[derbigpr]

So, quite a weird list I have here with three completely different headphones.
 
The thing is...I'm looking for a upper mid - high end can, so not quite HD800 / T1 / LCD2 level, but above DT880 / HD600-650 / K701.  
 
What I don't care about AT ALL is sound neutrality. I don't care if sound is colored as a rainbow, or freq response is flat as a ruler, as long as it sounds excellent.  I'm way past the phase where everything had to sound as "in reality". I don't care for that. I listen to music now, not headphones.
 
I also don't care whether its opened or closed, whether its active or passive, etc, whether it needs an amp or not.  I will be using the headphone with Asus Xonar STX as a DAC and some amp for specific headphones. But I'd like to use the STX alone for convenience. 
 
What I care for is a FUN, refined, full sounding headphone, possibly not very bright ( but I don't mind it), and this is the most important part, I want great bass. Lots of bass, especially sub-bass. I want my cheeks to vibrate, but at the same time, I want a good mid range and highs, and a good soundstage.
 
I listen to literally all genres of music, most of which are acoustic, classical rock, some vocals,  and lots of pop and electronic. Sometimes jazz and classical, but not so much lately.
 
What I have on my list now are:
 
Denon AH-D600
Beyerdynamic T90
Beyerdynamic T70
Sennheiser Momentum
PSB M4U2
 
The key here is, I want a headphone that has the level of fidelity and resolution that is above or at least at the level of HD600 / HD650. So I dont want to downgrade, I want to upgrade or "sidegrade".
 
The thing is though, in my country prices are all over the place.
For example:   D600's and T90's cost 600$,  same as HD650's. T70's cost 500$, while DT880's and DT990's cost 250$ and DT770pro or Custom One pro is less than 250$.
Momentum is 400$,  M4U2 is about 500$.
 
So what would you guys chose?  Is D600's worth as much as T90's?  And are both worth as much as HD650's?
Same question for M4U2 and Momentum.
 
Feel free to recommend something else that would fit the lots of sub bass, good mids and soundstage category.  I can get the D2000 for 500$, but I feel its too close to D600 to justify buying an old version.
 
Sorry for fuzzy question, but Its hard to choose these days with so many offerings. Especially when you already own all of the classics in <500$ range.

 

[MalVeauX]

Heya,
 
T70 is anemic, not what you're looking for.
T90 is a possibility.
D600 is a possibility.
DT880 would be a good choice.
DT990 would be a good choice.
 
The Denon D2000 or D5000 would be my first suggestion based on what you're saying you want. They're better than the D400/D600 according to all the first impressions. But the Denon sound is what you've described basically.
 
By the way, call up B&H about the Denon D2000, they can probably quote you a price between $200~300 perhaps still for one.
 
Here's the direction I would steer you:
 
Denon D5000
Ultrasone PRO 2900
Hifiman HE-400
AudioTechnica A900X
 
Very best,

 

[derbigpr]

Quote:

Heya,
 
T70 is anemic, not what you're looking for.
T90 is a possibility.
D600 is a possibility.
DT880 would be a good choice.
DT990 would be a good choice.
 
The Denon D2000 or D5000 would be my first suggestion based on what you're saying you want. They're better than the D400/D600 according to all the first impressions. But the Denon sound is what you've described basically.
 
By the way, call up B&H about the Denon D2000, they can probably quote you a price between $200~300 perhaps still for one.
 
Here's the direction I would steer you:
 
Denon D5000
Ultrasone PRO 2900
Hifiman HE-400
AudioTechnica A900X
 
Very best,

 
 
Thanks for your answer. So D2000 is the way to go.
 
I find it interesting that you mentioned the A900X.  I've seen it in a local store for 500$, cant try it though. I just assume its a bass light mid/high centric headphones as most AT's.  Is it really bass heavy?

 

[MalVeauX]

Quote:

 
 
Thanks for your answer. So D2000 is the way to go.
 
I find it interesting that you mentioned the A900X.  I've seen it in a local store for 500$, cant try it though. I just assume its a bass light mid/high centric headphones as most AT's.  Is it really bass heavy?

 
Where are you located? The A900X is $200 in USA and $300 directly from Japan.
 
The A900X is not like any other AudioTechnica you're accustomed to. It's actually more like the D2000. It has great sub-bass, great mid-bass, excellent AT mids, and a great sparkly treble that is not too bright. The vocals are excellent, while it's still able to drop incredibly good bass lines. Fantastic headphone. Has all the detail/presentation and impressive ability to render vocals of the SRH940 but with the bass ability of a more competent headphone. One of my top recommendations and easily the best AudioTechnica short of going high-end in my opinion.
 
If you can get the D2000, get it. If you cannot, the A900X is the next best thing to it.
 
Very best,

 

[derbigpr]

Quote:

 
Where are you located? The A900X is $200 in USA and $300 directly from Japan.
 
The A900X is not like any other AudioTechnica you're accustomed to. It's actually more like the D2000. It has great sub-bass, great mid-bass, excellent AT mids, and a great sparkly treble that is not too bright. The vocals are excellent, while it's still able to drop incredibly good bass lines. Fantastic headphone. Has all the detail/presentation and impressive ability to render vocals of the SRH940 but with the bass ability of a more competent headphone. One of my top recommendations and easily the best AudioTechnica short of going high-end in my opinion.
 
If you can get the D2000, get it. If you cannot, the A900X is the next best thing to it.
 
Very best,

 
 
 
So, if D2000 and A900X cost exactly the same, D2000 is better choice?
 
I still wanna try out the Momentum and M4U2, as they're both pretty warm and have good bass, and are all in the same price range.
 
Or, I might go for 2 cheaper headphones. One very bass heavy for electronic music, like the Beyer DT770 pro80 or COP, and something else like HD598's for vocals. But I really dont wanna spend money on less headphones than HD650's.

 

[MalVeauX]

Quote:

 
 
 
So, if D2000 and A900X cost exactly the same, D2000 is better choice?
 
I still wanna try out the Momentum and M4U2, as they're both pretty warm and have good bass, and are all in the same price range.
 
Or, I might go for 2 cheaper headphones. One very bass heavy for electronic music, like the Beyer DT770 pro80 or COP, and something else like HD598's for vocals. But I really dont wanna spend money on less headphones than HD650's.

 
Heya,
 
Given the opportunity to get the D2000 or A900X, I would take the D2000 primarily. I like it better. It's more comfortable, has better sub-bass ability. The A900X has better mids, slightly less sub-bass, similar mid-bass (maybe more mid-bass, it's warmer initially than the D2000 in that sense), but the A900X I found to be less comfortable, and I don't care for the "wings" that AudioTechnica uses (I like full headbands).
 
The thing is, the A900X or D2000 completely replaces the need for two cheaper headphones, one bass heavy, one good for vocals. A single headphone that is very competent in everything is a better way to go. And those two headphones are just that. These two have better overall bass than the DT770 I find. And both have similar, and in the case of the A900X, better vocals.
 
Very best,

 

[derbigpr]

Quote:

 
Heya,
 
Given the opportunity to get the D2000 or A900X, I would take the D2000 primarily. I like it better. It's more comfortable, has better sub-bass ability. The A900X has better mids, slightly less sub-bass, similar mid-bass (maybe more mid-bass, it's warmer initially than the D2000 in that sense), but the A900X I found to be less comfortable, and I don't care for the "wings" that AudioTechnica uses (I like full headbands).
 
The thing is, the A900X or D2000 completely replaces the need for two cheaper headphones, one bass heavy, one good for vocals. A single headphone that is very competent in everything is a better way to go. And those two headphones are just that. These two have better overall bass than the DT770 I find. And both have similar, and in the case of the A900X, better vocals.
 
Very best,

 
 
 
Hmm I'm not really sure what to do.  I definitely wanna move up. I'm tired of switching between 300-400$ cans, I've tried so many of them, and they're fine for a while, but they just get tiring and stop sounding good after a while. And I'm afraid that could happen with D2000's too, especially since they "lower class" than HD650's, DT880's,etc. I just want a listening experience thats a class above what I have now.  I mean I have a cheap speaker setup in my dorm room now, a pair of <200$ Wharfedale Vardus 100 bookshelfs, and they blow away HD650's and all the headphones I have in terms of how nice it is to listen to them and how good everything sounds, but I just cant listen to them 90% of the time, so I'm stuck with headphones. But everything I have just sounds so boring and unexciting after listening to speakers after a while. Thats why I said I want something colored that sounds fun. I'd really like to try the D600's. I don't see how they could possibly be worse than D2000's.  Probably just different. Or maybe I manage to find a used pair of D7000....or just get the LCD2's or HE500's and be done with it.

 

[MalVeauX]

Quote:

 
 
 
Hmm I'm not really sure what to do.  I definitely wanna move up. I'm tired of switching between 300-400$ cans, I've tried so many of them, and they're fine for a while, but they just get tiring and stop sounding good after a while. And I'm afraid that could happen with D2000's too, especially since they "lower class" than HD650's, DT880's,etc. I just want a listening experience thats a class above what I have now.  I mean I have a cheap speaker setup in my dorm room now, a pair of <200$ Wharfedale Vardus 100 bookshelfs, and they blow away HD650's and all the headphones I have in terms of how nice it is to listen to them and how good everything sounds, but I just cant listen to them 90% of the time, so I'm stuck with headphones. But everything I have just sounds so boring and unexciting after listening to speakers after a while. Thats why I said I want something colored that sounds fun. I'd really like to try the D600's. I don't see how they could possibly be worse than D2000's.  Probably just different. Or maybe I manage to find a used pair of D7000....or just get the LCD2's or HE500's and be done with it.

 
Heya,
 
Sounds like you're just looking for a new experience and not something technically better. Since your speaker setup is "blowing away" all your mid-fi headphone setups, it's pretty clear that you simply have a preference to the sound staging of speakers probably. Also, the D2000 is not a lower class, at all, from the HD650 or DT880. It's in the same class. And quite frankly, is way more exciting and fun than either of those headphones. It's one of those things you'd have to just see for yourself. Another headphone I would have you look at is the Ultrasone PRO 2900 and the Hifiman HE-400.
 
Very best,

 

[adamlr]

Quote:

 
The A900X is not like any other AudioTechnica you're accustomed to. It's actually more like the D2000. It has great sub-bass, great mid-bass, excellent AT mids, and a great sparkly treble that is not too bright. The vocals are excellent, while it's still able to drop incredibly good bass lines. Fantastic headphone. Has all the detail/presentation and impressive ability to render vocals of the SRH940 but with the bass ability of a more competent headphone. One of my top recommendations and easily the best AudioTechnica short of going high-end in my opinion.
 
If you can get the D2000, get it. If you cannot, the A900X is the next best thing to it.
 
Very best,

 you sure convinced me! haha

 

[derbigpr]

Quote:

 
Heya,
 
Sounds like you're just looking for a new experience and not something technically better. Since your speaker setup is "blowing away" all your mid-fi headphone setups, it's pretty clear that you simply have a preference to the sound staging of speakers probably. Also, the D2000 is not a lower class, at all, from the HD650 or DT880. It's in the same class. And quite frankly, is way more exciting and fun than either of those headphones. It's one of those things you'd have to just see for yourself. Another headphone I would have you look at is the Ultrasone PRO 2900 and the Hifiman HE-400.
 
Very best,

 
 
I do prefer the speaker soundstaging, because it actually is a stage where you can feel the space and directions of sounds in a very real way, not just slightly. But other than that, things just sound better, and no less detailed. For example, when I listen to something like  Chris Rea - Your deep and tender love, I really love the way his voice sounds on speakers, dead center, and it comes out much more textured, detailed and airy than on any of the headphones I own. If I listen to something like Porcupine Tree - Trains,  guitar on the beginning is extremely detailed, fast, crisp, airy and gentle on speakers, very involving, on headphones its just like,... meh. 
 
I'm willing to pay 1000$ for headphones if they give me the experience I get with speakers. The biggest problem for me is the fact that even with most opened headphones, sound is still in your head. Still havent heard audiophile headphones that give me out of the head experience, apart with those dolby headphone and binaural testing recordings.
 
Funny thing, and this is going to make me sound like a total noob, but headphones that actually come closest to sounding like speakers in certain cases, are Logitech G35 gaming headset with "7.1 surround"  which I bought some time ago as a gimmick. They have dolby headphone soundcard integrated in them. They plug into the USB as well. But damn do they sound good with electronic music for 150$. And they actually sound HUGE, very big soundstage. Bass is very deep and powerful, but not loose or boomy, mids are a little bit recessed and have some echo to them (as does the rest of the sound), highs are a bit harsh, but can be adjusted to be smoother. Overall, when comparing them to DT880's or HD650's, there's really not much to it between them with some genres. I even prefer them for electronic music such as Infected Mushroom or Deadmau5. But with classical they suck, with jazz and vocal, just weird echo, which results in a big soundstage though. But as a electronic headphone, they're awesome.  Deadmau5 4+4=12 album sounds sick on them. Very big soundstage, out of head experience, and bass is just orgasmic, its goes as deep as any subwoofer I've heard, and is very clean and textured, reminiscent of DT880 bass. Very meaty sound.  But they're a limited headphone, only good for one thing, and bad for others.
 
Damn, if only they built soundproofed rooms in dorms.

 

[MalVeauX]

Heya,
 
So it is definitely sound staging. Sounds like you can save a ton of money and just get yourself a simple soundcard with Dolby Headphone, Xonar DG (PCI) is $30, Xonar DGX (PCI-E) is $50 and they are both Dolby Headphone ready. You can then output this to an amplifier that drives your headphones. Your HD650 or DT880 with that will have that surround sound staging that you're saying you liked with the Logitech, but with the quality of those headphones instead. Give it a shot. It's cheaper, ultimately, if this is what you're actually looking for in a headphone. Headphones never sound as good as speakers will sound, sound stage is something speakers do much better, range too, everything frankly. Headphones simply give you an alternative when speakers are not an option. I'm a sound stage freak myself, I have 29 drivers total for my main speaker setup in a 7.2 configuration to make a sphere of audio. Headphones just cannot come close to it. However, when it's not an option, headphones do give you something other than silence. So, try a simple "surround" solution to give yourself a different sound stage and see if that gives you the inexpensive fix you're looking for. A flagship high-end is not going to sound 3D or do what your'e looking for in sound stage, even the HD800 for example cannot do what you're looking for. Dolby Headphone or Yamaha's Silent Cinema will however get closer to what you're looking for.
 
Sony MA900 + Xonar DGX for example is a very inexpensive way to get a monstrous sound stage for a headphone setup.
 
Very best,

 

[derbigpr]

Quote:

Heya,
 
So it is definitely sound staging. Sounds like you can save a ton of money and just get yourself a simple soundcard with Dolby Headphone, Xonar DG (PCI) is $30, Xonar DGX (PCI-E) is $50 and they are both Dolby Headphone ready. You can then output this to an amplifier that drives your headphones. Your HD650 or DT880 with that will have that surround sound staging that you're saying you liked with the Logitech, but with the quality of those headphones instead. Give it a shot. It's cheaper, ultimately, if this is what you're actually looking for in a headphone. Headphones never sound as good as speakers will sound, sound stage is something speakers do much better, range too, everything frankly. Headphones simply give you an alternative when speakers are not an option. I'm a sound stage freak myself, I have 29 drivers total for my main speaker setup in a 7.2 configuration to make a sphere of audio. Headphones just cannot come close to it. However, when it's not an option, headphones do give you something other than silence. So, try a simple "surround" solution to give yourself a different sound stage and see if that gives you the inexpensive fix you're looking for. A flagship high-end is not going to sound 3D or do what your'e looking for in sound stage, even the HD800 for example cannot do what you're looking for. Dolby Headphone or Yamaha's Silent Cinema will however get closer to what you're looking for.
 
Sony MA900 + Xonar DGX for example is a very inexpensive way to get a monstrous sound stage for a headphone setup.
 
Very best,

 
 
Well I actually do have Asus ST already, which has dolby headphone, but its not as good as with the Logitecs. Doesnt make the sound bigger or out of head, just adds echo. For example, in games Logitechs sound much better than HD650 or DT880 + dolby headphone.  With music dolby headphone just fails, with almost all types. Havent tried Yamaha Silent Cinema yet though.