The discovery thread!
May 16, 2024 at 2:07 PM Post #101,776 of 103,954
Here is the thing: you can get 80 or even 90% at much lower costs, and no one asks you (I’m not saying “You” in an aggressive finger pointing way, but just you like a generic term, like “you) to spend this much. If anyone says you need to spend this much to get a good sound, either they are very picky or more likely they are elitists who are full of 💩.

What’s special about this IEM and its peer? It’s the getting last 10%. People tend to forget that to provide the last 10%, and IEM needs to pass the first 90% first, thus if you have been listening and hunting IEMs for a long time, whenever that 10% appears, it’s something noteworthy and even worthy to chase.

Back to the Anni:
  • “Disappearing” tonal balance but not flat or bland. Same comment that I had for Crimson. To me (and just to me), the EA1000 has the upper mid sticking out. The Trio seesaws between too thick and too thin. The Project ACE is kinda strange at 6k. The list goes on and on. Heck, even the U12t is kinda weird at 12kHz.
  • Hyped up dynamic, which is likely an artefact of tuning.
  • Details, especially in the reverb tail of the notes. But the foreground details like the texture in the voices also comes through clearly. Better than EA1000 and likes? Of course. Better than U12t? Don’t know, need to test.
  • Spatial information, particularly the background elements. It’s like the virtual “room” in your head expands and have a 3D shape. The EA1000 does not do this, but it has its own trick that makes it sounds “out of the head” sometimes.
Hm, I have added this post to the ones I want to quote a while back now already, so I'm honestly unsure what the context was and what I was meaning to reply... God dang dementia hitting at 27 already! Great post nonetheless, so I decided to keep it in my quotes even if I have nothing to add lol.

I don't think IEMs tuned to the Shrek Target Curve would sound very good.

1715381490175.png
Haha this is absolute comedy gold 🥇 and I never realized Shrek was ~22kHz tall (and 120dB fat) before now!

Spent my lunch and an hour post work shift with the Aur Aures, and damn, these things are so GOOOOOOOOOOOOOD!!! A more refined Trio with better bass and light years better mids. Similar treble. Similar special sauce stage and imaging. Easily my best set from pretty much every metric EXCEPT air and treble extension, but it's not bad. It's just smoother than what I typically prefer, but they are technical enough to handle any genre with aplomb.
YES! Give me all of the enthusiasm on the Aure and then some and you still won't be able to describe just how marvelous these are to my ears.

Bone conduction transducers might be the future of the hobby. I know they are existing BC hybrid IEMs or even pure BC headsets, but I feel the tech isn't totally refined as of 2024.

Basically, on a normal day to day basis, humans hear via both air conduction (AC) and to a lesser extent, bone conduction (BC).

366025919_680387250643391_2482407960862400166_n.jpg

AC is the usual route we hear (red path above) - as its name suggests, sound waves travel thru the air, and the outer ear funnels these to the middle ear and thru the eardrums, into the inner ear nerves, which are converted to electrical signals to the brain.

BC (orange path) is the alternative route, whereby sound is transmitted thru vibrations along the skull or jaw bone. They bypass the outer/middle ear and eardrums, and directly go to the inner ear nerves. For example, BC is in play when you cover your ears and you speak; you can still hear words, because sound goes thru the skull bones to the inner ear.

BC tech has actually been around for centuries. The famed composer Beethoven lost his hearing (possibly from Menierre's disease or lead poisoning), and his livelihood would have been affected should he not be able to compose or hear music. He used a creative DIY fix by sticking a rod to his piano, and clenched it in his jaw, thereby using BC to hear transmitted sounds.

Currently, BC has widespread use in hearing aids for folks who have conductive hearing loss or tinnitus, to bypass the eardrums, and are also used in the military (BC headsets can transmit commands, but still allow soldiers be situationally aware through AC). Some sports enthusiasts use BC sets for situational awareness while cycling around for example.

BC has disadvantages in isolation (and hence sub-bass), and the sound isn't as refined as pure AC wired stuff as of this year. BC tech is still in its early stages, and who knows, maybe give it a few years and the technology will get more refined and useful to audiophiles.
You, Sir, are the MVP (Most Valuable Poster) of this thread with your amazingly educational, widely varied, and easy to read posts. An honest Thank You is all I can offer.

Please, I mean no disrespect to many of you other guys who take this hobby just as seriously and contribute (almost) as much as this absolute specimen called Baskingshark! You are All greatly appreciated!

Just to clear that up.No, Bone Conduction sound transmission works of course quite well when you do it right. We make some serious money with it.. but one of our products indeed involves drilling into the skull in, of course, a surgical procedure:scream::skull:, and another one you can actually stick behind the concha on the mastoid without any gore involved, but OPL is limited with this one already.
And that brings me to my rather devastating conclusion/estimation on BC enabled IEMs. I do think if you add a vibratory unit into an IEM shell, it just cannot transmit enough vibratory energy to hear something with it. There might be a tactile sensation you can feel when the shell is vibrating, but that's not Bone Conduction sound, it's just the nerves in your skin which let you feel vibration, nothing more.
So, it's the realization of how some IEM manufacturers want to incorporate BC inside an IEM. It just won't work well.
Come to think of it, since these vibrations clearly affect the IEM itself as well, just how much does that translate into the sound reproduction of all other drivers in a negative manner and how does it affect their longevity. Surely, having something vibrating all the time cannot be too beneficial in that aspect. I fully acknowledge I might be talking crazy here, not sure?
 
May 16, 2024 at 2:14 PM Post #101,777 of 103,954
Can anyone compare some of these iems to each other?

-Sa6 Mk2
-Variations
-Monarch Mk2/Mk3
-Ie600
-Fiio Fh9/Fx15
-Mangird Top
Nothing, and I mean Nothing, beats the FX15. Done.

Ignore my utterly worthless first sentence unless you know who I'm impersonating.

I won't be of much help, since I have only heard the Variations briefly and owned the IE600 for a while. Between these two, I'd say the IE600 sounded much more natural with impeccable timbre and impressive bass overall. Fit is second to none, but in turn, do not expect much noise isolation.
 
May 16, 2024 at 2:15 PM Post #101,778 of 103,954
May 16, 2024 at 2:24 PM Post #101,779 of 103,954
The amount of IEMs being turned out these days is staggering, can hardly keep up, but I’m all for it. We’re bound to find a winner.
Such a good point. When will the market be over saturated to the point where people lose interest? I believe it's already past the point of over saturation, but I know there's also a group of folks who look forward to literally every release. The way I see it, nearly every company releases good to great IEMs right now. Internet forums and constant review samples being thrown around are definitely the main culprit here. If you have a sub par release, everyone will know about it, and you’ll be screwed for sure.

I just wonder when the glass will overflow and the market slows down - maybe a year or two from now? We shall see.
 
May 16, 2024 at 2:30 PM Post #101,780 of 103,954
Such a good point. When will the market be over saturated to the point where people lose interest? I believe it's already past the point of over saturation, but I know there's also a group of folks who look forward to literally every release. The way I see it, nearly every company releases good to great IEMs right now. Internet forums and constant review samples being thrown around are definitely the main culprit here. If you have a sub par release, everyone will know about it, and you’ll be screwed for sure.

I just wonder when the glass will overflow and the market slows down - maybe a year or two from now? We shall see.
It's tough. But different tunings and fit for different people. Also different prices for different people. It's a wild market, that doesn't make a ton of sense, but in a way it does. Like some people won't use KZ, some will only use KZ. Most mainstream people don't care about the KZ drama, some in the hobby hate them so much and have been burned. It's wild.
 
May 16, 2024 at 2:30 PM Post #101,781 of 103,954
Such a good point. When will the market be over saturated to the point where people lose interest? I believe it's already past the point of over saturation, but I know there's also a group of folks who look forward to literally every release. The way I see it, nearly every company releases good to great IEMs right now. Internet forums and constant review samples being thrown around are definitely the main culprit here. If you have a sub par release, everyone will know about it, and you’ll be screwed for sure.

I just wonder when the glass will overflow and the market slows down - maybe a year or two from now? We shall see.
i think much like cell phone tech of yesteryear, the technology behind IEMs is still growing exponentially every 6 months... i think interest will be high as long as that innovation keeps going.

Things like Bone conduction, xMEMS, budget sets from high end brands (pilgrim), planars drivers etc, are still very much in their infancy.... I think we have a ways to go before the bottom drops out.
 
May 16, 2024 at 2:35 PM Post #101,782 of 103,954
I paid my hard earned cash on this one, so i'll give my completely unbiased opinion. Not a bought opinion. Should be arriving by next week with a flurry of other IEMs all at once? All KZ/CCA.
 
May 16, 2024 at 2:53 PM Post #101,783 of 103,954
Such a good point. When will the market be over saturated to the point where people lose interest? I believe it's already past the point of over saturation, but I know there's also a group of folks who look forward to literally every release. The way I see it, nearly every company releases good to great IEMs right now. Internet forums and constant review samples being thrown around are definitely the main culprit here. If you have a sub par release, everyone will know about it, and you’ll be screwed for sure.

I just wonder when the glass will overflow and the market slows down - maybe a year or two from now? We shall see.
The carousel won't stop because we don't get off the ride. How many of us have gotten too many $20 IEMs (or $50, or $100 or $200 etc.), don't have time to listen to all the sets we already have, but then get seduced into trying the next hyped set or set with a graph we can't resist?

We don't stop consuming all the new shinies, regardless of the fact that the redundancies in releases are mind-boggling. The market is "oversaturated" with supply, and yet demand keeps going up and we buy the sets and keep the industry grinding along. It's us, not the IEM makers
 
May 16, 2024 at 3:09 PM Post #101,784 of 103,954
Thank you very much for the explanation!

Now, as a result, I find their choice even more perplexing. Previously, the nylon filters were "shielded" by the metal grills, protecting them from both physical damage and dirt (such as earwax, sweat, and dust). However, now they are practically a magnet for both, and this compromise overall durability. The more I think about the reasons behind this choice from KZ, the more nothing comes to mind other than an oversight or an attempt to cutting corners.

I sincerely hope they come up with an alternative solution, because I think this easily fixable issue in their otherwise well-crafted IEMs - at least for me - cheapen the experience.
You love a set, and the filter fails and you don't know how to replace it, then you might be inclined to DOUBLE DIP?? More money for them.
 
May 16, 2024 at 3:11 PM Post #101,785 of 103,954
The amount of IEMs being turned out these days is staggering, can hardly keep up, but I’m all for it. We’re bound to find a winner.
It's the ultimate chase for that elusive "unicorn" that will change the fortunes of these businessmen i.e. see TinHifi or Blon. :fingers_crossed::fingers_crossed:
 
May 16, 2024 at 3:16 PM Post #101,786 of 103,954
It's the ultimate chase for that elusive "unicorn" that will change the fortunes of these businessmen i.e. see TinHifi or Blon. :fingers_crossed::fingers_crossed:
Yes.. But let me say this... I don't know how it is in your respective countries, but iems are absolute rarity where I live. They still do airpods, galaxy buds, Bose, beats etc... and ofcourse headphones...Only people I know personally who have iems are the ones that I have gifted cheapies or snatched from me.

Only one random stranger I have seen with an iem as in who approached me and wanted to know what i am wearing. And ex headfi or reddit guy as he told me to stay away from these "iem forums" if I don't want to burn money. Wise guy!

With wired phones slotsout of business, iems are pretty damn rare actually. So I don't think market is saturating etc - from where I am placed .
 
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May 16, 2024 at 3:16 PM Post #101,787 of 103,954
Can anyone compare some of these iems to each other?

-Sa6 Mk2
-Variations
-Monarch Mk2/Mk3
-Ie600
-Fiio Fh9/Fx15
-Mangird Top
I only had the IE600. IMHO, highly overrated. Stellar bass response and resolving low end, but that's about it. Stage and imaging are nothing to write home about, and the top end resolution is average at best. I sold my set the day after I received my CCA Trio, and haven't regretted it one second.
 
May 16, 2024 at 3:17 PM Post #101,788 of 103,954
I think the first one to talk about them here was @Redcarmoose. I recently submitted my review of them and I agree that they are a set to enjoy. They are my quick choice when I take the V3 out on the road.
Three positive reviews is a trend!!

Cheers!
 
May 16, 2024 at 3:24 PM Post #101,789 of 103,954
Hm, I have added this post to the ones I want to quote a while back now already, so I'm honestly unsure what the context was and what I was meaning to reply... God dang dementia hitting at 27 already! Great post nonetheless, so I decided to keep it in my quotes even if I have nothing to add lol.


Haha this is absolute comedy gold 🥇 and I never realized Shrek was ~22kHz tall (and 120dB fat) before now!


YES! Give me all of the enthusiasm on the Aure and then some and you still won't be able to describe just how marvelous these are to my ears.


You, Sir, are the MVP (Most Valuable Poster) of this thread with your amazingly educational, widely varied, and easy to read posts. An honest Thank You is all I can offer.

Please, I mean no disrespect to many of you other guys who take this hobby just as seriously and contribute (almost) as much as this absolute specimen called Baskingshark! You are All greatly appreciated!


Come to think of it, since these vibrations clearly affect the IEM itself as well, just how much does that translate into the sound reproduction of all other drivers in a negative manner and how does it affect their longevity. Surely, having something vibrating all the time cannot be too beneficial in that aspect. I fully acknowledge I might be talking crazy here, not sure?
He was responding to my comment about with all the budget and midfi winners and improved tech we've experienced in this hobby lately, it seems pretty insane to spend kilobuck money for something to just squeeze out that last 5-10% if that (genesis said 20%, but I don't believe the separation is that great). That money could just as easily be diverted to invest in killer DAP/DAC and other great gear in the sound chain to possibly move that % even smaller, but I know genesis wasn't being disrespectful or combative, and he has many good points, and I did say that if you got the money to spend on that level of gear, then by all means! More power to you! You're a winner in life.
 
May 16, 2024 at 3:30 PM Post #101,790 of 103,954
Such a good point. When will the market be over saturated to the point where people lose interest? I believe it's already past the point of over saturation, but I know there's also a group of folks who look forward to literally every release. The way I see it, nearly every company releases good to great IEMs right now. Internet forums and constant review samples being thrown around are definitely the main culprit here. If you have a sub par release, everyone will know about it, and you’ll be screwed for sure.

I just wonder when the glass will overflow and the market slows down - maybe a year or two from now? We shall see.
Yeah. I dunno? I figured by now, the market would have been undone by TWS, since the mainstream is TWS. It's the main source used by music listeners on the bus, train, supermarket, and street. So that the wired market is still seemingly "healthy" despite the oversaturation, is beyond me.
 

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