[DenverW]

Calling all Watercoolers joining us at CanJam SoCal 2023!

We're doing a WhatsApp group chat to help coordinate meals, meet-ups and other on-site activities. Please PM @goldwerger to get added!

Under a week, my excitement level is elevating...

 

[MaxwellDemon]

Hi friends. Been awhile, my account was even deactivated due to inactivity
Maybe about 2 years late but have an EXT on the way.

Looking for a DAP to pair this with. Also a note: tried the EXT with an AK SP3000 and kind of hated the combo. Much preferred the Questyle M15 dongle on my phone over it so I guess I prefer a less technical sound?

I remember not ever liking how any of the iBasso/Fiio daps sounded.

If I’m mot wrong, I’ve read that EXT is very sensitive to cables/source and scales pretty well with power. Also open to some amp suggestions if it come down to that though I rather not stack. I have of narrowed it down to the following:

Cayin N7 (expensive)
Hiby RS6 (good contender)
Hiby R6ii (looks like power might be low though I’ve read it’s a non-issue)
Hiby R5ii (Android version is a little old, might wait for a “R5iii”)
Sony daps (Read that UI is kinda slow & volume cap)

Here are some rough criteria:

Pocketable (Hiby R8 was way too big for my liking)
Android (newer versions, preferably 12)
Balanced 4.4 (I think 90% of daps have this now?)
Fast UI
No lag on audio vs video when used on desktop mode* (Ive noticed this an issue even on R8, if this is present on everything then ignore this)

I am wondering if the Cayin RU7 will work for you so it is easily pocketable, can connect to PC and phone via USB, feature a pretty analog sound signature and also won't break the bank.

 

[Damz87]

Hi friends. Been awhile, my account was even deactivated due to inactivity
Maybe about 2 years late but have an EXT on the way.

Looking for a DAP to pair this with. Also a note: tried the EXT with an AK SP3000 and kind of hated the combo. Much preferred the Questyle M15 dongle on my phone over it so I guess I prefer a less technical sound?

I remember not ever liking how any of the iBasso/Fiio daps sounded.

If I’m mot wrong, I’ve read that EXT is very sensitive to cables/source and scales pretty well with power. Also open to some amp suggestions if it come down to that though I rather not stack. I have of narrowed it down to the following:

Cayin N7 (expensive)
Hiby RS6 (good contender)
Hiby R6ii (looks like power might be low though I’ve read it’s a non-issue)
Hiby R5ii (Android version is a little old, might wait for a “R5iii”)
Sony daps (Read that UI is kinda slow & volume cap)

Here are some rough criteria:

Pocketable (Hiby R8 was way too big for my liking)
Android (newer versions, preferably 12)
Balanced 4.4 (I think 90% of daps have this now?)
Fast UI
No lag on audio vs video when used on desktop mode* (Ive noticed this an issue even on R8, if this is present on everything then ignore this)

Definitely would suggest considering either Shanling M9 or M9+. Both pair amazingly well with EXT imho

 

[Yifang]

Hi friends. Been awhile, my account was even deactivated due to inactivity
Maybe about 2 years late but have an EXT on the way.

Looking for a DAP to pair this with. Also a note: tried the EXT with an AK SP3000 and kind of hated the combo. Much preferred the Questyle M15 dongle on my phone over it so I guess I prefer a less technical sound?

I remember not ever liking how any of the iBasso/Fiio daps sounded.

If I’m mot wrong, I’ve read that EXT is very sensitive to cables/source and scales pretty well with power. Also open to some amp suggestions if it come down to that though I rather not stack. I have of narrowed it down to the following:

Cayin N7 (expensive)
Hiby RS6 (good contender)
Hiby R6ii (looks like power might be low though I’ve read it’s a non-issue)
Hiby R5ii (Android version is a little old, might wait for a “R5iii”)
Sony daps (Read that UI is kinda slow & volume cap)

Here are some rough criteria:

Pocketable (Hiby R8 was way too big for my liking)
Android (newer versions, preferably 12)
Balanced 4.4 (I think 90% of daps have this now?)
Fast UI
No lag on audio vs video when used on desktop mode* (Ive noticed this an issue even on R8, if this is present on everything then ignore this)

Definitely would suggest considering either Shanling M9 or M9+. Both pair amazingly well with EXT imho

I'd recommend regular M9 OG over M9 Plus as the OG is a bit more clean and neutral compared to the M9 Plus which is warmer, should work better with low end boosted EXT. Regular M9 would also be a cheaper option. Both are amazing options though!

 

[chickenmcnug]

I am wondering if the Cayin RU7 will work for you so it is easily pocketable, can connect to PC and phone via USB, feature a pretty analog sound signature and also won't break the bank.

Ah yes thanks for reminding me. RU7 is another I am looking at. Though at that price my brain goes, "might as well go a little higher for the R5ii or Sony NWA300? Why not both? Hmm I shouldn't be getting 2 things. At that point I should get a batter dap." Aaand the cycle of indecision continues.

Definitely would suggest considering either Shanling M9 or M9+. Both pair amazingly well with EXT imho

I'd recommend regular M9 OG over M9 Plus as the OG is a bit more clean and neutral compared to the M9 Plus which is warmer, should work better with low end boosted EXT. Regular M9 would also be a cheaper option. Both are amazing options though!

I like AK dacs, Interesting. Hard to demo Shanling & Hiby here :')
Sounds like I'd prefer M9+ though it's $3k yikes. I tended to prefer warmer sources, 1Z + VE8 was my favourite combo for mids.

 

[Smirk 24]

Sounds like I'd prefer M9+ though it's $3k yikes. I tended to prefer warmer sources, 1Z + VE8 was my favourite combo for mids.

RS6 is a warmer source that I enjoy. It does have a more intimate staging and a tamer treble compared to most DAPs however.

 

[phiemon]

We have all three of those, and I don't agree with RTINGS. To be clear, I'm not saying they're wrong, just that I don't agree -- so I guess I am saying they're wrong when it comes to me.

I use the AirPods Pro 2 a lot, but almost never to listen to music dedicatedly. It is unquestionably an incredible device, in terms of its technologies. Nobody can touch Apple yet when it comes to pass-through. (We objectively tested this at Head Acoustics' US labs. Perhaps we'll use those tests as content at some point.) The APP2'S ANC is also excellent. Outgoing voice is very good (but not awesome). And it sounds very good for what it is. But what it is not for me is an audiophile TWS for dedicated music listening -- for that it's good. I'll give it that.

We only recently received the Sony WF-1000XM5. The XM5 is an excellent earphone (especially for ANC), and it sounds quite good to me. But, again, for me, first impressions suggest it's not going to be my dedicated audiophile TWS, though I think it sounds better, and is more resolving to me than the APP2 (but keep in mind I've only used this model so far with one of my Android phones using LDAC). And while ear fit will vary from person to person, I don't get the quickest, easiest fit with the XM5 with any of its included eartips -- it takes more finagling than I'd like.

Of your list, that leaves the Sennheiser MOMENTUM TW3. And if sound quality for music listening is your criteria, it's my clear favorite of the three. The MOMENTUM TW3's default tonal balance is closer to my overall preferences for music listening than any other TWS I've tried (and second, in terms of overall performance, to the HIFIMAN SVANAR Wireless), but if you're going to score the MOMENTUM TW3 against the most popular preference targets, it may not be the best in that regard. (But I also find that method of evaluating too reductive much of the time.)

One of the perceptual metrics we've been testing with and will be showing more data from going forward is something from Head Acoustics called MDAQS (Multi-Dimensional Audio Quality Score). We talked about MDAQS with Dr. Hans Gierlich from Head Acoustics (recently retired), and posted a video about it, which you can see here:

​

I've been talking a bit about MDAQS in a couple of seminars I've given, and, again, we'll be sharing MDAQS scores for headphones and IEMs in the future. (We'll probably start late this year, and then ramp up in 2024.) I'll also be sharing more information about what it is (and what it isn't).

Anyway, the Sennheiser MOMENTUM TW3 is one of the highest-scoring devices we've tested with MDAQS, which didn't surprise me. It scored an MDAQS overall score (MOS-O) of 4.8 out of a possible 5. As for its tonal balance (which, again, would probably not score very high if using solely the most popular frequency response targets), MDAQS gave it a timbre score (MOT-T) of 4.9 (which, again, did not surprise me). Of the three assessed dimensions, it could reasonably be said that the Timbre dimension is the one most involving and affected by frequency response.

(It'll help to understand the previous paragraph more if you watch that video above.)

Anyway, long story short (I know....too late), of the three you mentioned, when it comes to music listening, I recommend the Sennheiser. And I'm not recommending it because of the MDAQS score, but I thought it an interesting thing to share since we're talking about the MOMENTUM TW3.

​

2023-09-24 1614 EDT: Edited to make the distinction between my preference for the MOMENTUM TW3's tonal balance and overall performance to me.

Thank you very much, that helped a lot. I think I will additionally test the MTW3.

 

[Nosibilance]

Ah yes thanks for reminding me. RU7 is another I am looking at. Though at that price my brain goes, "might as well go a little higher for the R5ii or Sony NWA300? Why not both? Hmm I shouldn't be getting 2 things. At that point I should get a batter dap." Aaand the cycle of indecision continues.


I like AK dacs, Interesting. Hard to demo Shanling & Hiby here :')
Sounds like I'd prefer M9+ though it's $3k yikes. I tended to prefer warmer sources, 1Z + VE8 was my favourite combo for mids.

Why not R6 pro ii? Its dual akm4499

 

[RonaldS86]

Upcoming IEM from 64audio. Sorry for low res picture. The faceplate is fabulous
2 DD with isobaric design + 8 BA

 

[chickenmcnug]

Why not R6 pro ii? Its dual akm4499

It's pretty much one of my main choices. Just not sure if it has enough power as EXT scales well. I think I'm subconsciously waiting for the inevitable R5 update to make my final decision.

 

[nihalsharma]

Upcoming IEM from 64audio. Sorry for low res picture. The faceplate is fabulous
2 DD with isobaric design + 8 BA

I think this release will prove if the 64Audio is left with any novelty. With the type of heavy duty iems in the market, their iems seem way too old style (design and sound). Okay, this design is still too old school.

 

[RonaldS86]

I think this release will prove if the 64Audio is left with any novelty. With the type of heavy duty iems in the market, their iems seem way too old style (design and sound). Okay, this design is still too old school.

If it works, then why change it

 

[Benno1988]

If it works, then why change it

To keep up?

 

[nihalsharma]

If it works, then why change it

Man, I have defended my Fourte for a very long time. But can’t do it anymore. It really falls behind when compared to Radon6, Xe6, Jewel etc. 64Audio does not have any answer for these. I really want them to build something which stands tall in front of these great iems.

 

[RonaldS86]

Man, I have defended my Fourte for a very long time. But can’t do it anymore. It really falls behind when compared to Radon6, Xe6, Jewel etc. 64Audio does not have any answer for these. I really want them to build something which stands tall in front of these great iems.

I think because their main focus is more on the professional audio, like for music performer. What they need is purely for monitoring so I think that's the reason for the lack of innovation. If you seek innovation, then they have FiR for it. I don't know the story behind it, but I think they are still one company but with different target market. I can understand why they didn't want to change the design of the shell. At least for a loyal 64audio user, they don't need to worry will the new IEM fit their ear or not.