try before you buy.

You'll need a USB OTG cable for the connection.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

 
Now seriously considering selling the FiiO and going for the Magni/Modi stack which looks like it would do just what I want. If anyone has this setup with HD600s would welcome opinions (and on whether works as you would want with Android devices). Any benefits for my proposed use of going for the Uber models? Looks like I would just get extra features that I don't really need but no better sound quality.

 
The Modi2Uber has one feature that you might need - its own power brick. The regular version relies exclusively on USB power, reducing the likelihood of compatibility.
 
That said, having its own powerbrick is not a guarantee either, it just eliminates the problem of how much current the DAC will have to draw from the host device, in this case, the Android.

 

[willycps]

I've tested this combination, and it works fine:
DAC/amp: Fiio Q1
cell phone: Motorola Moto E (2015 version)
app player: PowerAmp
conection: USB OTG from cell phone to the Q1 (acting as DAC and amp).
 
Of course, you can also use the headphones output of the cell phone to use only the amp section of the Q1.

 

[scsarson]

Thanks for replies.
 
Now thinking of two possible routes.
 
First, FiiO Q1. I recognise that this would not sound as good as the Schiit set up (I assume) but is cheap enough that I'm tempted to just try it out (I think I just need the Q1 and an OTG cable). But main question is would it drive my HD600s to a decent level? Anyone tried this particular set up?
 
Second, some pile of Schiit I'm forming the view that what I probably want is the Magni/Modi stack (not Uber) and probably need a Wyrd too. But I have a few questions about this (which I will probably post on the Magni/Modi thread elsewhere too). I don't need any of the additional features that the Uber models offer (with one possible exception - see below). And it sounds like if there is any reduction in sound quality then it will be minor and I can live with that. So key questions:
 
1. Will the regular Magni drive my HD600s well enough (and better than the Q1) or is the slightly higher power in the Uber model significant?
 
2. It looks like the power supply for the Modi 2 Uber should help when using with a phone. But am I correct in reading various posts as suggesting that this is irrelevant if I am using it via USB and that with either model it is likely that I will need to buy a Wyrd to ensure that my phone doesn't struggle to power the DAC?
 
That is nudging me towards the three component stack of Wyrd/Modi 2/Magni 2. Sounds like it should give me a very good sound for the money with the HD600s.
 
Thanks again everyone for replies so far.

 

[west0ne]

I haven't used the HD600 so can't comment on that bit. The Modi worked with my Galaxy S7 but needed a powered hub between it and the Modi, so if you don't need the added features of the Uber it will work. The Modi/Magni is a desktop setup whereas the Q1 is a portable so they aren't really aimed at the same market.
 
I have a Q1 and have used the line out into a Vali 2; the results weren't bad at all but as the Modi isn't much more than the Q1 if you don't need the portability of the Q1 I would just go with the Modi.
 
I have used my AKG K702 with the Q1; it is powerful enough to listen at a reasonable level but when compared to the output from the Vali you can really hear that the Q1 is lacking. From what I have read the HD600 probably need something  more powerful than the Q1. I certainly think the Magni amp will give better results than the amp in the Q1.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

 
2. It looks like the power supply for the Modi 2 Uber should help when using with a phone. But am I correct in reading various posts as suggesting that this is irrelevant if I am using it via USB and that with either model it is likely that I will need to buy a Wyrd to ensure that my phone doesn't struggle to power the DAC?

 
 
Already posted right above your post. Regular Modi will take all power it needs via USB, which increases the chances of incompatibility depending on how much the smartphone can spit out. Uber power brick will power it but the USB chip I think is still powered by (and triggered by) the smartphone, but for the most part it's powered by the brick.
 
That doesn't guarantee total compatibility as it might be due to software issues rather than power draw, but in case you're going to try what no one has tried and cannot confirm either way, the Uber version is a slightly safer bet.

 

[scsarson]

Been posting elsewhere. Just to conclude what I've decided for the moment.
 
Having been persuaded that any version of trying to use my phone as a source might not be the best option, I've realised that I had a cheap wifi streaming device (QED uPlay Stream) sitting unused in a cupboard. Just set that up, sending my ALAC files on my NAS to the E12/HD600s and it sounds good. Probably not fully doing the HD600s justice, but certainly good enough for what I want at present.
 
I'm now intrigued about the android phone/DAC option though and have ordered a cheap outboard DAC (HIFImeDIY). Will do some comparisons between my streaming solution and using UAPP on the phone via the DAC when that arrives.
 
Thanks to everyone who commented.