[skyline889]

The usefulness of a high flash sync speed to freeze motion depends on a host of variables such as: what you're shooting, what focal length you're shooting at, your distance from the object, which way the subject is moving in relation to you, etc.

 

[mattcalf]

Damn all of you, I got my eyes on a T2i now.

 

[brotherlen]

I just received my 7d yesterday. all I can say is wow, this could be the most undervalued camera on the market. I'll post more after some more tests. I traded from a 5d (1st version) and if the t2i is sounding like a baby 7d, it may be a really great buy.

 

[jax]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zodduska /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't really get the comments regarding high shutter speed with flash. As far as I understand it when using flash it is the flash which freezes the subject, makes a clear shot and it is indifferent to shutter speed.. as opposed to shooting constant ambient light where shutter speed matters. AFAIK the only effect shutter speed has when using flash as primary light is the amount of ambient light allowed to be captured. In most cases a higher shutter speed with flash will only render a darker background not a sharper image. (edit: this is based on my basic total newbie understanding of indoor flash photography)

For a newbie you have a pretty good understanding of the concept. What you are describing early on, is where the capacity to freeze the subject is determined NOT by shutter speed, but by the duration of the actual flash. In those cases although the shutter might be open for all of the 1/10th or 1/30th of a second that you tried, but the strobe is probably reaching the brightness needed to expose for f8 for only about 1/500th sec or even faster. The flash duration varies according to the actual strobe unit and the amount of power being delivered to it. At higher powers the duration is usually longer. Flash duration is usually in hundreths of a second, and can be much faster (your test shots look like your strobe is firing at a faster duration, which would make perfect sense if the strobe were on "auto" and you are pretty close to that fan - try the same experiment with the strobe on "manual" putting out full power every time and you will probably see more blur to the blades. You will need to adjust your aperture as the output will be much brighter). It is no surprise at all that the two pics you did at slower speeds with strobe as the main source froze the motion as they are probably primarily lit by the very brief duration of the strobe. In the case of your tests, you would get no sense of blur fron the ambient exposure if the exposures you used were several stops down from what the ambient light was reading.

The Auto FP setting is meant primarily for using strobe as a fill-light for outdoor use. It allows you to use the higher speeds to get an appropriate exposure for daylight while having an opening wide enough to allow a relatively low-powered strobe to fill in the shadows at moderate distances. You describe how it works perfectly - the strobe stays illuminated at a lower power for the entire length of the exposure.

It's great that you are doing the experiments you are to understand the concept. Nothing will allow you to grasp a notion faster than actually doing it.

 

[Zodduska]

Thank you for the thorough explanation jax! I've only had the Speedlight since Christmas and will definitely keep experimenting with it along with your suggestions. I didn't realize the output power increased the duration of the strobe but that makes perfect sense. From what I've seen so far adding flash really opens up a whole other dimension when thinking about taking pictures compared to working only with ambient light sources. Thanks again for breaking it down so concisely.. all of your observations about my experimental shots were spot on.

 

[jax]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zodduska /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thank you for the thorough explanation jax! I've only had the Speedlight since Christmas and will definitely keep experimenting with it along with your suggestions. I didn't realize the output power increased the duration of the strobe but that makes perfect sense. From what I've seen so far adding flash really opens up a whole other dimension when thinking about taking pictures compared to working only with ambient light sources. Thanks again for breaking it down so concisely.. all of your observations about my experimental shots were spot on.

Glad to be of help. I'd encourage you also to experiment with diffusing your speedlight with either DIY or aftermarket alternatives. The results can be more flattering on most subjects (especially on faces/skin). Flash on camera, though convenient, is definitely not the most flattering light source, but it's use as a fill light is a great tool - even then, diffusion helps. You can also get a cord and take the strobe off the camera lighting more from the side, which is a bit more involved and can be cumbersome. Nikon's strobe system does a pretty good job at allowing for use of multiple strobes as well. I didn't read the whole thread, so don't even know which strobe you are working with. Again, you are doing the best thing by experimenting - best way to learn for sure! Digital is also great that way as you get to see the results as you work. Have fun!

 

[Zodduska]

My equipment consists of a D80 with the SB-600 so using wireless off camera flash in commander mode is pretty fun and as you said yields more pleasing results than on camera flash. I have a plain plastic diffuser attachment and a 5 in 1 diffuser/reflector disc. I've also been playing around with bounce indoors to further soften the output which seems to help immensely. Thanks again for your tips and encouragement!

 

[M0T0XGUY]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brotherlen /img/forum/go_quote.gif I just received my 7d yesterday. all I can say is wow, this could be the most undervalued camera on the market. I'll post more after some more tests. I traded from a 5d (1st version) and if the t2i is sounding like a baby 7d, it may be a really great buy.

No offense, but unless you shoot sports and need the 7D's awesome frame rate, I'd much rather have a full frame camera than a crop-body one. What makes you like the 7D over the 5D?

 

[brotherlen]

Quote:

Originally Posted by M0T0XGUY /img/forum/go_quote.gif No offense, but unless you shoot sports and need the 7D's awesome frame rate, I'd much rather have a full frame camera than a crop-body one. What makes you like the 7D over the 5D?

None taken, because I do shoot sports, I shoot a lot of everything and 8fps/video was a dead on selling point. Maybe not needed for the average person. Full frame has the advantages of being able to shoot wide, and noise reduction due to pixel density. However shooting full frame glass on a crop sensor lets you use the best part of the glass. The current 7d is a step up from my 5d which is about 4 years old. Image quality so far is great. 7d vs. the 5d mark 2, I couldn't justify nearly a grand difference, that's either another "L" lens in the bag or a set of JH13 IEMs in my ears. The only downside with the advertised 8fps, you need a really, really fast CF card to get it. If it was a price no object 7d vs. 5dmII then maybe it would be a bit tougher, maybe. Then it's ability to shoot wide and noise reduction vs. frame rate and adjustable video frame rate.
Why would keep a 5d over the 7d?
Remember, I'm comparing the old 5d to a newer camera.

 

[Guy]

The T2i looks like a budget 7D which is a very good DSLR. The 5DMkII has a full frame sensor (Which I prefer for stills) but is out of your price range as is the 7D. As a good all rounder zoom I like Canon 24-105L f/4 which is about $1K but very good value for money.
THe lens will outlive the body so if you decide to upgrade to a full frame sensor this lens will cover it. The T2i with the 24-104L Zoom should cost around $1,800. THird pat lens manufacturers have some f2.8 zooms but I have only used L series Canon lenses so I ca't comment on those.