Ditching the computer: HDD-based player or portable DAP?

[vapman]

I've been looking to move away from using my computer as an audio source.
when I am doing a lot of network stuff audio gets so choppy I can't listen to it, wish it could play when my laptop wasn't on and plugged in, etc.
I've looked into Sony's HDD based audio players but they get very expensive, it would be cheaper to get a second tiny computer and run a nice DAC out of it.
The other thing I was considering was using a high quality portable DAP but it seemed like I could probably do better for the money by not caring about portability or battery.
The main problem I see with using a portable DAP is I have 800GB of music and would hate to have to swap microSD's or keep a bunch around.
 
For now I just use my CD player or sansa clip if I don't want to use my computer, but I have a better DAC than either of those can provide, and even though I could use a different CD player as a transport thru my DAC, 5-10 microSD's would be better than burning that many CD's!

 

[sterling1]

I just bought a 2nd laptop to use, for the most part, just for music, Getting off the computer did not appeal to me since access to many functions of iTunes would be made less convenient. With my 2 laptop approach I no longer have any drop outs. I have iTunes on both laptops so I can always use one of them without a conflict with other programs being run simultaneously.

 

[vapman]

I really dont want to use another computer, but if I do, it'll probably be a rasberry pi or intel NUC running headless.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mckickflip /img/forum/go_quote.gif

I've been looking to move away from using my computer as an audio source.

when I am doing a lot of network stuff audio gets so choppy I can't listen to it, wish it could play when my laptop wasn't on and plugged in, etc.

I've looked into Sony's HDD based audio players but they get very expensive, it would be cheaper to get a second tiny computer and run a nice DAC out of it.

The other thing I was considering was using a high quality portable DAP but it seemed like I could probably do better for the money by not caring about portability or battery.

The main problem I see with using a portable DAP is I have 800GB of music and would hate to have to swap microSD's or keep a bunch around.

 

For now I just use my CD player or sansa clip if I don't want to use my computer, but I have a better DAC than either of those can provide, and even though I could use a different CD player as a transport thru my DAC, 5-10 microSD's would be better than burning that many CD's!

 

Cocktail Audio X12 - WLAN music server with internal HDD mount and optical drive

http://www.amazon.com/Cocktail-Audio-Ripper-Server-Streamer/dp/B00NW9B51E/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1449234950&sr=8-1&keywords=Cocktail+Audio+X10

 

Cocktail Audio WiFi adapter

http://www.amazon.com/COCKTAIL-Wireless-Wi-Fi-Dongle-Streamer/dp/B008S4IU84/ref=pd_bxgy_23_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=1034SZV0G2QSDHTPQ54G

 

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The only other thing you'll need is a 3.5in HDD. Scroll down and you'll see a package (cheaper shipping I think) with a 4TB WD Green. You won't really need the WiFi for accessing an NAS, but for $40 you might as well get that so you can use the mobile device remote app that will make navigation through several terabytes' worth of music a lot easier. It's not completely smooth but better than using the screen on the X10 and knob on the X10, and I'm not sure how smooth the latter is (or if it even works for navigation and control), as its main purpose AFAIK is for the built in speaker amp. Yep, you can have speakers somewhere - like passive patio speakers - leave the cables hanging somewhere and you can just move this thing with its huge HDD wherever else you might want to use it with speakers.

 

[vapman]

 

 

Cocktail Audio X12 - WLAN music server with internal HDD mount and optical drive

http://www.amazon.com/Cocktail-Audio-Ripper-Server-Streamer/dp/B00NW9B51E/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1449234950&sr=8-1&keywords=Cocktail+Audio+X10

 

Cocktail Audio WiFi adapter

http://www.amazon.com/COCKTAIL-Wireless-Wi-Fi-Dongle-Streamer/dp/B008S4IU84/ref=pd_bxgy_23_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=1034SZV0G2QSDHTPQ54G

 

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The only other thing you'll need is a 3.5in HDD. Scroll down and you'll see a package (cheaper shipping I think) with a 4TB WD Green. You won't really need the WiFi for accessing an NAS, but for $40 you might as well get that so you can use the mobile device remote app that will make navigation through several terabytes' worth of music a lot easier. It's not completely smooth but better than using the screen on the X10 and knob on the X10, and I'm not sure how smooth the latter is (or if it even works for navigation and control), as its main purpose AFAIK is for the built in speaker amp. Yep, you can have speakers somewhere - like passive patio speakers - leave the cables hanging somewhere and you can just move this thing with its huge HDD wherever else you might want to use it with speakers.

My main gripe with the Cocktail Audio X12 is it's pretty ugly, and for almost the same price I could get one of those really slick Sony units. But, unless I was going to spend that kind of money, which I don't really want to, I would probably still do a cheap machine running headless with some sort of remote. It turns out the Intel NUC I already have has a IrDA receiver built in, which could make this fairly painless and likely not terrible to integrate with foobar2000. That I could use one of my many identical DACs on and just run it right into my stereo. In theory if it's not doing anything else, it should be safe, but I want network connectivity to be an added bonus, not a necessity - if I'm messing with my router and/or modem I still want to be able to hear music!
 
Given a 2TB 2.5" drive is about $75, putting one inside the Celeron 4th generation NUC would run me just over $200, and then I'd need to source a compatible remote I was happy with, looks like that shouldn't be expensive though.
 
Anyway, nothing cheaper that takes a hard drive, gives digital output, and has a nice screen and remote that doesn't cost upwards of $500?

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mckickflip /img/forum/go_quote.gif

My main gripe with the Cocktail Audio X12 is it's pretty ugly, and for almost the same price I could get one of those really slick Sony units. 

 

There's the Aune S2, but you need HDDs with their own enclosures hooked up via USB.

http://static.dcfever.com/media/trading//13/6/24/262086_137208495689.jpg

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by mckickflip /img/forum/go_quote.gif

In theory if it's not doing anything else, it should be safe, but I want network connectivity to be an added bonus, not a necessity - if I'm messing with my router and/or modem I still want to be able to hear music!

 

The thing is with a dedicated player the network really is just a bonus, it has its own buttons if not also a more usual remote control (the S2 comes with one in milled aluminum, like a high-end CDP's), except that such an interface is designed for navigating CDs. An HDD full of music is a lot more like having several Sony 200disc changers. Network connection opens it up to a remote app on a tablet or smartphone, which then gives you a UI (though of course with a bit of lag in some cases compared to using locally stored music on the device) similar to what you would find in devices like that.

 

It's kind of like this when you use a tiny screen for all that music.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by mckickflip /img/forum/go_quote.gif

It turns out the Intel NUC I already have has a IrDA receiver built in, which could make this fairly painless and likely not terrible to integrate with foobar2000. That I could use one of my many identical DACs on and just run it right into my stereo.

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Given a 2TB 2.5" drive is about $75, putting one inside the Celeron 4th generation NUC would run me just over $200, and then I'd need to source a compatible remote I was happy with, looks like that shouldn't be expensive though.

 

If you already have that NUC and it can be set-up to run headless then just use that one, that way the only thing you need to buy is a DAC.

 

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by mckickflip /img/forum/go_quote.gif

 

Anyway, nothing cheaper that takes a hard drive, gives digital output, and has a nice screen and remote that doesn't cost upwards of $500?

 

Not with an internal hard drive. Some take SD cards though (see links below), or a used Olive player but the problem is that you're back to the same problem that is less of an issue on the Cocktail Audio which has a larger screen.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AUNE-X5A-Remote-control-WAV-Music-Player-DAC-HiFi-Stereo-16bit-44-1kHz-YD-/271943625004?hash=item3f511a692c:g:LOMAAOSw9N1VuQQX

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Aune-X5S-24Bit-192K-HiFi-DSD-Asynchronous-Digital-Player-/171997720377?hash=item280bdcef39:g:rd8AAOSwT4lWRYnc

 

 

...but the problem is that you're back to the same problem that is less of an issue on the Cocktail Audio which has a larger screen.

 

 

Olive came up with the crowd-funded Olive One server that looks like a small tablet mounted on an oversized plate, where the outputs are hidden, you have various mounting options including sitting flat on a table near your seat (or your desk if you use a headphone system; either way it's angled for ergonomics), but it's around $1000 if you can even buy one outside of the crowdfunding campaign (even used units still fetch that kind of price).

 

[vapman]

I like how the Aune looks, do they have some sort of protection on their HD's to make sure you use an Aune branded one though?

 

[robm321]

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[bfreedma]

  I really dont want to use another computer, but if I do, it'll probably be a rasberry pi or intel NUC running headless.

 
I recently transitioned from an older micro PC to a NUC and have been very happy with the results.  The NUC IR works, but if you have an iDevice, Monkeymote/Foobar2000 makes for a more complete experience.  Add in Splashtop Streamer for OS level access and running headless is simple. The newer NUCs have 802.ac out of the box - not sure which gen you own.
 
If you're having network "choppiness", you could consider installing an internal network card that supports 802.ac (assuming your router supports that protocol).  My NUC is several rooms and a floor removed from my router and I still get minimum 390Mbps with normal connection speeds of at least 585Mbps.  That should be plenty of bandwidth for anything you want to stream from another system.
 
This works well for me in another micro PC: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DMCVKMU?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage

 

[vapman]

I don't have an iDevice anymore, all BlackBerry here, which means Android solutions should work for me too.
 
The choppiness is not actually a network problem. The problem is I use my laptop for nearly everything, including playing music from foobar into an external DAC connected to my stereo, and when I get to doing a ton of network & cpu intensive work, it invariably makes audio get choppy. Using ASIO instead of WASAPI or DS helps a lot, but when CPU or network load gets really high audio will suffer.
 
I actually already have an ac compatible router & devices, so I have plenty of bandwidth, but I mess with my router a lot too so I like to not need to keep my music dependent on a wifi or wired network present. This is why i'm leaning towards the NUC for that purpose.
 
I have a 4TB in an external case but I'll likely repurpose that for a NAS as I can have around a terabyte to spare if I put a 2TB HD in the NUC, and it already has a 1TB in it, so I could even get away with just using that for now.
 
I'm sure there are good android remote apps. I'd set up browser based access as well as having an actual remote, I'd imagine.

 

[bfreedma]

I don't have an iDevice anymore, all BlackBerry here, which means Android solutions should work for me too.
 
The choppiness is not actually a network problem. The problem is I use my laptop for nearly everything, including playing music from foobar into an external DAC connected to my stereo, and when I get to doing a ton of network & cpu intensive work, it invariably makes audio get choppy. Using ASIO instead of WASAPI or DS helps a lot, but when CPU or network load gets really high audio will suffer.
 
I actually already have an ac compatible router & devices, so I have plenty of bandwidth, but I mess with my router a lot too so I like to not need to keep my music dependent on a wifi or wired network present. This is why i'm leaning towards the NUC for that purpose.
 
I have a 4TB in an external case but I'll likely repurpose that for a NAS as I can have around a terabyte to spare if I put a 2TB HD in the NUC, and it already has a 1TB in it, so I could even get away with just using that for now.
 
I'm sure there are good android remote apps. I'd set up browser based access as well as having an actual remote, I'd imagine.

Not too familiar with Android but I'm sure you're right about there being equivalent remote solutions.

The NUC will definitely solve your problems if you keep very thing running locally. Would imagine you would load new music by ripping CDs to a drive you could map temporarily and otherwise stay off the network.

Not sure how much you want to do in the interim, but there is something you could try (if you haven't already) to improve what you have until your NUC is ready to go. Set the foobar service and any other music related services in your existing box to high priority. That should eliminate or at least minimize the stuttering.

One more thought on the NUC - consider using a SSD rather than a traditional drive. It will be much quieter. The spinning drive I had in one of my NUCs is audible, while the newer NUC I use for my headphone rig is essentially silent. The fan does run at times, but it's SPL doesn't really go beyond the room's ambient noise floor, so I've never noticed it.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

  I like how the Aune looks, do they have some sort of protection on their HD's to make sure you use an Aune branded one though?

 

No, like I said it uses external HDDs via USB (or NAS via LAN). You have to use something like a WD Passport/Elements or Seagate Expansion/Backup Plus via USB, or at least some USB drives. What I dont like aesthetically is that if I use anything other than a compact flash drive you'll have the USB cable sticking out of the left side. That said, yo ucan leave a 128gb (or larger) SD card for your favorite tracks in it, and/or just find a right angle USB cable so it doesn't stick out too far.

 

http://shop2.hifidiy.net/images/_MG_7608vxv.jpg

 

Personally if I'm using this (I'm saving up for it, but I need to get my silver amp repaired first) what I would do is just use the network function since it'll be easier navigating with a smartphone/tablet interface anyway. I've got a few 32gb microSD cards with the fullsize adapter lying around so I can cram at least all of one or two bands in there premanently, then hook it up to the network with a flexible cable bent into a U and run under the main unti, then put the power supply on the left side to keep me from getting antsy looking at that network cable. Of course, I wouldn't be sure it won't cause any noise until I actually set that up, because I haven't seen any photo (product shots or users') that has the PSU on the left.