Noise Duality 300B Amp. Pics attached.

Apr 19, 2006 at 2:45 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 46

tjkurita

1000+ Head-Fier
Joined
May 22, 2003
Posts
1,067
Likes
24
Start with the pics of course...

Signal Chassis and Power Supply Chassis together:

img14824dr.jpg


The Signal Chassis: The signal chassis contains the audio circuit. A 6sn7/300B circuit, zero negative feedback, directly heated SET. The output transformers are James Audio Hi-B Orient core. They spec. really well and sound great to me. I may upgrade to Tango iron in the future.

img14845bc.jpg


The Power Chassis: The power chassis contains the power supply. Heavy duty power transformers and extra beefy mil. spec. filter chokes.

img14854cb.jpg


In the following shot, you can see the "form follows function" layout of the amp. Each component is "in order." You can also see the rear panel layout (on the signal chassis) inputs on the left, followed by the speaker posts and the three umbilicals from the power supply. The power chassis has the three umbilical outs to the signal chassis, and the two power cords for each channel.

img14860yo.jpg


OK. So how does it sound? I don't know if I am being objective. I don't think I am. But it is one of the best sounding amplifiers I have ever heard. It could be me, but my stock Cary 300 SEI doesn't seem to compare. I've read a lot of initial impressions of amps and there is usually a great deal of hyperbole about the quality of sound. It is the natural result of being excited about a new piece of gear. But I've tried to find fault with this amp and there are very few I can think of.

Many of the criticisms people have about tubes (particularly tubes like the 300B) center around the notion that they can have too much midrange bloom, flubby bass and uncontrolled, somewhat recessed highs. Lovers of SET say that the midrange is where the magic is and that any distortion is 2nd order distortion which actually sounds good to the human ear and makes the amps sound "full" or "tubey." Well, this amp does not have any fatiguing "bloom" and the bass is tight and very deep. The high end is as clean as glass. Everything negative that SET is known for is not there with this amp. And yet, it sounds organic and smooth and pleasing to the ear. I've never been a HUGE HP listener. I love HP, but I've always considered them a necessity because of sound pollution. Whenever possible I prefer speakers. That changes somewhat with this amp. I was able to listen to the HP for HOURS with this amp when I couldn't with any other (including Gilmore designs and my Cary 300 SEI). There was always a fatigue factor. Not so with this. The fact that I can listen for extended periods without needing to turn the speakers on tells me there is something different about it.

I can't decide if the bass is lacking. It always seems to be there but it is controlled. It might be lacking. I would love to hear impressions after the national meet. Either the bass is lacking in comparison to the Cary or it is controlled and sounds the way it should, or the high end is a little forward, creating a high-low imbalance. It is not distracting. When I listen for bass, it is always there. When I listened to a particularly bass flubby album I heard differences between Duality and Cary. The album is All Kooked Out by Stanton Moore. The bass/guitar player is Charlie Hunter. Now, if anyone knows Charlie Hunter, they know that he plays an 8 string guitar with a specially designed "fanned fingerboard" to accommodate 3 bass strings and 5 guitar strings. However, anyone who has listened to Charlie also knows that this set up makes for some serious compromises. Having such an enormous range of notes on a single instrument makes the low end in particular difficult because you need longer scale lengths to get proper string tension. Charlie's guitars don't usually get that great string tension on the low end so his bass tone can be flubby and indistinct at times. With the Cary, these short comings become very evident. Reducing much of the bass below a certain range to a single, muddy overtone. Some parts are completely indistinct. I put this in the category of "sacrifice for the sake of SET midrange". Well, the Duality amp reveals all of those extra low end tones that sound (frankly) crappy on the Cary. Is this because the Cary bass extension overwhelms itself? Or because the Duality has a recessed bass response that seems controlled but is in reality simply lack of extension and/or response? I don't think so. I think that the Duality simply uses superior components, better power supplies and a cleaner circuit that results in better sound reproduction. These kinds of comparison tests are what make me think the Duality is the real deal.

My other question with the amp is the soundstage. It seems like the soundstage has less depth than the Cary. I can't figure it out. There is enough soundstage, but it is not holographic. I haven't completely experimented with this factor yet because I have been listening mostly with HP. I don't really consider HP soundstaging as important as speaker soundstaging. And I haven't really been comparing the speaker outs of the two amps. Here's the thing: I have had a head cold for weeks with some sinus/ear stuffiness that has been messing with my sense of spatial hearing. I can hear tones well, but it's almost as if my head has a little cotton in it. Occasionally I "pop" my ears and the sonic world opens up again. But soon that sense recedes and my ears and sinuses clog up again. It's my sense that this kind of hearing is the most important when it comes to detecting sound stage, and right now I can't really hear it very well. The jury is still out on imaging.

This amp WILL be at the national meet on both days (I hope) and I am looking forward to hearing any and all impressions of the gear. I am not sensitive about it. I simply love music. You won't hurt my feelings if you think your Sony PCDP sounds better.

I am trying to be objective and clear about my impressions so far, but it is all opinion and I am sure I am extremely biased. Maybe it sounds like crap and I am fooling myself.

John.

PS: on very close inspection, there is a slight manufacturing flaw. One of the posts between the layers of chassis is crooked. That is, the two holes in the bottom and top layer of chassis don't line up. It is extremely minor but I may eventually have one of the holes enlarged so the post lines up straight...

PPS: The above flaw was in fact due to a very easily correctable issue. The bottom layer was rotated 180 degrees, so the front was the back and the back was the front. Blackie fixed it in 30 seconds.
 
Apr 19, 2006 at 3:04 PM Post #2 of 46
Looking forward to putting an ear on your amp at the meet.
What headphones are you using with it,What is your source?
 
Apr 19, 2006 at 3:07 PM Post #3 of 46
Hi Boze.

I am looking forward to your impressions. I am using a Linn Ikemi CDP and Senn hd 600 w/ Equinox. I will also be bringing an Ah! Super Tube CDP. I need to burn it in a little I haven't listened to it in months...
 
Apr 19, 2006 at 3:22 PM Post #5 of 46
Congrats man! Now we're talking seriously. I agree 100% with your finding about supposed "tubey" sound with 300B and Cary's bass
icon10.gif


Which 300Bs are you using? I cannot recommend you enough to try one day the EAT 300B. Too good to be true.
 
Apr 19, 2006 at 3:38 PM Post #6 of 46
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mastergill
Congrats man! Now we're talking seriously. I agree 100% with your finding about supposed "tubey" sound with 300B and Cary's bass
icon10.gif


Which 300Bs are you using? I cannot recommend you enough to try one day the EAT 300B. Too good to be true.



I am using JJ 300B that were supplied with the amp. Blackie, who built the amp prefers the JJ 300B. It is a very revealing tube. I haven't tried tube rolling at all. Zero. The only tube I have heard with the amp is the JJ. I am thinking about trying the new WE and the Sophia Princess 300B. The EAT seems interesting too! That is coming later, though. Right now, I am just trying to figure out what the amp is telling me!

The pre-tubes are old Sylvanias that I had before. Blackie supplied a set of EH 6sn7s, but one of them turned microphonic enough to bug me.
 
Apr 19, 2006 at 10:01 PM Post #9 of 46
Congrats man. I look forward to trying it out this weekend. Wouldn't be surprised if I liked it more than all thoes balanced rigs (including mine) that seem to be the favorite of the moment.

Best,

-Jason
 
Apr 20, 2006 at 11:49 AM Post #13 of 46
www.tubesville.com

The amp was built by Blackie Pagano from Tubesville and Noise Outlaw Audio. Blackie is a high end audio specialist with a great deal of experience repairing and designing hi-fi and guitar amplifiers. He's also a damn good engineer and repair person. His shop is in NYC. Anyone can have pretty much anything built by him. Tubes, High Power Op Amps, speakers, power amps, pre amps, cross-overs, guitar amps. Whatever. In the case of head-fi, he could design a fantastic dedicated headphone amp around the 300B or maybe the 2A3. Prices are not cheap, but not outlandish. Lead times can be rather long because he is one person and his quick tube guitar amp repairs are in high demand in the city. Price will depend on component costs and design/labor factors. There is a good bit of cost to have the aesthetics of the amp come out right too. He can build a killer sounding ugly headamp, or a killer sounding pretty headamp. The cost might differ by orders of magnitude, though... Talk to him personally about costs and he will let you know.

I am more of a speaker person, but Blackie focussed heavily on the HP of my amps because HP listening can be extremely critcal.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top