[conquerator2]

I'll provide a voice of dissent on the AT 3D-Wing thing - I find it to be the most comfortable and easiest-to-live-with headband design since you just plop the cans on, and they fit well, and they're comfortable for hours and hours with no problem. The AKGs aren't bad either, with their auto-sizing, but "the bumps" is one of those never-ending, near mythological debates - I personally never had an issue with them, but by some accounts they're literally the worst thing in the entire history of human existence. AKG has switched to a "flat" headband in response to this, which seems to have appeased at least the majority of complaints. Basically I think both headphones will be very comfortable and I'd have no issues with them on those grounds.

The R70x has a reworked and much improved system. The only AT to work well with my head that I've owned and rather comfy too!
Might also be a nice fit here

 

[obobskivich]

The R70x has a reworked and much improved system. The only AT to work well with my head that I've owned and rather comfy too!
Might also be a nice fit here

I've owned or demo'd, according to the AT marketing literature, something like 3 or 4 "completely reworked and much improved" iterations of 3D Wing. I honestly have never noticed much of a difference apart from aesthetics. I'm glad if something works for someone else though!

 

[conquerator2]

I've owned or demo'd, according to the AT marketing literature, something like 3 or 4 "completely reworked and much improved" iterations of 3D Wing. I honestly have never noticed much of a difference apart from aesthetics. I'm glad if something works for someone else though!

Give them a shot if you can. Ypu might be pkeasantly surprised
Though they were mysteriously absent at every audio show I've been to...
They are very well received and one of their higher end models, so I wonder what gives.

 

[obobskivich]

Give them a shot if you can. Ypu might be pkeasantly surprised
Though they were mysteriously absent at every audio show I've been to...
They are very well received and one of their higher end models, so I wonder what gives.

I've not been disappointed by any of the ATs I've owned or tried, excepting their studio and DJ headphones, so I wouldn't expect to dislike them or find fitment issues. My point was that AT keeps reporting "big changes" to 3D Wing, and either I'm oblivious or they're actually pretty small changes.

 

[akg fanboy]

I've not been disappointed by any of the ATs I've owned or tried, excepting their studio and DJ headphones, so I wouldn't expect to dislike them or find fitment issues. My point was that AT keeps reporting "big changes" to 3D Wing, and either I'm oblivious or they're actually pretty small changes.

How do you compare the w5000 to the esp950? I already own the w5000 but not the esp950, and for the longest time I have viewed the esp950 as the upgrade from the w5000

 

[obobskivich]

How do you compare the w5000 to the esp950? I already own the w5000 but not the esp950, and for the longest time I have viewed the esp950 as the upgrade from the w5000

This is going outside of the scope of the thread, so I'll keep it brief:

I think the W5000 are the best headphones ever made (at least that I've ever heard - to (roughly) quote an excellent Will Farrell bit: "but maybe there's some new thing out there that I've never even seen before"), and I'm not "shy" about that (I know they're not well respected, especially after that high-end listicle review trashed them a few years ago). The 950s are very good, no question, but the W5000 (imho) give me everything the 950s do in terms of listening enjoyment, but also provide a more dynamic punch, have sweeter sounding treble, and offer some isolation that the 950s lack. In terms of "absolute measures" the 950s are more neutral, probably have a bit more low-end impact, and may play louder (I've never directly tried to assess this - I like my hearing). The W5000 bring more emotion/tactility to music, so you go from "this is technically beautiful" to "this is beautiful." If you've read my ESP/950 vs RS-1 review, I'd basically summarize the W5000 as being the perfect marriage of the best traits of both sides there, and also doing it in a closed-back format.

Of course, everyone will have different opinions on what sounds good and what they want, and I think "at this level" (this part can apply to this thread too) it really is as much informed by personal taste/preference as it is by overall performance - I don't think the W5000, ESP/950, HD 600, whatever can be seriously faulted in terms of "objective performance" but different people certainly will like one more than the other based on their own tastes or what-have-you.

 

[akg fanboy]

This is going outside of the scope of the thread, so I'll keep it brief:

I think the W5000 are the best headphones ever made (at least that I've ever heard - to (roughly) quote an excellent Will Farrell bit: "but maybe there's some new thing out there that I've never even seen before"), and I'm not "shy" about that (I know they're not well respected, especially after that high-end listicle review trashed them a few years ago). The 950s are very good, no question, but the W5000 (imho) give me everything the 950s do in terms of listening enjoyment, but also provide a more dynamic punch, have sweeter sounding treble, and offer some isolation that the 950s lack. In terms of "absolute measures" the 950s are more neutral, probably have a bit more low-end impact, and may play louder (I've never directly tried to assess this - I like my hearing). The W5000 bring more emotion/tactility to music, so you go from "this is technically beautiful" to "this is beautiful." If you've read my ESP/950 vs RS-1 review, I'd basically summarize the W5000 as being the perfect marriage of the best traits of both sides there, and also doing it in a closed-back format.

Of course, everyone will have different opinions on what sounds good and what they want, and I think "at this level" (this part can apply to this thread too) it really is as much informed by personal taste/preference as it is by overall performance - I don't think the W5000, ESP/950, HD 600, whatever can be seriously faulted in terms of "objective performance" but different people certainly will like one more than the other based on their own tastes or what-have-you.

Thanks for the comparison. the w5000 has a sharp dip in the treble that struck me with vocals that have reverb, but EQ solved it mostly. All I care about is mids and soundstage lol

 

[obobskivich]

Thanks for the comparison. the w5000 has a sharp dip in the treble that struck me with vocals that have reverb, but EQ solved it mostly.

That sharp dip is part of what I like. :atsmile:

All I care about is mids and soundstage lol

Ever tried the Sony MDR-F1?

 

[akg fanboy]

That sharp dip is part of what I like.

Ever tried the Sony MDR-F1?

How did you know I wanted to try the mdr f1? I bought the ma900 some time ago thinking it would be better since it was technically the successor, but did not like it because of the bass. I hear the mdr f1 has less bass, and still has the large soundstage/comfort. The f1 is so rare that I cannot find any frequency response graphs or in depth reviews, I remember seeing it in the darude sandstorm music video 

 

[obobskivich]

How did you know I wanted to try the mdr f1? I bought the ma900 some time ago thinking it would be better since it was technically the successor, but did not like it because of the bass. I hear the mdr f1 has less bass, and still has the large soundstage/comfort. The f1 is so rare that I cannot find any frequency response graphs or in depth reviews, I remember seeing it in the darude sandstorm music video 

They've been measured and the graphs posted on a Japanese website, here: http://www.geocities.jp/ryumatsuba/mdr-f1.html (bang around on some of his other measurements to get an idea of what they look like though - these are in no way directly comparable to stuff you might find from InnerFidelity or elsewhere).

I haven't heard the MA900, but sound-wise the F1 are a very fast, very lean, very clean presentation - the closest thing to electrostats I've ever heard from a dynamic can. Their soundstaging is absolutely perfect - they can go out as wide as the K701, and in as close as the RS-1, and every stop in-between, with no trouble. They're also somewhat warm and smooth (not "smoothed over") sounding, with rolled-off treble, which (imho) improves upon the SA5000's "Ice Queen" persona (I still think the SA5000 would be perfect for this thread's original request). They're very mid-centric, and do absolutely wonderful things with vocals, strings, etc, but they can also be very unforgiving - compression artefacts and other blemishes that most speakers/headphones gracefully glide over, the F1 will push right to the center of the stage and say "LOOK HERE, MISTAKES WERE MADE!" This can be grating with some videogames, where their soundstaging and comfort would be otherwise superb. They are bass-light (like the SA5000), and it rolls off gracefully (there's not a "hump" down there, unlike the SA5000) - they have less bass than W5000 or ESP/950. And the top-end rolls off pretty evenly too, which isn't so bad - they never end up sounding tinny or shrill as a result (unlike the SA5000). If you want a lot of bottom-end slam or re-enforcement they aren't the choice for you, but if you want what is quite possibly the king of n-shaped frequency response and soundstaging that is perhaps second-to-none, they're certainly worth a listen.

Oh, and on top of all that, they can be a pain to find a compatible amplifier for, with their 12 ohm nominal impedance and medium-range sensitivity (if memory serves is something in the mid to high 90s). They have a Zobel network that some people report the removal of improves the sound, but I've never attempted that, because I'd rather have the "these work everywhere and are more immune to amplifier output impedance and drive capabilities thanks to the Zobel network" feature (that's roughly what the owner's booklet describes its purpose as).

If the original query is still running - the F1 would hit most of the target goals, but they're more towards "warm" than "cold" so that might be a no-go. Certainly not congested or ooey-gooey, but they do have a somewhat warm tilt. The SA5000 are much colder, and have tighter (but more sharply rolled off) bass. They also do less good with front-to-back imaging, and can't cast quite as wide/broad an image, but are still well into the territory of "airy" sounding. In my view its a toss-up which one is actually more detailed or faster - I know the SA5000 have a reputation as being detail kings and speed demons, and to my ears the F1 can match them, but there exists less sense of exertion while they do it.

To loop back to other cans that've been mentioned (gotta make it at least somewhat relevant, right?):

- The ESP/950 are even more ethereal sounding, but (believe it or not) more forgiving of blemishes in the mids. They have more bass (impact and usable extension), and more treble quantity. They're perhaps faster, but IMHO we're already at a level of play where "faster" isn't really needed with the F1 or SA5000. The ESP/950 are much warmer than the SA5000, and somewhat warmer than the F1.

- The W5000 are brighter, more forceful, and more colored than any of these three. They are probably similar to the SA5000 in terms of soundstage size, but do better with front-to-back (probably on-par with the ESP/950 or F1), but can't cast as wide a stage as the F1. Speed-wise again its hard to judge, but they might have a slight edge. Probably similar extension to the F1 (and similarly graceful in the roll-off), but more impact in terms of what is usable, which is probably mostly due to them being closed. More forgiving of blemishes in the mids, but less forgiving of clashy or treble-forward/aggressive recordings due to their colored highs (which, imho, are divine).

- The HD 600 are like bathing in mud by comparison ("you know what I love about mud? It's so clean and dirty at the same time!"). Much warmer, much more mid-bass presence, more intimate/narrower presentation, better than the SA5000 but worse than the others at front-to-back, somewhat slower, etc. Still a very refined and high quality sound - they aren't just boom and bloom by any means. But they're decidedly different.

In terms of the dry/wet discussion, from dryest to wettest:
- SA5000
- The Mojave Desert
- ESP/950
- MDR-F1
- W5000
- HD 600

This is where T70 and A2000X become interesting - the A2000X are, to quote some other review I read while ago, "a less colored W5000" - for me that wasn't as exciting, but for others it may be just the ticket. They're somewhat dryer, smoother in their frequency response, less colored on the top-end, somewhat less forward, and a bit cooler sounding. Still very fast, spacious, and clean, and provide lots of detail. The T70 are probably as close to a closed-back SA5000 as you can get, for better and for worse. They don't have quite the same razor-sharp presentation of the SA5000, but they're still into the spectrum of cool, lean, fast, dry, etc presentations. But we're talking Antarctica vs a very cold day in the Midwest.

Comfort-wise, the F1 are probably in a league all their own - they're big (that picture is pretty good to gauge), but they weigh a measly ~200g (this is lighter than many Grados and other on-ear headphones). The pressure is so evenly spread around on their rings and headband that you can legitimately forget you're wearing them, and they don't get warm/hot in the least, and breathe fantastically (as you might imagine from one of the most open designs ever). That isn't to say the others aren't comfortable - all of these are very comfortable headphones in my opinion. The SA5000 are probably the oddest, and it comes back to that headband (the trick is to "lean it back" so the "hammock" part is on your head, and the rubberized metal doesn't touch you), but once you acclimate they're very comfortable as well.

Oh, and he's wearing them backwards in that picture. I don't mean "the frame was reversed" either - I mean he's legitimately wearing them backwards and could not put them on his head that way in a comfortable manner.

 

[conquerator2]

^ Thanks for that post :]
I still think the MDR-MA900 are worth a shot. They retain some of that F1 characteristics. The vocals are absolutely magical and they have an ethereal, airy quality. They also have slightly smoothed upper treble and the bass rolls off around 40Hz or so.
That said, I also prefer them to some of the higher priced headphones.They have a similar presentation to the ESP950, though the imaging is not as crystal clear.
If OP finds a place where they can audition and/or return them then they are worth an audition IMO. They also go used for fairly cheap from time to time.
Just my 2c 

 

[akg fanboy]

They've been measured and the graphs posted on a Japanese website, here: http://www.geocities.jp/ryumatsuba/mdr-f1.html (bang around on some of his other measurements to get an idea of what they look like though - these are in no way directly comparable to stuff you might find from InnerFidelity or elsewhere).

I haven't heard the MA900, but sound-wise the F1 are a very fast, very lean, very clean presentation - the closest thing to electrostats I've ever heard from a dynamic can. Their soundstaging is absolutely perfect - they can go out as wide as the K701, and in as close as the RS-1, and every stop in-between, with no trouble. They're also somewhat warm and smooth (not "smoothed over") sounding, with rolled-off treble, which (imho) improves upon the SA5000's "Ice Queen" persona (I still think the SA5000 would be perfect for this thread's original request). They're very mid-centric, and do absolutely wonderful things with vocals, strings, etc, but they can also be very unforgiving - compression artefacts and other blemishes that most speakers/headphones gracefully glide over, the F1 will push right to the center of the stage and say "LOOK HERE, MISTAKES WERE MADE!" This can be grating with some videogames, where their soundstaging and comfort would be otherwise superb. They are bass-light (like the SA5000), and it rolls off gracefully (there's not a "hump" down there, unlike the SA5000) - they have less bass than W5000 or ESP/950. And the top-end rolls off pretty evenly too, which isn't so bad - they never end up sounding tinny or shrill as a result (unlike the SA5000). If you want a lot of bottom-end slam or re-enforcement they aren't the choice for you, but if you want what is quite possibly the king of n-shaped frequency response and soundstaging that is perhaps second-to-none, they're certainly worth a listen.

Oh, and on top of all that, they can be a pain to find a compatible amplifier for, with their 12 ohm nominal impedance and medium-range sensitivity (if memory serves is something in the mid to high 90s). They have a Zobel network that some people report the removal of improves the sound, but I've never attempted that, because I'd rather have the "these work everywhere and are more immune to amplifier output impedance and drive capabilities thanks to the Zobel network" feature (that's roughly what the owner's booklet describes its purpose as).

If the original query is still running - the F1 would hit most of the target goals, but they're more towards "warm" than "cold" so that might be a no-go. Certainly not congested or ooey-gooey, but they do have a somewhat warm tilt. The SA5000 are much colder, and have tighter (but more sharply rolled off) bass. They also do less good with front-to-back imaging, and can't cast quite as wide/broad an image, but are still well into the territory of "airy" sounding. In my view its a toss-up which one is actually more detailed or faster - I know the SA5000 have a reputation as being detail kings and speed demons, and to my ears the F1 can match them, but there exists less sense of exertion while they do it.

To loop back to other cans that've been mentioned (gotta make it at least somewhat relevant, right?):

- The ESP/950 are even more ethereal sounding, but (believe it or not) more forgiving of blemishes in the mids. They have more bass (impact and usable extension), and more treble quantity. They're perhaps faster, but IMHO we're already at a level of play where "faster" isn't really needed with the F1 or SA5000. The ESP/950 are much warmer than the SA5000, and somewhat warmer than the F1.

- The W5000 are brighter, more forceful, and more colored than any of these three. They are probably similar to the SA5000 in terms of soundstage size, but do better with front-to-back (probably on-par with the ESP/950 or F1), but can't cast as wide a stage as the F1. Speed-wise again its hard to judge, but they might have a slight edge. Probably similar extension to the F1 (and similarly graceful in the roll-off), but more impact in terms of what is usable, which is probably mostly due to them being closed. More forgiving of blemishes in the mids, but less forgiving of clashy or treble-forward/aggressive recordings due to their colored highs (which, imho, are divine).

- The HD 600 are like bathing in mud by comparison ("you know what I love about mud? It's so clean and dirty at the same time!"). Much warmer, much more mid-bass presence, more intimate/narrower presentation, better than the SA5000 but worse than the others at front-to-back, somewhat slower, etc. Still a very refined and high quality sound - they aren't just boom and bloom by any means. But they're decidedly different.

In terms of the dry/wet discussion, from dryest to wettest:
- SA5000
- The Mojave Desert
- ESP/950
- MDR-F1
- W5000
- HD 600

This is where T70 and A2000X become interesting - the A2000X are, to quote some other review I read while ago, "a less colored W5000" - for me that wasn't as exciting, but for others it may be just the ticket. They're somewhat dryer, smoother in their frequency response, less colored on the top-end, somewhat less forward, and a bit cooler sounding. Still very fast, spacious, and clean, and provide lots of detail. The T70 are probably as close to a closed-back SA5000 as you can get, for better and for worse. They don't have quite the same razor-sharp presentation of the SA5000, but they're still into the spectrum of cool, lean, fast, dry, etc presentations. But we're talking Antarctica vs a very cold day in the Midwest.

Comfort-wise, the F1 are probably in a league all their own - they're big (that picture is pretty good to gauge), but they weigh a measly ~200g (this is lighter than many Grados and other on-ear headphones). The pressure is so evenly spread around on their rings and headband that you can legitimately forget you're wearing them, and they don't get warm/hot in the least, and breathe fantastically (as you might imagine from one of the most open designs ever). That isn't to say the others aren't comfortable - all of these are very comfortable headphones in my opinion. The SA5000 are probably the oddest, and it comes back to that headband (the trick is to "lean it back" so the "hammock" part is on your head, and the rubberized metal doesn't touch you), but once you acclimate they're very comfortable as well.

Oh, and he's wearing them backwards in that picture. I don't mean "the frame was reversed" either - I mean he's legitimately wearing them backwards and could not put them on his head that way in a comfortable manner.

I really appreciate the time you took to write this. Really cool to see a comparison between some of the best headphones for the midrange since I am really a mids head. And now that I think of it, I think you are too since you own a lot of headphones with great mids 

 
I missed that mdr f1 chart, could have been because it was in japanese. Close to electrostatic sound with soundstage around the k701..... now I'm seriously interested. Very mid centric is absolutely amazing, because I especially love stringed instruments, piano, and vocals. The second most important to me is the upper mids for electric guitars, but a rolled treble doesn't hurt me at all as long as it's a smooth roll off without any big dips below 10k (contrary to what it would seem like since the hd800 is my favorite). It's weird how a headphone with slightly rolled off treble is so unforgiving, I know a lot of detail is contained in the midrange but I always see bright headphones like the hd800 or T1 as the most unforgiving, but most of my recordings (90%) are well recorded and sound good on my hd800 too so I don't think this will be a huge issue for me. Bass roll off isn't an issue for me, the akg 700 series gets mocked all the time for lacking bass but I love it. N shaped and huge soundstage is actually PRECISELY what I am looking for, and that is why I LOVE my k601 so much. The reason why I haven't bought an mdr f1 is really because of how expensive they are ($400+ used) and I wasn't certain if they truly were a king of mids but now I don't have to worry about that 

. Maybe I will like these so much they can knock my k601 off of my favorite headphone for mids? 
 
12ohm is really a disaster for me.... my matrix mstage has an output impedance of 10ohm!!!! I immediately noticed a buzzzz when plugging in my w5000 which isn't anywhere near 12ohm, but the etymotic er4s adapter solved the buzz for me actually. I hope it will work with the mdr f1 as well because from my knowledge, they change the impedance of the headphone to 100ohm which is more than enough for the 1/8th rule.
 
I'm surprised the esp950 has more bass and treble than the mdr f1 because the esp950 looks to have sharply rolled off treble, and lower bass. Now that can mean either the mdr f1 lacks treble and bass (which my bias points to no), or the mdr f1 just has that much of an amazing midrange. I love how you say the hd600 is like a mud bath in comparison because that's EXACTLY how I feel, the mids on the hd600 frankly did not amaze me at all and the mid bass presence was pretty strong compared to the mid mids. I really like how the mdr f1 and esp950 are right smack in the middle of wet and dry because those are the two I am interested in most, but with what you said about the mids and soundstage of the mdr f1.... I'm definitely leaning on those as a higher priority as of now. I never really had an interest in the sa5000, and your explanation of them just convinced me I'm never getting those lol.
 
The weight of the mdr f1 is also a primary reason why I wanted them, to me, comfort is the most important because no matter how much I love a headphone, if it is uncomfortable then the sound is moot to me, after all, who wants to be punished for using their favorite headphones? They are slightly lighter than my q701s which are supremely light to begin with. 
Ah, I never noticed the headphones were backwards in the music video lol, but now that I think of it, it makes complete sense since angled drivers should be angled in front of you for better stereo imaging like the positioning of a speaker

 

[obobskivich]

I really appreciate the time you took to write this. Really cool to see a comparison between some of the best headphones for the midrange since I am really a mids head. And now that I think of it, I think you are too since you own a lot of headphones with great mids :evil:

I would say I'm somewhere between "Team Mid-Centric" and "Treble Head" when it comes to my headphone choices (and I say this while listening to bass-heavy dance music on TH-900 :rolleyes.

I missed that mdr f1 chart, could have been because it was in japanese. Close to electrostatic sound with soundstage around the k701..... now I'm seriously interested. Very mid centric is absolutely amazing, because I especially love stringed instruments, piano, and vocals. The second most important to me is the upper mids for electric guitars, but a rolled treble doesn't hurt me at all as long as it's a smooth roll off without any big dips below 10k (contrary to what it would seem like since the hd800 is my favorite). It's weird how a headphone with slightly rolled off treble is so unforgiving, I know a lot of detail is contained in the midrange but I always see bright headphones like the hd800 or T1 as the most unforgiving, but most of my recordings (90%) are well recorded and sound good on my hd800 too so I don't think this will be a huge issue for me. Bass roll off isn't an issue for me, the akg 700 series gets mocked all the time for lacking bass but I love it. N shaped and huge soundstage is actually PRECISELY what I am looking for, and that is why I LOVE my k601 so much. The reason why I haven't bought an mdr f1 is really because of how expensive they are ($400+ used) and I wasn't certain if they truly were a king of mids but now I don't have to worry about that :evil: . Maybe I will like these so much they can knock my k601 off of my favorite headphone for mids? 

I would say they do better than K701 in terms of soundstaging, and not just "they can get bigger" but they can actually get up-close, which the 701 could never accomplish in my time with them. I remember some years ago, I think around the time the GS-1000 came out, John Grado said something along the lines of "you can have a really intimate presentation, or a really big soundstage" and having heard the RS-1 and GS-1000, I'd agree. And then there's the MDR-F1.

As far as being unforgiving, its a different kind of unforgiving (if that makes any sense). Most of the time what I suspect people mean when talking about unforgiving is that they turn some recordings into "clash trash" because you've got a bright/forward/aggressive (aka "audiophile tuned" headphone - I'll pick on the Beyerdynamic T70 for this, as I've heard them, and they do epitomize this to an extent) voicing, and you throw some bright/aggressive recording into it, especially one that's been encoded badly, and you get a lot of clashy, abrasive, noise on teh top end. There are plenty of headphones that do this - MDR-SA5000 are just as bad, for example. What the F1s do, by contrast, is provide (imho) fairly natural/neutral tonality to the mid-range, and if its been heavily compressed (we're talking either dynamic compression or bad encoding) you absolutely hear about it - the artefacts are just right there for god and everyone to see (hear?). But they won't get as clashy as the SA5000 or other bright "hi-fi" headphones, because the top end rolls off more gracefully.

12ohm is really a disaster for me.... my matrix mstage has an output impedance of 10ohm!!!! I immediately noticed a buzzzz when plugging in my w5000 which isn't anywhere near 12ohm, but the etymotic er4s adapter solved the buzz for me actually. I hope it will work with the mdr f1 as well because from my knowledge, they change the impedance of the headphone to 100ohm which is more than enough for the 1/8th rule.

I'd dismiss the 1/8th rule as its too over-generalized, but the 12 ohm load will cause a problem for a lot of devices. And "if it works with IEMs, it will probably work with the F1" may not even hold, because most IEMs have 10 dB (or more) on them in terms of sensitivity. They aren't "hard" to drive, but they aren't a Grado or AT with 32-40 ohm nominal impedance and 100 dB (or higher) sensitivity either. The Zobel network is supposed to help mitigate this, but like I said, I've never experimented with bypassing/removing it.

I'm surprised the esp950 has more bass and treble than the mdr f1 because the esp950 looks to have sharply rolled off treble, and lower bass. Now that can mean either the mdr f1 lacks treble and bass (which my bias points to no), or the mdr f1 just has that much of an amazing midrange.

The 950 have more bass extension and impact to my ears, and they hit a lot harder in the lower registers than the F1. The F1 are very lean, while I'd put the 950 somewhere just shy of neutral. Probably right at the threshold of "thin" in my book, and probably absolutely over it for what I imagine more modern sensibilities lean towards (yes I'm basically talking about the post-Beats world where warm, dark, and bassy pretty much define most house sounds, and there aren't many cold, dry, etc options out there (especially if you don't want old designs).

I love how you say the hd600 is like a mud bath in comparison because that's EXACTLY how I feel, the mids on the hd600 frankly did not amaze me at all and the mid bass presence was pretty strong compared to the mid mids. I really like how the mdr f1 and esp950 are right smack in the middle of wet and dry because those are the two I am interested in most, but with what you said about the mids and soundstage of the mdr f1.... I'm definitely leaning on those as a higher priority as of now. I never really had an interest in the sa5000, and your explanation of them just convinced me I'm never getting those lol.

The SA5000 are a hard headphone to live with, and even harder to love. I've owned (and sold) them twice. I regretted it both times, and yet did it both times (and if they were still in production and for sale, I'd probably own them yet again, to give you some idea of the kind of hate/love thing that's going on there). They do a lot of things very well, but they can also sound spectacularly awful with the wrong source material. The best way I can summarize the SA5000 experience is that you spend a lot of time playing the "I wonder how this sounds?" game, and when you hit on something that jives with them, and get a glimpse of what they're capable of, its a fantastic listen.

As far as the Sennheisers go, my feeling is that nothing ever really sounds awful through them, but they do "scale" well when fed better content. Still, I think there's better warm-and-fluffy sounding cans out there, and in terms of being clean, well balanced, and somewhat warm, the ESP/950 do a much better job. Again, imho. Of course, the Sennheisers (on most days) cost less, and really don't do anything wrong - I just think there's better stuff (especially for my preferences) out there.

The weight of the mdr f1 is also a primary reason why I wanted them, to me, comfort is the most important because no matter how much I love a headphone, if it is uncomfortable then the sound is moot to me, after all, who wants to be punished for using their favorite headphones? They are slightly lighter than my q701s which are supremely light to begin with. 

Honestly the 701 are "fine" as far as comfort goes, but the F1 are about as close as I suspect a full size headphone can get to "no headphone at all." It isn't just about the raw weight - they're pretty well balanced, and don't have as much "outward" weight as most other cans.

Ah, I never noticed the headphones were backwards in the music video lol, but now that I think of it, it makes complete sense since angled drivers should be angled in front of you for better stereo imaging like the positioning of a speaker

Sony calls (or called) it "auranomic." Some time ago there was a degree of popularity for the various headphones that looked like this (I don't know a whole lot about these, but there's apparently a few lesser models "under" the MDR-F1 that are fairly similar, along with the MDR-SA series) for binaural reproduction. Admittedly I've never done very much with the F1 and binaural recordings, but I do remember reading about it.

 

[punkmanmatthew]

Didn't have time to read all the post but all I have to say is Grado 325e. Mic drop!


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