Grado SR225e owner: SR325e vs PS500e vs RS2e - which way to upgrade?

[GreenBow]

I have had my Grado SR225i with e drivers since mid October 2014. I have the itch to upgrade and simply can not chose which way to go.
 
I am thinking about the SR325e, PS500e, and the RS2e, and each for different reasons. I have no desire to own two sets of headphones as some do to have two different sound signatures. I would keep my SR225i/e only for back-up, and using out of home.
 
SR325e: simply put I know these review well across the board and almost everyone loves them. It's the obvious choice, apart from one aspect. It's a whole £300, and I have seen a few comments saying the SR225e and 325e are very close sounding. Is this correct? It's not like I have no headphones and am deciding between the 225e and thinking the 325e is only £100 more. It's a full £300 for what may be a minimal upgrade.
 
I have a sneaky suspicion the SR325e might be richer sounding, fuller and more weighty. Keeping the signature of the 225e but being more accurate and solid. I can't help theorising that the 325e gains well from aluminium construction of the ear-cup.
 
I could see the accuracy difference between the SR125i and the SR225e. I can only hope the 325e is as good again. A little down side of the 325e is that you're paying for a fancy headband and I don't need it. I have always been comfortable with the lesser headband. I wonder how much of the upgrade expense has gone into it. 
 
 
The PS500e is almost a complete mystery. If what is to be believed on the Grado website, it's a stunner. However it meets a lot of disconcerting criticism in forums. It gets high praise in forums too. Easily my biggest worry is that it has virtually no pro-reviews online. That to me is not a good sign. What I think about the PS500e (or even the PS500) is if I can find a bargain, is it worth snapping up?
 
 
The RS2e I get the impression of it's sound signature from what I have read in forums. It causes quite a lot of interest. Unfortunately Amazon don't stock it, and I am unsure about buying from an Amazon external seller. Is there anyone who can hazard a guess as to how much better, accurate, clearer, it would be over the 225e please?
 
 
I love the SR225i/e sound and am happy with soundstage. Anymore would be nice but not important. The main aspect is quality. E.g. going from the SR125i to the SR225e, I noticed less sibilance. The SR125i could not be called sibilant, but the 225 was clearer on the 's' sound. It's the accuracy that is important for me, and hearing the music as it was meant to be.

 

[tomb]

The PS500 is hands-down superior to the other two phones you mention.  It's based on the HF-2, if not completely identical even.  Many prefer it to the RS-1, not just the RS-2.  At the same time, Grados are often a hit and miss. IMHO, the 325 is a miss (harsh and biting).  Don't waste your time with that one.

 
P.S. Grados are my favorite phones ... been listening to them for about 6 years and have heard just about all of them including the HP-1's.

 

[GreenBow]

OK. I forgot to mention that I like the SR225i/e very much. I added it now, to the opening post so it's clear. Anyway the 325e is mean to be close sounding so I should be happy with that. I am surprised anyone is disliking the 325e though. By all accounts it's very well received.
 
The RS1e is has fallen flat on its face unfortunately, or on its lack of treble anyway. Plus the 2e is closer to my price range. I am for sure looking for an 'e' model.

 

[GreenBow]

Ahah! Having just done the most obvious, I finally dug out a review of the RS2. http://www.whathifi.com/grado/rs2/review
 
Albeit it has gone through two generations since then. They are only improvements though so what's to loose?

 

[tomb]

  OK. I forgot to mention that I like the SR225i/e very much. I added it now, to the opening post so it's clear. Anyway the 325e is mean to be close sounding so I should be happy with that. I am surprised anyone is disliking the 325e though. By all accounts it's very well received.
 
The RS1e is has fallen flat on its face unfortunately, or on its lack of treble anyway. Plus the 2e is closer to my price range. I am for sure looking for an 'e' model.

Well, one wonders why you asked the question, but I've seen more ridiculous around here ...
 
Why not just say, "Please tell me my decision is correct?"  That would make more sense.

 

[KG Jag]

If you like the 225i, the next step up is the Alessandro MS-2i.  The 2i is a better choice than the 325is because its treble is more like the 225i.  I also like the the 2i over the 325e, but that's a close call.
 
I have not yet heard the MS-2e.
 
The PS line features the only dark Grados.  Especially if you like the SR or RS series, try any PS can before you buy it.

 

[GreenBow]

  If you like the 225i, the next step up is the Alessandro MS-2i.  The 2i is a better choice than the 325is because its treble is more like the 225i.  I also like the the 2i over the 325e, but that's a close call.
 
I have not yet heard the MS-2e.
 
The PS line features the only dark Grados.  Especially if you like the SR or RS series, try any PS can before you buy it.

Thanks KG, but the MS headphones elude me completely. I don't follow the MS series so I don't know which MS-phones correlate to which SR, RS, PS phones. I have not looked up their sound signatures.
 
Secondly though I have no-where to buy them. I search only on Amazon-UK, and they do not stock them anymore. The e-series phones are not exactly well represented on Amazon either. No RS2e in Amazon stock. No PS500e. No RS1e - that I would not buy anyway. I sometimes wonder if it's because Amazon don't sell many and get a lot back. Maybe their customers don't know to get them comfortable, as comfort is the main complaint in lower rated customer reviews. 
 
My problem is that there is not a dealer within easy range to audition. I have to evaluate the headphones from what people say and what few reviews there are. Like What Hi-Fi have only a current review of the SR325e, and neither of the other two phones are covered.
 
Plus I can get some info from the graphs of the frequency response of them.
 

I understand these may not be completely representative of new models but I thin they will not be far off. I have added the SR60 to this graph as a reference. The reason being I am spoiled by having owned a pair. It was bass full and this graph shows it. The SR225i (I have e driver in mine) are the most bass light. The SR325e will have a touch more bass, and most likely be more articulate than my SR225i/e. The RS2e is a phone many are very happy with. They have more bass but then they have the least treble than any other phone on the graph. Knowing my SR225i/e treble it is right on. It might be a shame to sacrifice some of that to get the extra bass of the RS2e.
 
The other main issue which the graphs don't show, is how much more detail the more expensive phones have. That's probably the most important aspect.
 
The bass is important too though and the following is why. Take the Rhianna track called Umbrella as an example. One day when I auditioned the SR60i and the SR80i, I was listening to a radio in a hi-fi shop. On the SR60 there was a brilliant techy synthy buzzy vibration low down sound going on. Yet when I plugged in the SR80 it was much lighter.
 
I understand the song is not everyone's taste, but that is way not the issue. The issue to me is what I miss because my SR225i don't pick up that buzzy sound enough either. While I can live without that bass presence, any more added bass on top of the SR225i/e is a bonus. I'd love to get it right though.
 
There really is not a headphone that fits the graph perfectly other than the very expensive PS1000e. That is not an option.

 

[adtrance]

I first came to Head-Fi to research a similar conundrum - 325e or 500e.  After reading through countless posts and agonizing over the decision, I pulled the trigger on the 325e on the basis that it has the classic Grado sound, which is to say spirited treble and "you're on the stage" sound.  That was the whole reason I wanted a Grado.  
 
It took about a week for burn in, I also picked up a new amp at the same time so they both needed time to reach their potential (whether real or imagined).
 
I have to say that the 325e sounds immaculate to my ears.

 

[GreenBow]

Thankyou adtrance. Those are kind of the exact things I want to hear. That your 100% blissed with your 325e choice.
 
I think I was tied down with hopes about the PS500e. I imagined it being better based on it being a higher end phone. Then I read about the RS1e being a disaster and coming to terms with the fact that Grado are far from infallible, unless they intended a dark RS. The PS500/e has a similar rolled off treble. Some call it dark and I think I just figured what they mean, being opposite to bright. I know that sounds kind of daft but I considered the opposite of bright as dull.
 
The real issue about the PS500/e is that some owners absolutely love it. They describe incredible levels of detail. Some say it's nearly all of the PS1000/e but much less the cost. Before I read any negative comments about the 500/e I thought it was what Grado claimed.  I.E. nearly 3/4 of the 1000e. I imagined intoxicating detail, rock solid presentation, and a crisp sound stage. Dynamics and brilliance only the PS1000/e could beat. (Probably the GS1000e too.) Also doing laid-back when needed.
 
 
My thoughts about the 325e is that I read reports it has similarities with 225i/e. Only what I can't guesstimate is how much of an audio upgrade is it, over my 225i/e. My 225's have e-drivers, the same cable as the e-cable. The bit I can't work out is, if mine have the e-housing material. There was an upgrade there from i-e for all the SR in the black space-plastic material. Since mine have 225 on the cups and not 225e, it makes me wonder when the button was put on. If it's added by Grado in shop, I guess the cups are e-housing. If it's added in manufacture, it's anyone's guess.
 
That leaves the RS2e, and how much of an improvement over the 325e is it? Whichever way I go I want more clarity and composure. Better timbre accuracy. More bass, and leave the top like the 225e but clean it up and articulate even more.
 
Personally I think the 325e has the potential to become close to a legendary phone. A real simple choice to be sure for buyers. What Hi-Fi adore the 325e and that's a good sign.
 
At the moment I am listening to Sheryl Crow - I Shall Believe. (From 'Tuesday Night Music Club' ~ Sheryl Crow.) I can hardly feel the 225i/e weight, and I love that. It has the great drifty effect that Grado do. Music coming from seemingly nowhere and floating across the mix. Sheryl's gentle emotive lyrics and a floaty guitar. More drifting please!

 

[GreenBow]

Then here's someone comparing the PS500 with the HF2, which was apparently on of the best phones ever. http://www.headfonia.com/the-new-grado-sound-grado-ps500/

 

[tomb]

  Then here's someone comparing the PS500 with the HF2, which was apparently on of the best phones ever. http://www.headfonia.com/the-new-grado-sound-grado-ps500/

He's dead on about the sound, but totally out of left field on the finish of the HF-2.  Those things were anodized, yeah, but the lettering (including "HEAD-F1") was chemically etched.  It left a yellow stain pretty much on all of them, AFAIK.  The threads when the HF-2 came out were full of people's frustration at the horrible finish.  It's one of the reasons they ran a second run and ended up with the "HEAD-F1" instead of "HEAD-FI."  By then, they'd made too many to go back and sold them anyway.  Only the first hundred or so at CanJam that year got ones that were spelled right.  I have one of the early "HEAD-F1" versions and the finish is cr*p.  I could care less, though, because the sound is incredible.  I haven't heard anything touch it since and I listen to a lot of headphones.
 
Anyway, I can't believe that guy made a big deal about the HF-2's finish being better.  He must've got the only one.

 

 

[GreenBow]

Sometimes I think I might be better just sticking with the SR225i e-drivers until I get more info.
 
What makes me think sit-tight is that some say the 225 and 325 sound very similar. I don't mean similar signature, I mean sound barely any difference. Some say the cost of the 325 over the 225 is more cosmetic with the 325 headband being more substantial. However many people who own the 325e say it really is an excellent headphone. It's winning fans all over. What Hi-Fi adore it too.
 
Until I have read an opinion of someone who has owned both phones in the e-series versions, it's tough deciding. Either that or get out and try audition the 325e, taking my 225 with me. It's a long way though to finding a stockist. I have read the opinion of someone who owns the 225e and then just recently bought the RS2e. They love the 2e over the 225e substantially.
 
I think I would find the 500e a bit too bass heavy unless I bought the G-cushions. However I think I'd prefer to keep the L-cushions in the short term at least. I'm for sure talking myself out of the 500e without even trying.
 
Thanks folks for you ideas so far.

 

[GreenBow]

I was just looking again at the RS2 What Hi-Fi review. http://www.whathifi.com/grado/rs2/review
Then I checked the full specs tab. It says the 'product model' is the RS2i. Given what we know of the e-upgrades in other models, this is a strong recommend for RS2e. Just saying, you know, for other interested customers.

 

[tomb]

  I was just looking again at the RS2 What Hi-Fi review. http://www.whathifi.com/grado/rs2/review
Then I checked the full specs tab. It says the 'product model' is the RS2i. Given what we know of the e-upgrades in other models, this is a strong recommend for RS2e. Just saying, you know, for other interested customers.

 
You keep wanting to buy an RS2 ... so buy one already.
 
Problem is, ... it's a 2 ... not a 1 ... it's a 2 ... not a 1.  So there's one in the series that is better ... there is one that is better ... 1 is better than 2 ... One is better than Two.  These are the phrases the little voice in your head will be uttering every time you try to listen to an RS2.
 
I'm sorry, but I really don't see why anyone would purchase an RS2 when there's the RS1.  Both require a significant investment, but only one of them is a #1.  Anyone who purchases an RS2 is always going to wonder or be disappointed that they didn't purchase the RS1.  It's a psychology that will never be satisfied.  Why go through all the frustration and self-questioning?  There's no point.  I don't understand why Grado even makes an RS2.

 

[GreenBow]

   
You keep wanting to buy an RS2 ... so buy one already.
 
Problem is, ... it's a 2 ... not a 1 ... it's a 2 ... not a 1.  So there's one in the series that is better ... there is one that is better ... 1 is better than 2 ... One is better than Two.  These are the phrases the little voice in your head will be uttering every time you try to listen to an RS2.
 
I'm sorry, but I really don't see why anyone would purchase an RS2 when there's the RS1.  Both require a significant investment, but only one of them is a #1.  Anyone who purchases an RS2 is always going to wonder or be disappointed that they didn't purchase the RS1.  It's a psychology that will never be satisfied.  Why go through all the frustration and self-questioning?  There's no point.  I don't understand why Grado even makes an RS2.

The RS1e is a bad headphone. People can not even sell the ones they have bought, so no. Unfortunately1 is not better than 2 in this case.
 
Your suggested the PS500e. I am cautious of that headphone since some say the top end is light and has a shouty range. According to the HeadRoom graph of it there is a peak around 9000Hz that would explain a shouty range. The upper frequency response rolls off. 

This is why the PS500e is such a confusing headphone. Some owners love it, while others sell them on. Some have auditioned them and won't buy them. That is why it's confusing when they make comparisons with the HF series, as the HF is much loved headphone. From opinions the PS500e will have detail and clarity superior to my other considerations. Sadly it will not have the flatter response I would hope to buy.
 
For now, the PS500e is kind of off my choice list.
 
---------
 
The RS2e is by all accounts a good headphone, and comparable to the RS1i. The only drawback I read a day ago, is that the RS2e might be better paired with a headphone amp. Whereas some are happy plugging straight into an iPhone. I do not use a dedicated headphone amp. I have a DAC with a headphone stage, but I use my headphones on more than just my computers. If there were a pro-review of the RS2e going into all these aspects, it would make life easier. I am confidently prepared to buy the 325e based on that.
 
Really though, this is the choice faced by many Grado users. It shows up practically first under a google search for 325e vs 500e. Why not add as many opinions and information to it. If you hadn't noticed, I have been endeavouring to add anything I find out along the way.
 
I don't understand why you think I should be impatient. I live in the UK and headphones here cost much more than they do in the States. A $500 RS2e cost £500. It's not a decision to take lightly. If SR325e cost the equivalent of £180, I would have already them. That was the list price of my SR225i/e.
 
I have a good set of headphones. I can wait if I need to. Plus I can't make my own judgement without an audition. I understand the best plan would be to audition, and someone will probably suggest it. Unfortunately getting to an audition is an issue. The nearest Grado retailer I know is fifteen miles away. However because of my health I have not travelled more than six miles from home for about eight years.