cheaper DAC vs. good sound card

[canercan888]

I was convinced that a DAC was the answer with a laptop but I can't see which would be better with a desktop computer, a DAC or a good sound card?

Consider I can't afford anything above $200 when it comes to DACs. Actually, same goes for the sound card, nothing over $200.

So what do you guys think? A DAC or a better sound card?

 

[freckling]

i'm actually interested to know what you guys think as well

 

[rds]

asus xonar dx at $89 with a cs4398 it's a steal... I don't think it has any competition is that price range

 

[rds]

It sounds really good with these mods:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f6/asu...x-mods-339127/

 

[thedauntlessone]

You might want to consider super pro dac 707 USB. it comes in black now instead of the gay purple

if you are looking for a dac/amp combo you can look into tns sweet II (skylab was impressed by it) or the Zero DAC/amp

 

[infinitesymphony]

In that price range, sound cards are probably the way to go, though there are a few decent DACs that use chips better than the Burr-Brown PCM270x series common in budget DACs. Check the All the DACs pt. 2 thread if you're interested. Otherwise, sound cards:

Asus Xonar series
AuzenTech X-Fi Prelude
E-MU 1212M
E-MU 0404 USB
AudioTrak Prodigy HD2

 

[badmonkey]

Inifinite do you hold to that if the budget is stretched a little beyond the OP's $200... e.g. Keces 151 (USB) @ $230, is this outdone by any internal soundcard would you guess?

 

[ZephyrSapphire]

I don't think anyone has actually answered the OP's question.
DAC or Soundcard? IMO, a soundcard if you're a gamer. but a USB DAC if you plan to listen to music since you can avoid all the fan noise from the desktop's case. Cheers.

 

[badmonkey]

Well the OP has not specified his purpose. I don't think anyone would consider an external DAC for gaming (other than a simple 2 channel output without any hardware FX), so I think it goes without saying that he is interested in 2-channel quality, read: music.

On this basis it is an interesting question; $200 (i.e. high end) PCI soundcard vs $200 (lower end) external DAC. And I guess one must assume USB to avoid requiring extra cost for a SPDIF transport.

 

[infinitesymphony]

Quote:

Originally Posted by badmonkey /img/forum/go_quote.gif Inifinite do you hold to that if the budget is stretched a little beyond the OP's $200... e.g. Keces 151 (USB) @ $230, is this outdone by any internal soundcard would you guess?

From what I've seen, the KECES DA-151 takes the PCM270x platform as far as it will go. However, that DAC has hard limitations that might make a sound card with a superior DAC chip sound better. The PCM270x series is not top-of-the-line, and sound cards in the $200 range are almost all using top chips. It would be tough to know without doing a comparison, since one is essentially like a super-modified low-end DAC while the other is like a stock mid-fi DAC.

 

[badmonkey]

Mmmmn so here is my list of internal soundcard DACs.

How does the list look ranked by DAC, other qualities notwithstanding?

Prodigy 7.1 HiFi - WM8766
Prodigy HD2 - AK4396
E-MU 0404 - AK4396
E-MU 1212 - CS4398
HT Omega Claro+ - AK4396VF
Auzentech Prelude - AK4396
Auzentech X-Meridian - AK4396VF
Onkyo PCI-SE200 - WM8740
Juli@ - AK4358
Asus Xonar D2 - PCM1796
M-Audio Revolution 7.1 - AKM 4381

 

[Maniac]

I'd like to clarify that PCM2702 if taken as far as we had, it actually performs quite well even when compared to sound cards using much higher end or even flagship DAC chips. And there are still more to be had from that itty-bitty chip, as I still have some more experiments that I'd like to try and confirm. If those experiment worked the way I think it should, it should be able to provide more detail and refinement still. But that would be a somewhat costly upgrade if put into production, thus I'm still considering if I should just experiment it for the sake of knowing how well that trick would work or not.


Like that Pirelli commerical, power is nothing without control. DAC chip itself would not be performing even close to its spec if the supporting circuit is not up to par. I myself is rather anxious to see which of the internal or external DAC/sound cards that can beat KECES DACs while not costing a lot more. A lot of the "magics" of DAC is done in the analog part, and this part is not easily translated into "marketingese". While top end chips, whether properly utilized or not, can be easily translated into painfully visible captions on the retail boxes.

 

[chesebert]

cheap DAC is the better choice. stop wasting your money with sound cards.

yes even the best emu or RME are no good.

 

[infinitesymphony]

Quote:

Originally Posted by badmonkey /img/forum/go_quote.gif Mmmmn so here is my list of internal soundcard DACs. How does the list look ranked by DAC, other qualities notwithstanding? Prodigy 7.1 HiFi - WM8766 Prodigy HD2 - AK4396 E-MU 0404 - AK4396 E-MU 1212 - CS4398 HT Omega Claro+ - AK4396VF Auzentech Prelude - AK4396 Auzentech X-Meridian - AK4396VF Onkyo PCI-SE200 - WM8740 Juli@ - AK4358 Asus Xonar D2 - PCM1796 M-Audio Revolution 7.1 - AKM 4381

The AK4396, CS4398, WM8740, and PCM1796 are all top or near-top DACs (WM8741 and PCM1792/PCM1794 are slightly better than their equivalents here, but more expensive). All that leaves are the individual implementations of the DACs in the cards and your own personal sound signature / system-matching preferences.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maniac /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'd like to clarify that PCM2702 if taken as far as we had, it actually performs quite well even when compared to sound cards using much higher end or even flagship DAC chips. Like that Pirelli commerical, power is nothing without control. DAC chip itself would not be performing even close to its spec if the supporting circuit is not up to par. I myself is rather anxious to see which of the internal or external DAC/sound cards that can beat KECES DACs while not costing a lot more. A lot of the "magics" of DAC is done in the analog part, and this part is not easily translated into "marketingese". While top end chips, whether properly utilized or not, can be easily translated into painfully visible captions on the retail boxes.

Yeah, why it's so difficult to compare the DA-151 with similar-costing sound cards. The sound cards don't have the best implementation of their DAC chips or analog output stages but the DAC chips themselves are better. It's a tough compromise.

 

[Maniac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by infinitesymphony /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yeah, why it's so difficult to compare the DA-151 with similar-costing sound cards. The sound cards don't have the best implementation of their DAC chips or analog output stages but the DAC chips themselves are better. It's a tough compromise.

I think it would be best if it is compared directly as in sonic quality, instead of just spec vs. spec, as there are a lot of things that won't show up on spec.

As well, if you have the added budget and a good SPDIF output source, you should be able to get even better performance by using DA-131.