[steviebee]

You've heard Mastodon? Isis? Earth? I'm not sure how the latter two fit in to 'metal' as such (especially in light of Isis' last two, and Dylan Carlson's development/lightening of the Earth drone) but, along with Sunn 0))), they're all producing some damn fine music. And not a whiff of spandex, thank god.

 

[intoart]

Real punk (eg Dead Kennedys, The Clash) had something meaningful to say.
Metal, on the other hand, is just mindless entertainment (though it can certainly be fun!)

What I can't stand are fake, corporate "punk" bands like Green Day. Talk about posers!

 

[Dublo7]

I think you're generalising a bit. Credit is given where credit is due, and lots of metal bands get plenty of critical acclaim: Opeth, Meshuggah and Mastodon, ring any bells?

Quote:

Originally Posted by steviebee /img/forum/go_quote.gif You've heard Mastodon? Isis? Earth? I'm not sure how the latter two fit in to 'metal' as such (especially in light of Isis' last two, and Dylan Carlson's development/lightening of the Earth drone) but, along with Sunn 0))), they're all producing some damn fine music. And not a whiff of spandex, thank god.

hi5

 

[scytheavatar]

What critics are you talking about? If it's the likes of Rolling Stone, why the heck do you care about what they say? When has they ever gotten it right?

 

[tru blu]

Well, there's no denying that there's something a bit, er, juvenile about a lot of metal, right down to the lyrics and imagery. I'm of the opinion that earlier metal (like Led Zeppelin, Motörhead, War Pigs Black Sabbath (if that counts), even early Metallica, before James Hetfield decided it was OK to be a stone-cold racist, was more interesting.

Actually, on the punk side of things, Johnny Ramone was a jerk, too—read Lester Bangs' "The White-Noise Supremacists"—and I didn't really forgive them, either, until I actually started running into Joey and crazy-ass Dee-Dee at parties. Joey Ramone was a really sweet guy, rest his soul. Generally, the punks cared about more of the things I care about.

 

[Dublo7]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tru blu /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well, there's no denying that there's something a bit, er, juvenile about a lot of metal, right down to the lyrics and imagery. I'm of the opinion that earlier metal (like Led Zeppelin, Motörhead, War Pigs Black Sabbath (if that counts), even early Metallica, before James Hetfield decided it was OK to be a stone-cold racist) was more interesting.

James Hetfield is a racist?

 

[PhaedrusX]

punk emerged as a social movement. they took stands, had more to say and had more to prove. it also supported the belief that you didn't have to be the most talented musicians to be heard. this was important. if you couldn't play your instrument very well, you'd better bring something else to the table. and a lot of them did.

while metal has a cultural identity, they seem to lack any kind of social relevance. from a musical standpoint, this is fine. but from a critics point of view, it's always going to be less interesting to write about.

i grew up on both. my punk collection is pretty big. i haven't listened to metal in yonks because it didn't have anything to say to me, whereas the voice of punk still resonates. i don't see the connection at all.

 

[scytheavatar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tru blu /img/forum/go_quote.gif like Led Zeppelin, Motörhead, War Pigs Black Sabbath (if that counts), even early Metallica, before James Hetfield decided it was OK to be a stone-cold racist

Led Zeppelin is not metal. Black Sabbath has been mostly metal in their career. And Metallica has never been interesting.

 

[Bojamijams]

the level of ignorance in this thread is amazing.. metal has nothing meaningful to say?

riiight.

its not intelligent?

I'd say its the people posting stupid **** like that, that are the ones lacking the intellect.

 

[Edoardo]

I don't like punk, metal, powerchords ect.

Green Day punk? socially or culturally involved in anything? LOL

It is just a question of marketing, and of being radio and TV friendly. Green Day, Tokio Hotel or Eminem don't play music they are just an invented commercial product that gets the "secret desires" of schoolgirls... How could the Iron Maiden do that?

P.S. the answer to your question is just "because little girls don't like guitar solos"

 

[ingwe]

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhaedrusX /img/forum/go_quote.gif while metal has a cultural identity, they seem to lack any kind of social relevance.

For you, probably not. For others, metal definitely has social relevance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by panda /img/forum/go_quote.gif i dont normally agree with critics but i absolutely hate metal, i think it's annoying noises with screaming involved where you cant even understand lyrics.

I agree. Just like that band, The Beatles.

Quote:

Originally Posted by panda /img/forum/go_quote.gif earlier metal otoh are great, hell even iron maidens debut is good. and progressive sounds queer.

Try, Tool if you haven't.

 

[logwed]

Quote:

Originally Posted by panda /img/forum/go_quote.gif i dont normally agree with critics but i absolutely hate metal, i think it's annoying noises with screaming involved where you cant even understand lyrics. earlier metal otoh are great, hell even iron maidens debut is good. and progressive sounds queer.

Iron Maiden started out punk, and really ended up defining the genre of metal. They have been copied so many times that metal ended up being very similar from band to band. Really, there isn't too much variation; it's shredding and a few basic chords. Prog is much more intellectual approach, it takes what classical has given us with movements and variation, and it applies that to modern instruments. I love it, but I understand that it's not everyone's cup of tea.

 

[servoled]

Punk has a better story behind it and makes for a more interesting article.

 

[Meliboeus]

It's quite difficult to provide a comprehensive answer to the opening question, the problem is quite complex if we take into account that music critics, especially on the mass media are rarely completely independent from the marketing trends and strategies set by the record companies.

However one of the possible answers is that the most widespread kind of metal music, and thus the most discussed by critics, is not of the highest quality.

Many musically and lirically complex metal bands remain quite unknown to the mass public: even the most popoular of them like the already mentioned Opeth, Mastodon etc still get significant less airplay than more commercial "metal" bands like metallica or all those cool 'core kids. This is what gives metal a bad reputation among the less discerning critics, and the main reason behind all those posts like "metal is mindless screaming, just noise etc".

It was like that in the in the late 80s: metallica got famous and i may concur they were just "mindless entertainment" but what about the first technical death bands like Atheist or Cynic which were formed in the same period ? No one could argue it is not quality music.

Today it's the same: most people identify all metal with Korn or Trivium but that's not the real thing. I firmly believe that "metal" is a label which describes a very broad spectrum of musical offerings and that there might be a narrow gap within what's intelligent and what isn't; thus i understand it could not be easy to distinguish: at a first careless listen a random song by Cannibal Corpse could sound just the same as Death's Symbolic, but while the former is just loud gore inspired music, the latter is some intelligently composed and technical metal which definately has "something to say".

For the same reason even if i recognise the sgnificance of a band like Judas Priest, i only have two records : "Sad Wings of Destiny" ( which IMO is the best metal album ever ) and "Stained Class", heavy but rather thoughtful music; when they took the leather and studs approach...their music became less interesting, closer to that "just entertainment and just noise" definition. Just because it belongs to history i still appreciate an album like Painkiller, but if a band would release something similar right now, i'd just avoid it.

 

[evanft]

This thread is so full of fail I'm surprised it hasn't been locked. It's like people are trying to look like idiots who have no idea what they're talking about.