Inexpensive amp to drive Beyer DT150's

Apr 6, 2008 at 1:13 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 8

noctodonta

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Hey there, this is my first post. I lurked in here when gaining knowledge to choose my first pair of serious headphones and the commitment in here is breathtaking.

I'm on the lookout for an amp that will drive good tunes through my 250 ohm Beyerdynamic DT150's. I find the market a little hard to overlook and would therefore like to hear your opinions.

My source will be a laptop through a Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS sound card, it does regular output as well as SPDIF. I might want to be portable at some point (Is this feasible considering the 250 ohms, though?) but my DT150's are not very portable themselves, so this is not an ultimatum. Desktop use is the real purpose.

The price range will extend to around 500$, although an investment like that is long term. I live in Europe so international brands/resellers would be appreciated.
 
Apr 6, 2008 at 1:18 PM Post #2 of 8
I'm looking at the Meier 2Move. DAC looks like it's a nice thing to have. It seems people agree portable amps are a good starting point even with their shortcomings. Also, I'm not having trouble with the volume level: The DT150's can blow my head clean off if I want them to. Instead, I'm hoping to see improvement in sound quality. Are there desktop alternatives with DAC in the same price range that will do a better job?
 
Apr 6, 2008 at 11:50 PM Post #3 of 8
I'm just bumping this one last time. I'm wondering: My phones have "2x250 ohm" printed on them. Does this mean they are impeded with 500 ohms?

I seem to agree with Boomana's point in her threat about portable-whoring vs. desktop quality. Will I feel the difference with my mid-range phone?

I'd really like some input from some of the very knowledgable people in here.
 
Apr 7, 2008 at 3:23 AM Post #4 of 8
i am no expert and have zero experience with any other amp than my zana deux.

My 2 cents worth is this: your DT150 are NOT mid-range. They are very very very good monitor cans. They deserve the best you can afford. Desk tops will "generally" be better and i think this is the way to go for a start.

Anything lousy upstream will be heard thru these beauties.... Not many ppl have experience with these cans and that probably explains why things a bit quiet.....
 
Apr 7, 2008 at 11:19 AM Post #5 of 8
I'm glad to hear your opinion on the 150's and thank you for your reply. My buddy junior head-fier wasn't into them at all and found them muddy. However, out of all the Senns, AKG's, Beyers, Grados, etc. I tested I found the 150's to be the most enjoyable to my ears and I love them still. After a while of break-in they are nothing short of amazing. I love the fact that their range envelopes anything you throw at it with not hint of distortion at all. I thought they were considered mid-range seeing as they weren't exactly popular in here and their price tag was only around 250$.

Seeing as you are familiar with my phones, what do you think of your Zana as an amp? How would you characterize its sound and such?

Edit: I just checked out the Zana. Delicious as it seems it is sadly way out of my price range. Congrats on owning that beast.

I have never tried a head phone amp other than a 1000$ amp for five minutes in a store with the top Grado cans (Which was amazing, mind you) so I don't really know what to expect but I'd really love to see how far I can get as regards sound quality.

If people find it hard to recommend an amp for the DT150's I think they are rather comparable to the DT770's, although a tad clearer sounding. Which amp would someone recommend for DT770-sounding phones?

What exactly do you mean by 'upstream'? Searching for it, it seems to be an artificial upsamling which may or may not sound too digital.

I have looked at the Meier Corda Arietta and Firestone Cute Beyond. Neither have DAC, however, and the Firestone apparently ought to have a separate power supply with it. That seems a little unfair, I think.

The Darkvoice 336i seems like it has garnered a good reputation here in Europe. Again, it doesn't have DAC, though.

Please bring up some suggestions, people (As mentioned you can imagine selecting an amp for a clearer set of DT770's).
 
Apr 7, 2008 at 7:02 PM Post #6 of 8
I will also chime in and tell you that DT150s are definitely NOT mere "midrange" 'phones. They pretty much trounce the DT770 (which is much-hyped here on HeadFi) in all areas except perhaps bass impact (DT150 bass tighter and more detailed though), and are priced similarly. I'm not sure why so few here on HeadFi have experience with them (somewhat harder to find than DT770, but readily available through several well-known retailers-mine came from BH Photo). I have compared them with several considerably more expensive cans, and nothing I have encountered thus far does a better overall job of accurately communicating the source material. Some of the higher-priced 'phones may do certain things better than the DT150, but IME this consistently is at the expense of other performance parameters. Also, the DT150 build quality is far, far ahead of most of the high-end cans (even though it IS pretty ugl..,er,"industrial" in appearance-looks like it belongs in a speech therapy lab!), and every part is replacable (and Beyer customer service is excellent).

As to source/amplification components, I have found these 'phones do best with amps which can supply plenty of current. I have used ASL MG-Head OTL Ver. III (pure tube), Musical Fidelity XCanV3 (tube gain stage, MosFET outputs), and PS Audio GCHA (pure solid-state). The ASL made for a very pleasant sounding system (warm, "musical", and nonfatiguing), but was simply too laid-back and lacking in details-consistently found myself turning up the volume to try to flesh out more detail, and occasionally nodded off to sleep (this setup DOES help alleviate some listenter/ear fatigue due to poor recording quality). The GCHA made for a very lively, detailed sound (which is what I prefer) but lacked the warm, "comforting" sound of the ASL. I found (to my ears) the best of both worlds in the XCan V3 (NOS Russian 6h23-EB tubes); I bought this amp when priced US $399-it now retails for US $499, which is still a good value given the level of performance (build quality is also very nice).

As to source components, get the best you can afford. The DT150 will EASILY reveal the differences in sources. My best digital source components are the NAD C542 CDP, Bel Canto DAC-2, and Metronome Technologie CD-2V (Signature); I can EASILY discern the improvements as I move up the chain, starting with the C542 alone, then C542-->DAC-2, then CD2V (all using XCan for amplification, which is also very revealing of differences in sources). The CD2V is not the end-all, be-all of CD players but IS a legitimate "high-end" design which is perfectly competitive with other players (actually better in many regards, which is why I own it
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) in its price range ($3500 when I bought in 2003, would now probably cost $5000 given the weak US dollar); the point is that the DT150 is definitely a 'phone that will "grow" with you as you upgrade your sources.

If I were in your position, I would probably spend my current budget obtaining a good amp (X-Can V3 is the winner out of the ones I have used) and would then save for a source upgrade. The DT150+X-Can is an excellent foundation which will respond beautifully to source upgrades at least through the "mainstream" high-end price range of US $3000-5000. Equipment costing more than this price range is deep into the "point of diminishing returns" territory where spending more money only yields minimal improvements.

Anytime I give anyone advice regarding equipment, I also encourage them to save enough to buy some new recordings for their collection. I would give you the same encouragement, but the fact is you are going to have so much fun hearing new things in recordings you already own that you may not feel the need to acquire anything new for some time.

I hope this helps. Congratulations: from your post it appears this is your first foray into the world of high-end 'phone listenting, and you are off to a GREAT start with the DT150! You are going to experience first-hand just how much great music can enhance your quality of life in all areas.

Sorry about your wallet though!
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Apr 7, 2008 at 11:17 PM Post #7 of 8
Therm dude is on the mark...

Upstream in the context of your cans means EVERYTHING else..... cdp, amp, intercons, power cords, line conditioner.... yes even the cds themselves. They are that revealing.

I've heard them in a shop several times and liked them. Also heard them at a friend's place out of a Yamamoto and also PS Audio GCHA and it clearly showed the difference between them AND a whole load of "noise" on the yammy which wasn't so discernable on other cans.

Why haven't i got a pair? well, wallet still in coma and rather "worried" what these things will reveal on my setup.... seriously.
 
Apr 8, 2008 at 1:27 PM Post #8 of 8
Thanks for that lengthy reply, Thermionic. Glad to hear more opinions on the DT150. It seems people ought to spread the word about them, as I said they were rather cheap at 250$. I agree with you on the 770's as well. Although I really liked what they were trying to do the higher ranges sounded annoying to me. I would probably have bought those over the AKG K271 if I hadn't been introduced to the DT150 by a professional sound store guy.

I am in the fortunate situation that I will actually be able to hear and buy the X-can in a store here in town (589$, probably cheaper if ordered from Germany). I will do that one of these days and see what it feels like. You say you are using Russion NOS tubes, does that mean I might want to mod the amp once I get it or is it the stock tubes you are referring to?

I hope they won't laugh too hard at me when I bring my laptop and CardBus sound card to test it with, though
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That is the setup I will be using in the near future, although my wallet will be well fed this summer... I might consider an upgrade then if I'm happy with my amp and want more from it.

Most of my music is converted to FLAC (I'm a tosser when it comes to taking care of CD's, I also suspect that my crappy Panasonic stereo has been scratching them), so are there any high end sound card alternatives when it comes to using the computer as a source? I will need it to be either a USB or CardBus-interface as I don't even own a stationary computer.

I am getting lazy now though, I will check out this board about sound cards and such, but both your opinions seem to highly reflect my own and know that they are most appreciated.

Nghows, reading your explanation of upstream I must admit it sent shivers down my wallet's spine. I will look into buying an amp first and further down the road an appropriate source. By then I will consider the diminishing returns as you said, Thermionic
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Also, your CD-2V looks mouth watering, but I'm not quite there yet
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Thanks for the replies, they are of great use.
 

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