[Paladin79]

Since I use pair of 6sn7 in LM508 and quad 6sn7 in Freya, i consider ordering more 1578.

Just out of curiosity, i also had ordered cheap 6n8s tubes for comparison.
A very good Russian tube for the price is the 1958 Foton, they are out there in quantity last I looked. Once again, pin re-soldering really helps.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/QUAD-FOUR-Matched-Balanced-Russian-6N8S-6SN7-double-triode-TUBE-NEW-NOS/312402083888?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

I do not expect them to be as good as 1578.

A very good, inexpensive tube is the 1958 Foton. They are still around, last I looked and once you resolder the pins, they can be an excellent choice for the money as Russian tubes go.

 

[thomaskong78]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/273874731266?ul_noapp=true

I placed an order of one more pair of 1578 made in 1980

It will take 6 weeks to get it.

This dealer offer 60 days of return.

After having listed to 1578 for 8 hours, I am convinced this is the King of 6sn7 with nice timber, great bass, wide and deepest soundstage.


TS bgrp is not a bad tube but it is over hyped.

 

[scottcw]

I currently don't have any other frames of reference, but Brent Jesse recommended the Ken-Rad VT-231 black glass military 6SN7GT as the closest sound to the Tung Sol round plate without a ridiculous price.

It is in the driver slot of my EC Balancing Act and sounds great. I do not know how much is the Ken Rad, the matched NOS RCA 45s, or the overall circuit of the BA. I'm happy in any case.

 

[thomaskong78]

I currently don't have any other frames of reference, but Brent Jesse recommended the Ken-Rad VT-231 black glass military 6SN7GT as the closest sound to the Tung Sol round plate without a ridiculous price.

It is in the driver slot of my EC Balancing Act and sounds great. I do not know how much is the Ken Rad, the matched NOS RCA 45s, or the overall circuit of the BA. I'm happy in any case.

Choice of tube or cable depends on system and personal taste. There is no best thing. for everybody.

All vt231 (Syl, Kr, Rca, RT and TS) are in the same tier, not that TS is one notch above . Only Melz 1578 is in the first tier to my taste and system. Bass Kr, Rca, Rt, TS , Syl in the order Transparency TS, Syl, Kr, RT, RCA Details Syl, TS, Kr, RT, RCA Tonal balance Kr, RCA, TS, RT, Syl Soundstage width RCA, Syl, TS, Kr, RT Soundstage Depth TS, Kr, Syl, RT, RCA Thus overall they are close in SQ. Unless you want see-through transparency, you do not need to pay 500$ for TS bgrp. Kr is attractive due to best bass and sweet tonality. Syl is attractive due to excellent details and transparency RCA give warm and lush sound which make one comfortable with nice bass. RT is not far behind other ones. But if I were you, I would go for 1578 instead of Kenrad vt 231. I have three pairs of KR and they are pretty good tube but not in the same league as 1578 in soundstage, bass, dynamics and overall signature.

 

[LoryWiv]

Choice of tube or cable depends on system and personal taste. There is no best thing. for everybody.

All vt231 (Syl, Kr, Rca, RT and TS) are in the same tier, not that TS is one notch above . Only Melz 1578 is in the first tier to my taste and system. Bass Kr, Rca, Rt, TS , Syl in the order Transparency TS, Syl, Kr, RT, RCA Details Syl, TS, Kr, RT, RCA Tonal balance Kr, RCA, TS, RT, Syl Soundstage width RCA, Syl, TS, Kr, RT Soundstage Depth TS, Kr, Syl, RT, RCA Thus overall they are close in SQ. Unless you want see-through transparency, you do not need to pay 500$ for TS bgrp. Kr is attractive due to best bass and sweet tonality. Syl is attractive due to excellent details and transparency RCA give warm and lush sound which make one comfortable with nice bass. RT is not far behind other ones. But if I were you, I would go for 1578 instead of Kenrad vt 231. I have three pairs of KR and they are pretty good tube but not in the same league as 1578 in soundstage, bass, dynamics and overall signature.

Thank you @thomaskong78 for a very helpful listing. I am tempted to try the MELZ 1578 but note vintage Russian tube pins often require re-soldering to perform well and noise free. I have no soldering skills whatsoever. Is it risky to try them then?

 

[Paladin79]

Choice of tube or cable depends on system and personal taste. There is no best thing. for everybody.

All vt231 (Syl, Kr, Rca, RT and TS) are in the same tier, not that TS is one notch above . Only Melz 1578 is in the first tier to my taste and system. Bass Kr, Rca, Rt, TS , Syl in the order Transparency TS, Syl, Kr, RT, RCA Details Syl, TS, Kr, RT, RCA Tonal balance Kr, RCA, TS, RT, Syl Soundstage width RCA, Syl, TS, Kr, RT Soundstage Depth TS, Kr, Syl, RT, RCA Thus overall they are close in SQ. Unless you want see-through transparency, you do not need to pay 500$ for TS bgrp. Kr is attractive due to best bass and sweet tonality. Syl is attractive due to excellent details and transparency RCA give warm and lush sound which make one comfortable with nice bass. RT is not far behind other ones. But if I were you, I would go for 1578 instead of Kenrad vt 231. I have three pairs of KR and they are pretty good tube but not in the same league as 1578 in soundstage, bass, dynamics and overall signature.

There are a couple versions of the Ken-Rad black glass and that tube as well as a Melz 1578 were in at least three blind tube listening tests conducted by friends. (One person being Jason at Schiit) and in those groups, the Ken-Rad was rated higher than the Melz 1578 so opinions certainly vary. I like to get opinions from large groups myself and the next study will have at least 50 participants, many from the audio industry. I like the 1578 as well as the black glass Ken-rad.

I have not paid $500 for the TS bgrp, some are out there for $175 or so, some of the Ken-Rad VT 231 bg can be had for $50 on occasion if you are patient.

 

[Paladin79]

Thank you @thomaskong78 for a very helpful listing. I am tempted to try the MELZ 1578 but have heard that the pins often require re-soldering to perform well and noise free. I have no soldering skills whatsoever. is it risky to try them then?

I have removed and replaced the solder in about 25 of those and would help out at no charge. Now that offer is not open to @bcowen since he is likely to back a truck up to my place with more Fotons than exist in Russia but I will certainly help out on occasion.

I have also posted photos in the past of step by step tube pin soldering if you would like me to walk you through that.

I have taught soldering as well as electronics as well as having a few decades experience so I might have the credentials to help with such things.

 

[thomaskong78]

Thank you @thomaskong78 for a very helpful listing. I am tempted to try the MELZ 1578 but note vintage Russian tube pins often require re-soldering to perform well and noise free. I have no soldering skills whatsoever. Is it risky to try them then?

The tube that I got yesterday worked fine without soldering.

If you have bad luck with 1578 tube, then you can send it to Paladin79 to have soldering done on it.

He will do the work at reasonable cost for you since he is a nice gentleman.

 

[Paladin79]

The tube that I got yesterday worked fine without soldering.

If you have bad luck with 1578 tube, then you can send it to Paladin79 to have soldering done on it.

He will do the work at reasonable cost for you since he is a nice gentleman.

They do tend to work better than some of the Fotons from the fifties. People used to cook those for 100 hours till I demonstrated what changing the solder might do lol. The problems in the Melz are generally not as apparent, I have had noise at high frequencies, intermittent hum, microphony, but not on all I have bought. If you ever get a chance to listen to the 1963, that is my favorite 1578. @bcowen has one unless he lost it in a tube avalanche. He also had some from the 80's but I bought those from him a while back.

 

[thomaskong78]

They do tend to work better than some of the Fotons from the fifties. People used to cook those for 100 hours till I demonstrated what changing the solder might do lol. The problems in the Melz are generally not as apparent, I have had noise at high frequencies, intermittent hum, microphony, but not on all I have bought. If you ever get a chance to listen to the 1963, that is my favorite 1578. @bcowen has one unless he lost it in a tube avalanche. He also had some from the 80's but I bought those from him a while back.

Thanks a lot for valuable tips.

I noticed some high frequency noise before warm up. but those noise are gone after 10 minutes warm up.

Then I shall ask @bcowen whether he has spare 1578 made in 1963 to sell to me.

 

[Paladin79]

Thanks a lot for valuable tips.

Then I shall ask @bcowen whether he has spare 1578 made in 1963 to sell to me.

This is off subject but I do have a loaner amp out there that I designed specifically for 6sn7 listening. I do not want to put words in his mouth but @bcowen and others @Ripper2860 might corroborate that it succeeds in showing off tube differences. Down the road I may be able to lend it out to a couple of you gentlemen to check out. It is currently in North Dakota, or maybe South Dakota I forget.

This is just a hobby for me and has nothing whatsoever to do with my company and I am always happy to get fresh input. I have no intent of building more other than some I promised local friends so this is not a business venture in the least. Currently with that amp I have four 6sn7 equivalents encased in PVC that have been used in some of my blind testing, average price for those tubes is $85-$90 each.

I would be shocked if Bill would sell that tube and friends have offered to buy my extras already.

 

[LoryWiv]

I have removed and replaced the solder in about 25 of those and would help out at no charge. Now that offer is not open to @bcowen since he is likely to back a truck up to my place with more Fotons than exist in Russia but I will certainly help out on occasion.

I have also posted photos in the past of step by step tube pin soldering if you would like me to walk you through that.

I have taught soldering as well as electronics as well as having a few decades experience so I might have the credentials to help with such things.

You are gracious to offer @Paladin79. if I could figure out which of my ten thumbs to hold the solder gun with I could give it a try. Thankfully my profession requires my brain more than my dexterity. I'm hunting Melz 1578 or VT231 options and if I go with the former may give you a shout. Thanks again, gentlemen!

 

[Paladin79]

You are gracious to offer @Paladin79. if I could figure out which of my ten thumbs to hold the solder gun with I could give it a try. Thankfully my profession requires my brain more than my dexterity. I'm hunting Melz 1578 or VT231 options and if I go with the former may give you a shout. Thanks again, gentlemen!

I have to use my brain as well but I like challenges and right now I am learning woodworking and more metallurgy.

 

[thomaskong78]

You are gracious to offer @Paladin79. if I could figure out which of my ten thumbs to hold the solder gun with I could give it a try. Thankfully my profession requires my brain more than my dexterity. I'm hunting Melz 1578 or VT231 options and if I go with the former may give you a shout. Thanks again, gentlemen!

If you want to go for VT231, i may sell a pair at nice price either Kenrad or RCA vt231 at excellent condition.

I had amassed three pairs of KR and RCA but may not need that many after getting three pairs of 1578.

If you are interested, pm me.

 

[bcowen]

Since I use pair of 6sn7 in LM508 and quad 6sn7 in Freya, i consider ordering more 1578.

Just out of curiosity, i also had ordered cheap 6n8s tubes for comparison.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/QUAD-FOUR-Matched-Balanced-Russian-6N8S-6SN7-double-triode-TUBE-NEW-NOS/312402083888?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

I do not expect them to be as good as 1578.

Not to dis on your purchase, but those appear to be '70's manufacture which while not bad by any means are not nearly as good as the '50's. Hard to beat the price on these '58's while this seller still has some. Still won't be as good as the Melz 1578, but sound very nice period, and especially for the money (IMO).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/6SN7-6N8S-...645882?hash=item23cc316a3a:g:zcMAAOSwY9pd3OhS

I've bought several different times from this seller and had good experiences each time. FWIW.