[883dave]

Quote:

Originally Posted by xnor /img/forum/go_quote.gif It sure does matter and really hurts some people's wallet. Money that should have been spent on other things..

Another good soul trying to save to kiddies.

Imagine the harmony in the world if everyone would simply listen to other peoples reason and advise, and just stop experimenting and experiencing life for themselves.

 

[aimlink]

Quote:

Originally Posted by omigawsh_lollercoaster /img/forum/go_quote.gif It's a question, not support, I said I don't know the answer as I have already repeated. Apparently this is the thread for people who want to argue, I'm not here for that, I have better things to do than argue about unimportant controversies with people I don't know. Here's a site you might love: Argue With Everyone Political Forums

Oh hush. Don't be so sensitive. I see you don't like being challenged. If you wish not to discuss further, then say so or say nothing. But don't make it out to be an argument when it isn't.

 

[haloxt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by omigawsh_lollercoaster /img/forum/go_quote.gif It was a hypothetical question.

What is this thing called hypothetical question? Where is your proof?

 

[xnor]

Quote:

Originally Posted by omigawsh_lollercoaster /img/forum/go_quote.gif It was a hypothetical question. Your components are powered internally by raw AC? Thanks for the education.

I know, I know.
My fault, I was talking about (headphone) cables, should have been more specific.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 883dave /img/forum/go_quote.gif Imagine the harmony in the world if everyone would simply listen to other peoples reason and advise, and just stop experimenting and experiencing life for themselves.

I don't know how this has something to do with what I wrote...

 

[b0dhi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 883dave /img/forum/go_quote.gif Another good soul trying to save to kiddies. Imagine the harmony in the world if everyone would simply listen to other peoples reason and advise, and just stop experimenting and experiencing life for themselves.

Nipped it in the bud there methinks

 

[Shike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 883dave /img/forum/go_quote.gif Another good soul trying to save to kiddies. Imagine the harmony in the world if everyone would simply listen to other peoples reason and advise, and just stop experimenting and experiencing life for themselves.

Judging by the tone and your equipment this is sarcasm. I'm treating it as such.

Sometimes knowledge, reason, and advice should be considered for good reasons. Saying it shouldn't is like spitting in the face of your parents for keeping you alive. As a child, I'm sure many of us had done pretty stupid things. Could you imagine what it would be like if no-one had taught you? Would you still be in one piece on the right side of the grass today?

Like many hobbies, this is based on compulsory buying and habitual spending for a large portion of users here. While many are able to support it, there's just as many or more who can't. Saying it can't cause harm is ignorant at best and immoral at worst. Any hobby, especially ones that uses this much money (gambling comes to mind), can be dangerous to one's well being and future. Not to mention those they are around. ANYTHING can be abused.

That's all I'm going to say about it. Whether you believe cables or tweaks make a difference I don't care as that's besides the point in this context.

 

[aimlink]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shike;6060604 Like many hobbies, this is based on compulsory buying and habitual spending for a large portion of users here. While many are able to support it, there's just as many or more who can't. Saying it can't cause harm is ignorant at best and immoral at worst. Any hobby, especially ones that uses this much money (gambling comes to mind), can be dangerous to one's well being and future. Not to mention those they are around. [I ANYTHING can be abused. That's all I'm going to say about it. Whether you believe cables or tweaks make a difference I don't care as that's besides the point in this context.[/i]

IMO, as with most issues as these, there are always two extremes with the correct approach being somewhere down the middle.

So all in all, while I'm willing to listen to and read the wisdom of those with more experience than myself on these HeadFi matters, I do value the results of my own personal experience. There are some issues that I'd prefer getting advice on, while there are issues that I'd prefer making up my own mind through my own experience. Afterall, for so many issues head-fi, only *your* ears and not someone else is that's the real deciding factor for what *you* will do.

Taking too much advice can lead to confusion and a waste of money just as much as not taking useful advice when relevant and useful.

 

[883dave]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shike /img/forum/go_quote.gif Judging by the tone and your equipment this is sarcasm. I'm treating it as such.

Good call! (more sarcasm)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shike /img/forum/go_quote.gif Sometimes knowledge, reason, and advice should be considered for good reasons. Saying it shouldn't is like spitting in the face of your parents for keeping you alive. As a child, I'm sure many of us had done pretty stupid things. Could you imagine what it would be like if no-one had taught you? Would you still be in one piece on the right side of the grass today?

As for burn in...either way it is free.

Did you listen and follow through on everything your parents said? Do you ever speed in your car? Do you ever swear? Do you ever J walk?. Do you ever burp in public? Did you have pre-marital sex?

Yes listening to advise is a good idea, however a majority of audiophiles advise to try different cables (some even add the caveat "Cables are the last upgrade that you should make to your system, after you are comfortable with the major components), so what can we gleen from this? should we rush out and heed their advise?

Why is it that some people expect us to adhear to their advise and reason when they don't have any experienced knowledge in what they are advising? (would you take advise from virgin sexual therapist, who has an alphabet of diploma's and doctorates after their name?)

Can you imagine what it would be like if you lived blindly by every piece of advise you were given from people who were so sure that only their beliefs and advise are right?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shike /img/forum/go_quote.gif Like many hobbies, this is based on compulsory buying and habitual spending for a large portion of users here. While many are able to support it, there's just as many or more who can't. Saying it can't cause harm is ignorant at best and immoral at worst. Any hobby, especially ones that uses this much money (gambling comes to mind), can be dangerous to one's well being and future. Not to mention those they are around. ANYTHING can be abused.

Wow the above statement from someone who has 7 ear transducers, sort of like telling someone not to smoke while waving a cigarette in their face.

People will do as they please, if you want to save people from this hobby, why not preach to them to get out?

 

[Shike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 883dave /img/forum/go_quote.gif Good call! (more sarcasm)

Grow up.

Quote:

As for burn in...either way it is free.

The cables and tweaks you preach to burn in are not.

Quote:

Did you listen and follow through on everything your parents said? Do you ever speed in your car? Do you ever swear? Do you ever J walk?. Do you ever burp in public? Did you have pre-marital sex?

That's not the point and you know it. Do you listen when someone tells you to binge drink and drive?

Generally speaking, you should be able to tell good advice from bad advice. Someone that's telling you to blow money on something with no better proof than what they claim to hear, or someone who's telling you based on science with empirical proof that your wallet need not be pulled out.

Quote:

Yes listening to advise is a good idea, however a majority of audiophiles advise to try different cables (some even add the caveat "Cables are the last upgrade that you should make to your system, after you are comfortable with the major components), so what can we gleen from this? should we rush out and heed their advise?

It depends. Is it backed up by the scientific community? Is there reason to believe I will hear a difference, do I have the money to support them, etc?

When someone tells me to spend my money regardless I feel I should be skeptical.

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Why is it that some people expect us to adhear to their advise and reason when they don't have any experienced knowledge in what they are advising?

Why are we expected to buy into some voodoo without proof?

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Can you imagine what it would be like if you lived blindly by every piece of advise you were given from people who were so sure that only their beliefs and advise are right?

Yes, but that doesn't mean you can ignore every piece of advice your whole life.


Quote:

Wow the above statement from someone who has 7 ear transducers, sort of like telling someone not to smoke while waving a cigarette in their face.

You act as if you know my lifestyle and where those transducers currently are.

AKG K601 - ones I'm currently using
Stax SR-5 - in pieces, probably going to be sold to someone wanting to fix them.
Stax SR-40 - my mom uses these
Grado SR-60 - my dad uses these
Sennheiser HD202 - my dad has them for flights
Ultimate Ears Super.fi 3 - what I use for commutes
JVC Flats - what I use in bed.

If my parents ever decide they don't need them they will end up for sale immediately. You don't know me and you don't know my gear usage, so don't act like it.

Quote:

People will do as they please, if you want to save people from this hobby, why not preach to them to get out?

Some abuse it, some don't.

 

[kwkarth]

Let's play nice kids. Just a reminder.

 

[883dave]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shike /img/forum/go_quote.gif ...

You miss the point.

This is a hobby of the senses and personal experiences, not what science or someone else tells us we can or should and can not hear.

There are two sides, one is to listen to people who believe that if it can't be proven it can't be real. The other people who try, and make up their own minds as to what they like.

Personally I advocate having the chance to formulate my own impressions.

Why is it that when this is stated some people automatically assume they are being told to go out and spend money?

 

[Shike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 883dave /img/forum/go_quote.gif You miss the point.

Hardly.

Quote:

This is a hobby of the senses and personal experiences, not what science or someone else tells us we can or should and can not hear.

That's not true. When you go buy an "audiophile" transducer, cable, or tweak you are in fact being told by a commercial entity that depends on sales what you should "hear". The difference between it and the scientific community is that one is a conflict of interest.

Quote:

Personally I advocate having the chance to formulate my own impressions. Why is it that when this is stated some people automatically assume they are being told to go out and spend money?

Very simple. The pro-cable movement is based upon "if you haven't bought and tried a cable how do you know it's not real"? That would be the same argument as trying to make people reinvent the wheel, derive well known math formulas, or jumping off a cliff to prove gravity still exists.

 

[kwkarth]

Shike,
You are entitled to your opinions, as are others. Remember, that your opinion is just that, your opinion.

This thread is going in circles again, and as such, I will close it very soon unless someone can bring up something new.

 

[Shike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwkarth /img/forum/go_quote.gif Shike, You are entitled to your opinions, as are others. Remember, that your opinion is just that, your opinion.

It depends on the opinion. There are some opinions that are wrong, because they can be proven wrong. "In my opinion this cable makes a difference", but there's proof that shows the contrary. Considering that, the opinion is considered wrong factually. "In my opinion blue is the best color" is something that cannot be proven nor disproved and as such is a valid opinion. For some reason people believe perception is an excuse to hold any opinion they want. It's not and never has been. I don't coddle such notions and have no reason to.

It's not like I've insulted anyone here or broke any rules, so I don't know why my actions seem to be bothering you so much.

 

[haloxt]

Cable debates are good and should always be encouraged. We should just change the name of the sound science forum to cable debate forum. It keeps people busy so they don't discuss touchy topics like politics.

Also, green is the best color, a fact which can be verified empirically.