[Jeff Guidry]

I'll also agree with markl. Just because he's left-wing and vegan doesn't mean he's intelligent. Moby certainly didn't start the greenie/pinko social trend in electronic music, that's been a staple of the underground culture since its inception.

MacDEF, it's not your style to make a statement and not SCRUPULOUSLY defend it. I see nothing in your post that would support the assertion that Moby is an intelligent guy.

 

[Zanth]

Okay, Nick D has it right when he says Boards of Canada are something to listen to....these guys are amazing...brings back memories of early Eno works. As for Moby? Well, I think that is latest album is a complete sell-out. Essentially more of the same of Play. Now I liked Play, don't get me wrong. It was radio-friendly, and he did some really interesting mixes with it. Just because he sampled heavily from some early 1900s stuff doesn't me he has no talent. I can think of many composers who are regarded as masters, but walk a fine line when it comes to orginiality. Moby is actually intelligent. Has anyone ever actually spoken to him? I mean in person? I have. I don't regard myself as the most brilliant man alive, but I don't think I am stupid either. We were able to speak for about 40 minutes and he had some very insightful thoughts on the future of music, the life-span of the RIAA and how to make it in the electronic side of things. Then we moved on to some astrophysics and cosmology issues which were just plain fun to talk about. Anyhow, he is not in my opinion a talent-less twerp. One may not like his stuff, hey that;s fine...but to call him talent-less? No. His earlier works are good, sure htey didn't rake in the bucks but then he is a pioneer in electronica. Like it or not, that is a fact. Is the granddaddyof it all? Hell no, look to Eno, Jarre and others. But he is still a pioneer. I know some people who have impecable taste, who just despice Coltrane. Does that mean their opinion does not matter? No. Do they think he is talentless? No. They just don't dig his stuff, and they don't feel that his improve was anything to talk about. They are not alone. I think they are nuts, but opinions being opinions in the world of art.

If one does not like his stuff, don;t listen. If it is on MTV, turn the channel. Beyond my likes or dislikes regarding Moby. I will take him on the radio over all the pop/eurotrash/crap-hop/ I am subjected to 24/7.

This is all conjecture anyhow. Enjoy the music you like : )

 

[MacDEF]

Quote:

Originally posted by Jeff Guidry I think you put the first thing last...Moby is an extremely gifted producer, can see a trend before it happens and can make waves that others ride. Moby is in the same league as Dr. Dre, both deep students of music of the rock and pop eras, but neither are really talented musicians. Moby at best is a good musician, but it's not his musical skills we listen for. Like Dr. Dre, it's his production skills.

I would agree with that; then again (and I'll probably get hit hard for saying this

) many electronica artists aren't stellar musicians, but are good producers. The genre lends itself to creativity on the mixing and production side.


Quote:

Originally posted by markl Someone in this thread said it best: he struggled for years until "Play".

"Struggled?" Again, you may not like him (OK, it's clear you don't

), but let's at least talk about reality. Moby was a very succesful artist long before Play. He's put out five or six albums, all of which sold well, some very well, plus his EPs and remixes. He was popular enough that he's done score/soundtrack work for something like 15 films, most of them majors. I would suggest that you look up the sales numbers of his previous releases and look up all of the soundtrack/remix/production work he's done over the past decade before you claim that he's struggled. 99% of the musical artists in the world would love to "struggle" as bad as he did before "Play"

The fact is that, as I said above, Moby had done more to put electronica on the map over the past decade than anyone else. You don't do that by being a "talent-free twerp." To imply or state otherwise shows a complete disrespect for the genre. Like him or don't, but calling him "talent-free" because you have a personal beef against his personality is off-base. That's all I'm saying.


Quote:

Even die hard Moby fans on this board MUST ADMIT that people bought the album at least 50% for the sampled singers, and 50% for Moby's pedestrian electronic background.

I'm not even a "die hard" Moby fan, and I would dispute that statement. If people were really buying the album 50% for the sampled singers, then the myriad of albums and compilations that include those old samples would also be multi-platinum sellers

The music on Play complements those samples, and vice versa. I couldn't have written the non-sample stuff on Play and then mixed everything together into effective songs, and I suspect most people here couldn't have either.


Quote:

Originally posted by markl You've got to be kidding MacDEF. From your posts I surmise you are no dummy. Every comment I've ever heard him say has been completely mis-informed.

Misinformed, or statements you just don't agree with? I think the latter probably is more often likely, and that's not in any way meant as an insult. Moby's views are out there... but that doesn't make him unintelligent.

I mean, c'mon, guys... everyone's jumping on me for sticking up for Moby, but let's get back to reality -- I'm not calling Moby a genius. I'm just disputing the assertions made at the beginning of this thread:

Moby is a talent-free twerp.
Moby's music is lame.
Moby is a pseudo-intellect twerp in love the sound of his own voice.
Moby has no insight whatsoever on anything.

Pretty harsh statements, and pretty personal in nature.

I still contend that the above reactions are more visceral ones to Moby's politics and persona than to his "talent" level.


Quote:

Originally posted by Jeff Guidry I'll also agree with markl. Just because he's left-wing and vegan doesn't mean he's intelligent.

I didn't say that -- I was saying the flipside: just because he's a left-wing vegan doesn't mean he's unintelligent

Quote:

I see nothing in your post that would support the assertion that Moby is an intelligent guy.

Well, it's kind of difficult to "prove" someone is intelligent

After all, none of us knows him personally. I base my opinions on articles I've read about him, interviews I've seen with him, things he's written, etc. Maybe the few things markl has seen him in made him look dumb, I don't know. But from what I've seen and read, he's not in any way unintelligent. He's out there, and does come off as a pseudo-intellectual at times, but I think that's just the way he comes off -- doesn't actually make him unintelligent.

 

[Clubkill]

My 2 cents:

As a student and aspiring electronic music maker, I have to give credit where credit is due. Moby has put together some good tracks, and is good "background music". I agree that grabbing snippets of the 'field music' can be viewed as uncreative/exploitive. However, by either listening to a fair amount of electronic music, or by doing it yourself, you realize just how hard it is to break out of the mold of a certain genre. To do this, and attain success accross genres is another thing. Moby has made a lot of very different music. A lot of it you would not even recognize (Animal Rights?) as being from him. I will praise anyone (Radiohead, Moby, Beck to a degree) who are able to take the best of a genre and mix it with another. I actually think that bringing things like negro spirituals and blues to more people is a good thing. The success of "O' Brother where art thou?" for example (though not every track was so) is great for people appreciating all genres.

As for his personality etc. I do not follow artists very much, but if he has found success after so much time trying things he is entitled to a little self-praise (at the risk of sounding like an a-hole, of course).

 

[Beagle]

Quote:

Originally posted by markl As for his lefty-leanings, I don't care if your'e a left or right-winger (OK depends on how far right), so long as you can speak intelligently about your beliefs and they have at least SOME internal consistency

Archie Bunker summed it up correctly; right-wing = right, left-wing = wrong! People often opt for popularity over common sense. Most talentless artists are in this category. I don't believe any political correctness should be brought into any discussion, especially one on the subject of music. The music is there or it isn't. Don't bring politics or beliefs into it. All too often people read more or hear more about an artist, so they are distracted from the music so they don't realize how lame it is, instead they focus on the manufactured hype glossing over a lack of talent.

 

[coolvij]

Quote:

Archie Bunker summed it up correctly; right-wing = right, left-wing = wrong!

I thought we were supposed to keep politics out of this, Beagle?!