[Spoonfed]

Im wondering what DAC's are used on a 1212M.

Again i turn to you headphone guys (and gals?) for an answer to a non headphone question........ just when it comes to PC sound cards this forum seems to be the most knowledgable.

I am getting an new AV reciever for my HT setup.
(speakers are Quad 12L's)

Im deciding between a Denon 3805 at approx $2200AUD and Arcam AVR300 at $3000AUD.

Now comparing analogue inputs feed from an Arcam CD73 CD player ($1300AUD) the Arcam receiver has a "slight" edge on the denon with slightly better mids..... maybe a very slight dynamic advantage.

The difference appears when Digital input is used.
The Arcam uses Wolfson DAC and sounded (to me) identical to the Arcam CD player (so im guessing same 8740 Wolfson DAC is used)
The Denon sounded noticably different to the CD Player when feed digital.
I has a Burr Brown DAC.
The Arcam's onboard decoding seem to be a little more upfront, but imaging and staging was noticably better..... perhaps even a touch more detail.
(i was able to on the fly A/B switch analogue/digtail on receivers to compare)

Wolfson DAC http://www.wolfsonmicro.com/products...o/dacs/WM8740/

My current sound card is a Revo 5.1 I have the Denon on loan and have A/B on the fly compared Digital to Denon vs Analogue from the Revo.
It is supprisingly similar sounding....... not at all the very noticable difference between the Arcam CD and Denon. The Denon has a slight edge being a little more "full" than the Revo 5.1
(strange the Revo/Denon so close due to AKM vs Burr Brown DAC's used)

Im wondering what DAC the EMU 1212M runs.

As now my options are to spend more and get the Arcam and use its good onboard decoding. OR get the Denon and spend the difference on a 1212M (with change to spare).
THOUGH i really want to know the 1212M will very noticably outstrip the Revo 5.1 and at worse match Arcam's CD player offerings (and inturn Arcam recievers onboard) ablities.

I guess each DAC "brand" has there own sound in a way. I guess if the EMU has Wolfson i should be right.... if its AKM or Burr Brown then......... ?

Any ideas appreciated.
Thanks

 

[Iron_Dreamer]

The 1212M uses Crystal's CS4398 chip.

 

[yeeyy]

If you intended to use 1212m to passthru DD/DTS to your receiver, no it can't support yet at this moment.

You may want to cinsider your Revo to co-exist with 1212m and using your Revo for DD/DTS passthru job.

 

[Mr.Radar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by yeeyy If you intended to use 1212m to passthru DD/DTS to your receiver, no it can't support yet at this moment. You may want to cinsider your Revo to co-exist with 1212m and using your Revo for DD/DTS passthru job.

Or a Chaintech AV-710 for much less.

 

[Spoonfed]

Yes i can use the Revo for SPDIF pass duties.... though space is at a premium so i "could" use the onboard CMedia for this...... hmmm

Just really do wonder how it "sound"s compare to the Revo 5.1

 

[yeeyy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spoonfed Yes i can use the Revo for SPDIF pass duties.... though space is at a premium so i "could" use the onboard CMedia for this...... hmmm Just really do wonder how it "sound"s compare to the Revo 5.1

I believe lots of users here have feedback how good the sounds is for EMU cards.

But instead of 1212m, you may want to consider 0404 if all you want is music playback only. It is half the price of the 1212m.

I just listen up 0404 and Juli@ together and still find 0404 sounds much details and with better dynamic.

 

[thomaspf]

Interesting. I am having a Juli@ sitting at my desk waiting to be used when the machine for it arrives.

What did yourchain look like end-to-end when you compared the 0404 to the Juli@? Did you test the Juli@ in balanced mode?

I am assuming the Juli@ driver supports AC3/DTS pass through?

Cheers

Thomas

 

[yeeyy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by thomaspf Interesting. I am having a Juli@ sitting at my desk waiting to be used when the machine for it arrives. What did yourchain look like end-to-end when you compared the 0404 to the Juli@? Did you test the Juli@ in balanced mode? I am assuming the Juli@ driver supports AC3/DTS pass through? Cheers Thomas

I connect both soundcard in unbalanced mode. The reason is I do not have balanced connection at the other end.

The comparison is done by comparing both Analog output. I found 0404 sounds for better details and dynamic. I personally believe this is much related to the DAC it used: AK4358, an 8-ch DAC, which limit its performance.

If you have a system that sounds too bright, then Juli@ is a good soundcard to improve the sound system. Juli@ sound to have very good control while less details.

From the RMAA Test that I carry out, I noticed the noise floor of Juli@ is much better than 0404. Since the test I carry out is Loopback Test. I believe it is because of the ADC used in Juli@ (AK5385A) is much better than the ADC used in 0404 (PCM1804).

 

[thomaspf]

Thanks,

so what amplifier speaker/headphone did you connect the 0404 and Juli@ to for your listening tests?

Cheers

Thomas

 

[yeeyy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by thomaspf Thanks, so what amplifier speaker/headphone did you connect the 0404 and Juli@ to for your listening tests? Cheers Thomas

The testing was done in my friend's place, using CSW speaker, can't really remember what speaker are used, but the different is noticable.

If you able to loan/borrow a 0404, try to take a listen to it and you will notice the different too. You need not awesome speaker to hear the different.

 

[Spoonfed]

How does the top of the line Wolfson 8740 compare?

 

[yeeyy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spoonfed How does the top of the line Wolfson 8740 compare?

Is this the DAC that used in ARCAM FMJ33 and CD92?

If the answer is yes, then I listened to it once, in a H-Fi shop, asking the salesman to demo to me. Speaker used is B&W Nautilus 800, cannot remember which amplifier but the price range is about the same as the speaker.

Honestly speaking, IMHO I am quite disappointed. I found the vocal tend to be a little thin. Orchestral still ok but not impressed me much. According to the salesman the unit haven't burn in yet, but who knows.

 

[Spoonfed]

Yep thats the one.

I found the oposite in vocals (ie more full) compared to some Denon source using Burr Brown DAC's ........ though there are other contributing factors.

The AKM sound to me is closer to the burr brown sound i find?

 

[yeeyy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spoonfed Yep thats the one. I found the oposite in vocals (ie more full) compared to some Denon source using Burr Brown DAC's ........ though there are other contributing factors

Maybe the speaker? I don't know.

 

[thomaspf]

The analog stage buffering the output of the DACs has a big impact on the sound as well. Two unit having the same DAC still migth sound very different based on their analog circuitry.

A couple of external DACs and higher end transports use discretely build amplifiers rather than integrated op-amps and get some very different sound from still using the same DAC chips.

Cheers

Thomas