[iponderous]

^ I think that's the salient point Spyro - personal preference (although the OP probably doesn't think so as his/her thread has been hijacked). Why some people here persist in trying to prove that their subjective experience is an objective fact is beyond me.

 

[music_4321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mark2410 /img/forum/go_quote.gif vast majority? evidentiary support for such a statement?

Yes, the VAST majority. I believe the 133 pages dedicated to the UM3X show plenty of evidence and, again, you know that very well. While your opinion is certainly valid, it would've been more honest to have said something along the lines of "I'm one of the (very) few who finds the UM3X..."

 

[music_4321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iponderous /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes Mark, how dare you express a dissenting view against the "VAST majority of UM3X owners", particularly when you know that the collective weight of their subjective opinions should quash your own. Just who do you think you are - Galileo?

No comment.

 

[Arjisme]

Quote:

Originally Posted by music_4321 /img/forum/go_quote.gif To me (and others) the UM3X excel in most, if not all, music genres and vocals, in particular, are rendered beautifully. I found the SE530's mid range better than the W3's, but NOT better than the UM3X at all. Add to that controlled, tight AND well defined bass, and a noticeably better treble extension than the SE530 without creating listening fatigue, (ie you can listen to them for hours on end) plus the added comfort and complete lack of microphonics... the UM3X is indeed a remarkable IEM, competing easily with the much more expensive (and brilliant) custom ES3X ($850) - that level of SQ I simply could not find in the SE530's.

Can you comment on how you compared these IEMs? That is, if I recall correctly, you didn't own you SE530s for a long time so I am interested to know if you were able to listen to the UM3X and the SE530 at the same time and compare directly. I think that is useful to know.

Also, on the listener fatigue bit, I think you point was only that the UM3X does not create that even though it has great treble extension, right? You were not saying the SE530 or W3s do cause listener fatigue, right?

 

[Spyro]

I'm sure music 4321 will chime in but having owned all three in terms of fatigue.

W3: Most fatiguing. Spiky treble can sound siblant to some.

SE530: Actually NOT very fatiguing at all. Pretty laid back however that strong midrange can sometimes "shout" at you. But overall SE530 very easy and smooth to listen to.

UM3X: No fatigue whatsoever and I listen pretty loudly. Smoothest sounding IEM I have ever stuck in my ear YET, very detailed. Truly an engineering marvel IMHO.

 

[music_4321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arjisme /img/forum/go_quote.gif Can you comment on how you compared these IEMs? That is, if I recall correctly, you didn't own you SE530s for a long time so I am interested to know if you were able to listen to the UM3X and the SE530 at the same time and compare directly. I think that is useful to know. Also, on the listener fatigue bit, I think you point was only that the UM3X does not create that even though it has great treble extension, right? You were not saying the SE530 or W3s do cause listener fatigue, right?

You're right, I had the SE530's for a month and was terribly disappointed by both the SQ AND build quality - comfort was OK, though the earpieces along with the cables were too heavy for my taste, and I always had the feeling something was in my ears.

I then got the W3, which I certainly enjoyed more, but for extended listening sessions, specially with Rock and Pop, they caused listening fatigue after a couple of hours if I turned the volume up. I still preferred the SQ on the W3 as I found the bass & treble on the SE530's somewhat muffled. Comfort & more so microphonics were better on the W3. With the Westone cable being much lighter that the SE530's, I could more easily forget I had IEM's on.

Then sold the W3's and got my custom ES3X, and while having multiple re-fits -- and all the time involved (3 months) in getting my 4th and final set -- I decided to get the UM3X and was immediately blown away. As Spyro said one thing that really surprised me was the fantastic instrument separation - simply second to none (except, of course, my ES3X). The treble wasn't as recessed as that on the SE530's nor as prominent as on the W3's - to me, it was just the right amount, ideal for 4-6 hour sessions even at louder volumes with any sort of music.

The comfort on the UM3X was simply stunning, matching that on my beloved $850 ES3X. How could these smaller shells produce such stunning SQ and be that comfortable, I wondered. The smaller headstage has never been a problem; I find it intimate enough to be much more than adequate.

 

[CENTRAL]

@ music 4321: how would you describe the bass of the three earphones (W3-SE530_UM3X)?

 

[music_4321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CENTRAL /img/forum/go_quote.gif @ music 4321: how would you describe the bass of the three earphones (W3-SE530_UM3X)?

UM3X - plenty of it, tight, controlled and well defined, can extend quite low.

W3 - A bit too much at times, getting on the way of the mid range, though generally better defined than the SE530, but not as 'accurate' as the UM3X.

SE530 - plenty (quantity-wise) but not so well defined and at times a bit muffled.

 

[CENTRAL]

Thanx!

Given current prices the UM3X really sounds like a high end bargain...

 

[iponderous]

Quote:

Originally Posted by music_4321 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, the VAST majority. I believe the 133 pages dedicated to the UM3X show plenty of evidence and, again, you know that very well. While your opinion is certainly valid, it would've been more honest to have said something along the lines of "I'm one of the (very) few who finds the UM3X..."

There is nothing dishonest about not feeling the need to qualify what your own ears are telling you.

The evidence that you cite in the UM3X Appreciation Thread is anecdotal and should not be misrepresented as empirical evidence. It's an appreciation thread. It stands to reason that the "VAST majority" of people who are motivated to post there are those that are happy with their UM3X's and want to share their experience with others who feel the same way.

I draw four conclusions from your numerous and repetitive posts regarding the UM3X:
a) You had the SE530's and were bitterly disappointed with them;
b) You regard the UM3X as comprehensively superior to the SE530;
c) Having tried five universal IEMs, you believe that the UM3X is the best; and
d) You love your ES3X's but find that the UM3X's are not too far behind in sound quality and are just as comfortable to wear, perhaps slightly more so. Consequently, you regard the UM3X as offering excellent value for a top tier universal IEM.

Mark has tried numerous universal IEMs including the UM3X. He doesn't share your enthusiasm for them:
a) He finds them to be picky with sound sources;
b) He thinks that they do most things well but don't excel in any particular area; and
c) He prefers the sound signature of the SE530 to that of the UM3X.

So what are the facts? Well, let's start with a small but important qualification. A belief should not be confused with a truth or a fact. Your posts indicate strongly that you believe the UM3X to be the best universal IEM. This is based on your listening experiences with a total of five universal IEMs. Mark does not share your belief and he has listened to and owned many more universal IEMs than you.

Mark's extensive experience with more IEMs doesn't devalue your own but it provides another perspective, which is just as valid as yours. It also shows that your belief that the UM3X is the best universal IEM is nothing more than that. Unfortunately, you present your subjective view in a didactic manner. You might believe that you are right but you can't prove it in any objective or meaningful way, so why bother trying? It really is a pointless pursuit, particularly here in this forum, which is dedicated to people sharing their personal experiences and opinions relating to headphone listening.

So what have we actually established? I think we can agree that you prefer the UM3X to the SE530 and Mark prefers the SE530 to the UM3X and that's fine - "different strokes for different folks".

I think it's also safe to say that some people prefer pasta to rice, warm weather to cold, blue to green, theatre to cinema, books to videos, jazz to death metal... Oh, and some people have no interest in headphones whatsoever.

 

[music_4321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iponderous /img/forum/go_quote.gif I draw four conclusions from your numerous and repetitive posts regarding the UM3X: c) Having tried three universal IEMs, you believe that the UM3X is the best; and So what are the facts? This is based on your listening experiences with a total of three IEMs. Mark does not share your belief and he has listened to and owned many more universal IEMs than you.

From my 'numerous and repetitive' posts as you 'kindly' put it, you seem to have got your facts wrong. I've owned more than 3 IEM's:

-- The UE super 5 v2 (see my sig),
-- The Sony MDR-EX90 (see my sig, and which I still own and think it's an excellent product for the current price of $60 down from $100),
-- The Sony MDR-E888LP (see my sig),
-- The Sony MDR-EX71 (not listed in my sig).

On top of that, I've owned the full sized Sennheiser HD650's (see my sig) & the AKG K-141 Monitor (see my sig) -- I prefer the UM3X over these two and (obviously) all the ones listed above.

 

[iponderous]

^ I acknowledge the oversight regarding the number of universal IEMs that you have owned. However, I was referring to your earlier post in this thread, not your sig (I have now amended the figure in my post from three to five). Be that as it may, the purpose of my post was not to chronicle the headphones that you and Mark have owned and I suspect you know that. At least I hope that you do, even if you are not prepared to acknowledge it.

 

[insomniax]

Quote:

Originally Posted by music_4321 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, the VAST majority. I believe the 133 pages dedicated to the UM3X show plenty of evidence and, again, you know that very well. While your opinion is certainly valid, it would've been more honest to have said something along the lines of "I'm one of the (very) few who finds the UM3X..."

The point here is that mark2410's preference of the 530s to the um3x does not relate at all to his honesty and credibility, as you have questioned above. He only stated his preference for the shures and did not make misleading/dishonest remarks about everyone liking the 530s.

I think you owe him an apology for unfairly questioning his honesty. However, preference wise you are definitely entitled to your opinion, as others are.

 

[iponderous]

^ I think you mean mark2410 but I completely agree with your sentiment.

 

[music_4321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iponderous /img/forum/go_quote.gif ^ I acknowledge that oversight. However, I was referring to your earlier post in this thread, not your sig. Be that as it may, the purpose of my post was not to chronicle the headphones that you and Mark have owned and I suspect you know that. At least I hope that you do, even if you are not prepared to acknowledge it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by insomniax /img/forum/go_quote.gif The point here is that tstarn06's preference of the 530s to the um3x does not relate at all to his honesty and credibility, as you have questioned above. He only stated his preference for the shures and did not make misleading/dishonest remarks about everyone liking the 530s. I think you owe him an apology for unfairly questioning his honesty. However, preference wise you are definitely entitled to your opinion, as others are.

Quote:

Originally Posted by iponderous /img/forum/go_quote.gif ^ I think you mean mark2410 but I completely agree with your sentiment.

At this stage there's nothing more for me to add except I have no comments to make to the above posts -- already said more than enough on this thread.