[bigshot]

Set the speakers up on milk crates or books. Don't tilt them up. Just raise them a little higher.

I'm glad you got what you need out of the thread!

 

[amirm]

which is immeasurably better than: You keep misrepresenting known acousticians!

So you keep saying as PR line but without yet reading a single piece of research I have put forward! None. There is no curiosity here to learn but an attempt at fighting with words.

I won't ask you to quote your sources anymore as it is clear they don't exist, or you don't know they really believe and are fearful I would show such.

 

[amirm]

"I rarely participate in internet forums of any kind, but I do look in from time to time. Occasionally my name appears, along with expressions of what people think I believe about certain things. I make an effort to ensure that anything I write or say reflects the results of accurate measurements and double-blind tests done by me or someone else. ...
And Now, What “Toole” Really Believes:
By now I hope that readers have concluded that the matter of early reflections in rooms is not a simple one. There is no single “right” way to do things. ...
In Figure 22.3 at the end of my book presents suggestions for room treatment based on guidance from research. The portions of side walls responsible for first lateral reflections are specified as “optional areas: absorb, diffuse, reflect.” It is a decision to be made by the customer and/or the installer. People who assert that I am in favor of lateral reflections obviously did not finish reading my book." - Floyd Toole 2016.

Almost seems like it's addressed to you personally amirm? Here's the full article for anyone interested.

I am glad you are finally doing something other than presenting word salad and arguments. And let's see if you misrepresented it or not. Here is the start of the article:



This is the exact message I have been communicating at the start. That there is an exception group that does want reduced reflections, i.e. recording and mixing engineers. So when you include them in the total set of, then of course the strategy varies. But take them out of the population as is the case in home listening, as confirmed above with "fully enjoying music" and the advice becomes clear: default action should be to leave lateral/first reflections alone.

The other very importanted related point that he makes is the process of adaptation. As humans, we have incredible ability to "hear past the room." When we move from room to room, our loved ones sound the same to us even though the acoustics of the room changes tremendously. These do lend "complexity" to this topic as a whole which is what Dr. Toole is conveying. What it doesn't do is make us dumb with respect to giving sound advice for music enjoyment per above.

BTW, if you really want to know what Dr. Toole means, listen to him in person. I have done so countless times and I tell you that the message there against what you all advocate is blunt and strong: that misinformation is constantly spread without any back of audio science as we have witnessed in this thread. There, you get presented with slides like this (a great course at CEDIA which sadly is no longer taught by Dr. Toole):

This is 100% the message that I conveyed and one that you have been fighting.

Few things in audio is more important than room acoustics. It is critical that we listen to summaries of this important topic and spend the time to learn more. Your obstructions and argumentative posts don't help with that.

 

[bigshot]

So how is everyone's day going so far?

 

[gregorio]

One of the myths of audio is that room reflections are all bad, and that room acoustical treatment should be directed at eliminating them.

[1] This is 100% the message that I conveyed [1a] and one that you have been fighting.
[2] BTW, if you really want to know what Dr. Toole means ...

1. No it is NOT! Again, enough with the misrepresentations!! Evidence that room reflections are not all bad is NOT evidence of the opposite, that room reflections are all good and should never be treated.
1a. NO! You've (just for a change) completely misrepresented what I'm "fighting" and despite this being pointed out to you repeatedly, you just continue misrepresenting it! I have stated repeatedly that room reflections are not all bad and should not automatically be eliminated, so how on earth does quoting experts stating that "room reflections are not all bad and should not automatically eliminated" contradict my position?

2. Huh? I already know what Dr. Toole means, he made it abundantly clear what he means, he even went to the trouble of clarifying what he means because he was obviously sick and tired of people like you misrepresenting what he means! BTW, you obviously missed the part where he states "It is a decision to be made by the customer and/or the installer." - Note he refers to customers/installers, not specifically acoustic engineers! If you feel Dr. Toole is wrong, then why don't you take it up with him and get him to change what he's publicly stated, shouldn't be a problem if you know him as well as you're making out.

You've quoted 3 respected acousticians (that I recall in this thread), ALL of whom disagree with you! 2 of them (Weiner and Grimani) you even admit disagree with you and the third (Toole), you've misrepresented so he appears to agree with you but he's specifically quashed that misrepresentation. You then demand that I present names/references to evidence that you're wrong but why, what's the point, you've already done that admirably all by yourself!!

amirm, you seem completely normal and rational until you're challenged on some obvious misunderstanding or incorrect advice and then the red mist descends, you throw all your toys out of your playpen and turn it into: "I'm amirm, I'm absolutely right and I can prove I'm right by providing experts who disagree with me, misrepresenting the science and misrepresenting your arguments!" Maybe you've got some serious ego problem or maybe you have some product to sell but whatever, enough is enough already!!

G

 

[antonpinchuk]

I have installed acoustic panels and corner bass traps in my condo living room. I feel significant difference. As well as I have struck a balance between the cost and interior design (that was my wife's requirement).

I filmed the process and made a sound test before and after. You can skip the part where I'm talking about "damaging" walls paint and scroll to the final result.

Please have a look at panel layouts and the room configuration and advise if I need any extra improvement there.