Argo Duck
Formerly known as "AiDee"
- Joined
- Nov 6, 2007
- Posts
- 2,245
- Likes
- 433
V-Duh, great table!
I was very surprised when Frank Iaccone and later Eric (longbowbbs) used the Taboo III (very successfully I would add) with the Senn HD800! Yet, such phones were not its intended application. IMHO it is simply not fair to rate a piece of equipment on applications outside its design envelope.
However, it would seem Steve hasn't said to you 'you should not use this amp with the HD800'. That in itself would seem to indicate de facto acceptance on Steve's part of how the market is using his product. Nevertheless, should we be surprised if problems arise with phones other than those for which the amp was designed?
Ok, if we're talking about the Taboo mk III, Steve's thread about the how and why he decided to design a new Taboo (see here) makes its target headphones crystal clear. In his own words: "the new TABOO amp...was re-designed to be the best sounding amplifier for the LCD-2's and similar headphones.". I'm not sure what you mean by "Decware didn't test their amps with more headphones" but I think as a reviewer you need to be aware of the Taboo's intended application and you will find that thread interesting background information too. (You can find the information about what phones the Taboo III was designed for in the Decware marketing as well).
For other headphones, the CSP2 (now 3) has always been recommended.
I was very surprised when Frank Iaccone and later Eric (longbowbbs) used the Taboo III (very successfully I would add) with the Senn HD800! Yet, such phones were not its intended application. IMHO it is simply not fair to rate a piece of equipment on applications outside its design envelope.
However, it would seem Steve hasn't said to you 'you should not use this amp with the HD800'. That in itself would seem to indicate de facto acceptance on Steve's part of how the market is using his product. Nevertheless, should we be surprised if problems arise with phones other than those for which the amp was designed?
Which I guess begs the obvious question: Dan, have you encountered these problems with your LCD3/LCDX? (Apologies if you've already addressed this - my following of head-fi is highly fragmented these days!)
Dan,
I'm afraid I have virtually the same problem. I received my amp last April but did not notice a problem until this fall because I was only using my Senn HD600 and AKG 702. I tried my Grados in mid-November as someone mentioned decent synergy and I was immediately faced with a significant hum and a weird fluctuating static/wooshing sound primarily in the left channel. I assumed EMI and planned to track it down when I had time. Meanwhile I received my LCD-X, plugged it in and "AACK! This kinda sucks." Eventually I had time to try a bunch of things and all my cans resulting in the development of the table below. It appears to be very similar to your experience. I sent this information to Steve and his initial impression is there may be a grounding problem resulting from shipping. I will be sending my amp to him for diagnosis once I can get out from under all the holiday responsibilities. I will report on any findings.
I was very surprised when Frank Iaccone and later Eric (longbowbbs) used the Taboo III (very successfully I would add) with the Senn HD800! Yet, such phones were not its intended application. IMHO it is simply not fair to rate a piece of equipment on applications outside its design envelope.
Dan, fair points, except I think by "LCD2's and similar" Steve meant orthos in general (but not the HE6), not the LCD2 in particular. I guess the point about Decware power amps is they were designed to be speaker amps. Then Skylab (with the Mini-Torii) and Frank I (the Taboo) asked for speaker jacks and suddenly they were hp amps too. I suppose one might now debate the wisdom of this move without having specifically tested and designed for headphones.
OTOH, the long-time pre-amp and hp-amp the CSP2 and 3 seem to have been more generally successful and robust.
WNBC, absolutely fair point. What you quoted is impossible to dispute!
Eric, thanks for that piece of history. I frankly couldn't remember whether it was you or Frank who tried the HD800 first. Clearly it was you, and equally clearly Steve was happy to see the Mk III used this way.
Well, we've been here before., e.g. questions over QA (sigh). Decware is a small company with a hugely talented, creative designer. Unfortunately, it's not a company with resource to test product reliability over widely varying conditions. I'm not blaming those of you who may have these hypothetical problem conditions, merely speculating about why there may be a design flaw which the company's normal development, testing and QA hasn't revealed. Unfortunately, such things happen. Even in well-resourced companies.
It's easy for those like me who are problem-free to stand on the sidelines, scratch our heads and say "but these products are great!". I feel for you guys
I did in fact design the Taboo MK III for the LCD2 and LCD3 headphones. These hard to drive planar headphones deserved a purpose built amplifier because of both their fidelity and popularity.
We already make a great OTL headphone amplifier/preamp that is ideal for use with regular headphones. (CSP3) And there was no LCDX at that time.
In my writing about the Taboo MK III and new lucid mode, I made it pretty clear that the effect is tied to impedance. The LCD's were in the 50-70 ohm range where new lucid mode was carefully voiced. On speakers or other headphones the new lucid mode would be exaggerated or reduced from that ideal.
That said, many people use the Taboo MK III on a variety of different headphones and I’m fine with that so long as the above is understood regarding the new lucid mode.
I will be adding a custom option to the shopping cart for the Taboo MK III that will allow the buyer to select from standard gain and low gain. Low gain being for more efficient non-targeted headphones. If 4 pin jacks are selected we could make one high output and one low output as well.
This could technically be done externally if the right resistors were used.
Mouser # 71-CW005150R0JE73 which is a 150 ohm exactly matches what’s on the inside. You could go as high a 1K with some phones or IEMs.
As for hum on one channel only:
Since the internal layout is not perfectly symmetrical, the noise floor is going to be louder on one side over the other. This is true of most audio gear, once you magnify the noise floor. Even if both sides were exactly the same layout, differences in tubes would be heard, so the real issue is hearing the noise floor at all. With 1700 Miliwatts of output, anyone hearing hum has more than enough volume left on the dial to hurt themselves. That means that for headphones that you hear hum with, there is too much gain or power. Reducing it will give you more usable range on the volume control and reduce the hum by an equal amount.
Hope this helps!
Steve Deckert
Dan, if your unit is less than 30 days old, Steve will pay shipping both ways.[/quote][quote
I had Mullard EL84's with a Genalex Gold Lion 6922 and a USAF-596 for the Taboo. The CSP2+ had the stock 6N1P and a pair of Genalex Gold Lion's with another USAF-596. Loved it.