[LUCIDD]

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttleboi /img/forum/go_quote.gif Are the Audioengine p4 speakers the smallest passive bookshelf speakers on the market? What do you think of speakers intended to be the rear speakers in a home theatre system, like this: Polk Audio - Rears / Surrounds

lol... the P4's are small there are lots smaller--- I really don't wanna mention Bose and other HTIB type satellites as comparing them to the P4's is like comparing *#$p to gold [some exageration for effect]... the P4's freq response is far superior to anything close to its size. -- just try finding anything that has anything close to a response of: 58Hz-22kHz +-2db, and you'll get speakers double-tripple its size and also double-tripple its price! I got my Klipsch satellites prior to the P4's introduction... or else I would have gotten the P4's instead. I do realize that specs don't really tell you how they sound... but checkout some of the reviews for them - and they do have 30day return policy if you're in the continental US.

I checked out the Polk speakers... I'm sure I've auditioned them before at a Visions store [Kef and HK makes something similar too] - and as they did sound ok... using them for monitors would be disastrous for stereo imaging. They are designed as surrounds - which is why they have the second midrange driver face a different angle. This design is abundantly used for surround speakers - Klipsch has larger versions with the same type of anging for the rear speakers. This design is good for surrounds - cuz often times, the rear speakers in a 7.1 surround system is outputing "surround-background" noise. But - for fronts?-I'd say they'd work - but not well. Furthermore, checkout its overall freq. response: 130hz-20khz +-3db !!! Huge gapping difference to the P4's.

Anyways... you can tell I wish I had them... but for now, the Klipsch reference series are good nuff.

 

[LUCIDD]

Quote:

Originally Posted by noinimod /img/forum/go_quote.gif Come on now, comparing the tiny A2s with your full-sized klipschs? The A5s are a whole different beast from their little (not just in size) brothers. My point is simple: It will be very difficult to get better sound with an entry level passive setup than a simple pair of active a5s. For the same price, an int. amp will generally be much better and more efficient at driving passives than an AVR. I checked out that denon avr you listed, sure the price is high, but it will definitely not compete with an dedicated stereo amp. With passives, the amp is probably as important as the speakers themselves. Unless you need all that surround sound and other capabilities an AVR has, there's no reason not to get an amp instead.

Well --- the Klipsch reference Rseries [rsx-4, rcx-4] are actually satellites - about the same size as the P4's... which are bigger than the a2's and smaller than the a5's. So they are not really full size - I should have clarified.

I found many members and reviewers comparing the A2's to the A5's... and when I auditioned the a5's - the sound signature is quite similar to its little brother. And they both are very well designed- efficient inside/out.

As for the AVR vs. a Stereo Amp... I agree: a $1000 AVR vs. a $1000 Stereo amp, the Stereo amp will definitely produce beter all around stereo sound [2channel]. And yes, the amp is as important as the speakers.

I guess it depends on what you need... and what you'll be using it for.
Personally, I like the powered monitors for more personal - at desk, closefield listening... but for movies and games [computer or Ps3 games], no monitor can do what the surround sound -in Dolby Digital can. So If one can only have one system... I'd choose the 7.1 surround system - cuz it can also do 2.1 stereo sound too.

 

[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttleboi /img/forum/go_quote.gif I happen to have an old Sony ProLogic AVR that's in great shape but just laying around unused. I know they could power some bookshelf speakers for my computer. Can you recommend some passive speakers? They should be relatively small and cost at most $500/pair. All I know about are B&W and Polk. And would asking for a subwoofer included in that price be asking too much?

You can find some great deals if you look around.
Onkyo sells refurbed systems for good deals. I say go this route as if you get a receiver or amplifer you can always upgrade the speakers or subwoofer later on if you frel you need to.
Have a look here, this one is $380
HT-S5200 - 7.1-Channel Home Theater Package
This one is $480
HT-S6200 - 7.1-Channel Home Theater Package

AV123 has their ELE525m speakers which are great for the price. You can bundle them with a Tweak city gizmo that also has a subwoofer output and you woudl still be well under your budget.
Tweka city has a decent set of bookshelf speakers and the Gizmo Class-D amplifer which has a subwoofer output for $300.
Tweak City Speaker package

If you have $500, shop around and get the best system you can for the money. You can also go active if you want...
lots of choice to be made, just don't be in a rush to spend. This above suggestions are just an idea and there are many great deals out there for speaker kits or receivers and speakers...amplifers..active speakers.
Hope this helps.

 

[jeansmurf]

I've heard the Focal system, sounds ok, despite the fact that my listening was very quick and with much noise around in the Apple Store the sound is not as good as you could expect from a device at this price....
.....

so maybe it's not worth spending 700$ in that...

 

[shuttleboi]

If anyone is interested, the B&W MM-1 is now available at the Apple Store in the USA for $499.95.

 

[Kobra]

I've listened extensivly to the Focal XS in a sound treated room, haven't bought them yet -but I would if it wasn't for the headphones that I need ...errr want...

The Focals have a huge and open sound, the highs are very clear and detailed. The XS has the typical "Focal sound" that you'll find in JM Labs floorstanders. The subwoofer is well integrated in the sound, granted you place it right... The design and build quality is second to none.

As the B&W MM-1 hasn't hit the stores yet I haven't tried them. Though I find it hard to imagine them to beat the Focal XS.

I've been using Audioengine A2 with my desktop setup for about two years now. Though they sound great and also have a large and open sound I plan to exchange them for a set of Focal XS as soon as posible. My reasons are mostly based on cosmetics and just pure personal indulgence as they look so sexy next to a iMac or a MacBook Pro

The A2 are a bit more sensitive to placement than the Focals. The Focals benefit from their integrated speaker stands ( the A2 must be propped up for best sound). The Focal XS comes with high quality cables, the setup will keep your desktop cleaner and tidier as the cables runs speaker to subwoofer instead of speaker to speaker. The A2 scales very nicely with any upgrade in DAC or cable, the Focals are not upgradable...

 

[DRikardo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttleboi /img/forum/go_quote.gif I've looked at bookshelf speakers from Paradigm, B&W, and Polk. They are a bit too big. The smallest models are at least 10" H x 10" D. I like the Focal and B&W multimedia speakers because they're small and elegant. Oh, I just found these small passive speakers. Nice.

I stumbled on these and fell in love with the aesthetics,please please tell me what these are??
Hope they are not over my price range though.

Help is highly appreciated
regards Riku

 

[majid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRikardo /img/forum/go_quote.gif I stumbled on these and fell in love with the aesthetics,please please tell me what these are?? Hope they are not over my price range though.

Joey Roth Ceramic speakers. $500. I'd much rather get the MM-1 for that price.

 

[DRikardo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by majid /img/forum/go_quote.gif Joey Roth Ceramic speakers. $500. I'd much rather get the MM-1 for that price.

Thank you very much of the fast answer.

I have no idea of the soundquality of these , i just do find them beautiful.
I try find out more .

I am sure the BW might be good choise but for my eye they are very ugly.

And for music i will keep using the the Beogram+ BO S80.2 combo.

thanks again
regard riku

 

[Operandi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRikardo /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thank you very much of the fast answer. I have no idea of the soundquality of these , i just do find them beautiful. I try find out more . I am sure the BW might be good choise but for my eye they are very ugly. And for music i will keep using the the Beogram+ BO S80.2 combo. thanks again regard riku

The guy that built those first posted them on these forums a couple of years ago but I can't find the thready anymore.
Tech Talk Forum - Techtalk at Parts-Express.com

I'm pretty sure he is using one of the 3" or 4" Tang Band drivers just full range. If he is using one the higher-end ones I'm sure it sounds impressive in terms of detail and smoothness, but it's certainly going to lack bass. It might be one of these these.

For $500 you can defiantly get something that sounds better and actually has bass but they certainly do look amazing.

 

[DRikardo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Operandi /img/forum/go_quote.gif The guy that built those first posted them on these forums a couple of years ago but I can't find the thready anymore. Tech Talk Forum - Techtalk at Parts-Express.com I'm pretty sure he is using one of the 3" or 4" Tang Band drivers just full range. If he is using one the higher-end ones I'm sure it sounds impressive in terms of detail and smoothness, but it's certainly going to lack bass. It might be one of these these. For $500 you can defiantly get something that sounds better and actually has bass but they certainly do look amazing.

Thank you for your expertize.
I read few articles about these, and i started to feel that they are not worth the money for me.


Regards Riku

 

[powerarron]

Quote:

Originally Posted by majid /img/forum/go_quote.gif Joey Roth Ceramic speakers. $500. I'd much rather get the MM-1 for that price.

Same here, I would go for MM-1 due to its aesthetics and c/p value...

 

[haineux]

The problem with desktop speakers is that nobody has invented a way to produce good quality bass in a small enclosure. Any solution will, necessarily, be a major compromise in the bass department. The good news is that, given your price range, you have three excellent compromises available:
 
1) The Focal XS-1 is a 2.1 system which includes really excellent iPod/iPhone compatibility, and tiny desktop modules. It looks gorgeous. It has serious amplification built in. You can easily blast your head off. Focal makes their own speaker cones, so this is not cheap stuff.(It also includes USB audio in.) The compromise: they use a subwoofer. In my brief audition, they sounded a bit harsh and strident (i.e. too much emphasis on high frequencies, bordering on distortions). If I were buying them, I'd spend a lot of time burning them in to see if that cleared up. If not, I'd be returning them.
 
2) The B&W MM-1 has no iPhone/iPod stuff, but does include USB audio in. They do not even have a subwoofer, so their compromise is that they do very fancy digital signal processing to produce better bass response. Audiophiles sneer at this kind of shenanigans. But the kernel of truth is that DSP can give you headaches or just "sound fake." I listened to them for a few hours, and was impressed, though. Amazing imaging. I didn't hear anything terrible sounding -- but this is something you'll have to pay attention to.
 
3) You can find an amplifier and buy some used passive studio monitor speakers, such as my favorites, the Tannoy System 600. These use a unique and wonderful six-inch "dual-concentric" driver, where the tweeter is inside the woofer. The same driver is also in their NFM-6 speakers. (The System 600A is the same speaker with an amplifier bolted to the back. They sell for a LOT more.) Tannoy also makes an 8" dual-concentric driver in their System 800 and NFM8 speakers. (Tannoy also sells traditional woofer-tweeter-rectangle-box speakers. I haven't listened to them, much.)
 
These have unbelievable sound in the near field listening configuration. I'm tempted to say "unbeatable." The compromise is that they are larger than you'd prefer -- and you'll have to scout a pair on eBay, which might take 3 months. But you can get an excellent amp AND the speakers for $500, with some left over. If you get REALLY REALLY lucky, you might score an amp that can bi-amp the Tannoys.
 
ANY of these choices is likely to sound great to you, BUT: All three will sound very different from each other.
 
Given your writing, I'd suggest you follow these steps in order:
1) Buy the B&W MM-1 from a dealer which will give you a 30 or 60 day "in home trial." I bet that when you first listen to them, you will LOVE them. But you have to make a commitment to listen to them a LOT over the 30 days. If you find that the DSP they are doing is making your ears tired, or giving you annoyance, return them. If not: Keep 'em, and if some audiophile gives you grief, offer to dip their head in liquid nitrogen (kidding).
 
2) If you decide to try the Focals, buy them from a dealer which will give you a 30 or 60 day "in home trial," and ask them if they have a pair that has already been burned-in some, maybe a returned pair that's been inspected. (Some people listen for a week, decide they can't hear any difference from their $50 Logitech blasters.) In any case, listen to them, then set them up in a closet and run them 24/7 for a week or two to burn in. (You can use white noise, pink noise, or music to burn them in. I usually use internet streaming radio, especially trance, drum and bass, or techno music.) Then listen to them. Either you'll hate them outright, or you'll spend some fiddling with the sub, and then be very happy.
 
3) Obviously, if you are buying used Tannoy studio monitors, you can't return them if you don't like them, and you probably can't go listen to them in person before buying. So you'll have to make sure that they look "brand new" -- especially the drivers. They use a plastic cone attached with a rubber surround -- both must be perfect. They also have a metal "tulip" in the center. Very distinctive, so I've never seen fake Tannoys. (If someone's going to rip you off, they'll probably show you pictures that look perfect, but send you a pair with torn rubber surrounds. More rarely, they might have a pair that actually does look perfect, but has something burnt up inside.)
 
I've had excellent luck with these speakers, having bought about 5 pairs off eBay. All of them were perfect, and all sound fantastic.