[k3oxkjo]

[size=medium]The AKG 3003 stands as one of the most expensive Universal IEM’s available and has therefore been the target of no little derision in some circles. Why spend $1300 on a Universal when you can get a Custom, many sniff. Well, there is nothing in a Custom that a priori guaranties better sound, just like in a Universal the skill of the designer and the quality of ingredients determine that.[/size]
 
[size=medium]I have a reasonable assortment of higher tier Universal IEM’s including the Sony MDR-EX1000, the ER4-P, the CK-10, the EQ-7, Final Heaven S (FI-BA-SB) and Final FI-DC1601SB[/size] and have owned IE-8, Shure 530, MDR-EX600.  I have also heard but not owned the JH-3A and JH-13 universals. I have also owned some high end full size phones such as the HD-800, Stax Lambda Pro’s, K-1000, Sony CD-3000 (I call them R-10 Juniors) AKG-701 and various others and have heard Sony R-10’s extensively (having a month loan a number of years ago) and many others over the years just to give some context. I have owned the AKG's for about 2 weeks and have come to some preliminary conclusions.
 
[size=medium]Obviously, for the money asked, the 3003 must perform at the top levels, at least of IEM’s. So let’s investigate. I used as comparisons in the formal listening tests the Sony MDR-1000 and Final DC1601 as these are, in my view, the best overall of what I have.[/size]
 
[size=medium]Listening notes:[/size]
[size=medium]British Band Classics – Mercury Living Presence – Fennell, ESWE[/size]
 
[size=medium]EX-1000 - Decent presentation, noticeable upper mid emphasis and a bit bright at the top. Typical IEM soundstage.[/size]
 
[size=medium]DC1601 - Blunted at extreme top with noticeable midrange emphasis. Less flat in response, but more dynamic and open with a soundstage presentation more “out of the head” than the Sony’s. Handles dynamic peaks significantly better. A bit less low bass, but a bit better midbass.[/size]
 
[size=medium]3003 - Best detail with less of the 1000’s treble peak but without the top end dullness of the Final’s. Better overall foundation in the bass and more clear and open. Dynamics at least as good as the Final’s. Best at low level info and holds together best at the dynamic peaks. [/size]
 
[size=medium]Farewell, Farewell – Fairport Convention[/size]
 
[size=medium]EX-1000 – More very high treble, but a bit recessed on Sandy Denny’s vocals. Bass OK. Lack of separation of instruments (at least in comparison to the others tested). [/size]
 
[size=medium]DC1601 – A bit more recessed vocal and bit rougher sounding on the voice (only a little). Drums not bad, good over all detail (especially considering the somewhat subdued treble).[/size]
 
[size=medium]3003 – Beautiful vocal, very ethereal, typical of Denny’s voice. Wonderful detail, very clear and open with a better musical foundation provided by the bass without being overblown or shadowing the rest of the spectrum in any way. Very impressive.[/size]
 
[size=medium]Beethoven Piano Sonata #8 – Moravec – VAI music[/size]
 
[size=medium]EX-1000 – A bit “tinkly” in treble. Well balanced overall, but not as pure sounding  on the notes and a bit of blurring in fast passages.[/size]
 
[size=medium]DC1601 – Treble recess more noticeable here and the less flat overall response is more noticeable on the solo piano. But the notes are well separated and loud passages have more power and impact than the Sony. Less accurate, but more exciting.[/size]
 
[size=medium]3003 – Best dynamics, and best balanced sound. Piano sounds very coherent through its range and excellently dynamic. Hall sound comes through best of all. Personal note, I only listened through this piece halfway to save time between IEM changes, I didn’t want to stop listening to this one when I reached that point![/size]
 
[size=medium]Search and Destroy – The Stooges[/size]
 
[size=medium]EX-1000 – A bit acid-y sounding on guitar and vocal peaks, did OK overall on this less than subtle, compressed recording.[/size]
 
[size=medium]DC1601 – Focus on mids and recessed treble actually beneficial on this recording. But a bit of shortfall on the voice. Handles the louder level better than the 1000.[/size]
 
[size=medium]3003 – Better balance allowed this admittedly mediocre recording to make its best impression. Easier to hear what details are there in the mix. Best balance of excitement and tonal balance.[/size]
 
[size=medium]Bizet – Carmen Fantasy – Ricci – Gamba - LSO[/size]
 
[size=medium]EX-1000 – A nice match for this recording overall. Violin almost over the top, but not quite. [/size]
 
[size=medium]DC1601 – Bigger orchestral soundstage than the EX-1000. The somewhat lackluster treble detracts a bit but the orchestral power comes through better.[/size]
 
[size=medium]3003 – Best, most atmospheric and balanced presentation with good orchestral size and spread. Only IEM that I noticed London’s subway system rumbling in the background at the end of the introduction. But still no bass bloat.[/size]
 
[size=medium]Overall impressions.[/size]
 
[size=medium]The EX-1000 is well loved overall as one of the better Universal IEM’s on the market, but I must somewhat reluctantly admit that the AKG 3003 outpoints it on almost all counts. Overall, it reminds me a bit of a Sennheiser HD-800 with a bit more bass foundation and a bit less treble peak but a less large soundstage and a bit less ability to stay composed on loud peaks. This strikes me as quite exemplary performance for a Universal IEM and probably for any IEM or portable headphone. My short exposure to the Universal versions of the JH-3A and the JH-13 lead me to believe the AKG is at least at that level. Would be nice to find out for sure![/size]
 
[size=medium]Is the K3003 worth the not inconsiderable price? If you want top rank performance and can reasonably swing the money without too much pain, I say yes![/size]
 
[size=medium]Best, Kevin[/size]

 

[bizkit]

Nice, you've just said what I've feeling for the last two months.

 

[k3oxkjo]

BTW, associated equipment for this test was the Cowan J3 and the RS Mustang P-51 portable amp.
 
And please forgive any glitches. misspeaks and misspells, I kind of knocked this out quickly...
 
Kevin

 

[Poetik]

I wonder how a low end custom would rate against the akg. You should send those iems off to joker so we can see how they really stack up to other iems

 

[applehead]

 
Quote:

I wonder how a low end custom would rate against the akg. You should send those iems off to joker so we can see how they really stack up to other iems

In terms of sound quality? The K3003 is definitely up there with even the more high end customs. I've compared it with a UM TF10x6 and couldn't really tell which one was better. It's also better than my 3-BA customs in terms of detail retrieval. My guess is that it'd be competitive with even the UERM. For that price, it better be. They're really good! My only gripe with the K3003 is that I wish it had a wider soundstage and sense of space (or airiness) in their presentation.

 

[TIMITS]

How do you find the build quality?  
 
I just cannot help but feel nervous about the cable not being detachable.  

 

[bizkit]

 
Quote:

I wonder how a low end custom would rate against the akg. You should send those iems off to joker so we can see how they really stack up to other iems

 
I'm already on it, I'm starting to compile some reviewers for a US demo tour with one of my sets of K3003s. It's time to get them out to some of Head-fi's trusted ears for a something a little better than a 20 minute audition.
 

 

[music_4321]

Quote:

 
And please forgive any glitches. misspeaks and misspells, I kind of knocked this out quickly...
 
Kevin

Thanks for what comes across as a fairly balanced review, though we may be hearing the EX1000s (relative to the K3003s) slightly differently .
 
Quote:

I wonder how a low end custom would rate against the akg. You should send those iems off to joker so we can see how they really stack up to other iems

We? While it cannot be denied that Joker certainly has experience and credibility, I don't see why he would have to have the last word when comparing the K3003 to other IEMs, custom or universal.

There have been several people --some with more experience and credibility that others-- who have already compared the K3003s to some high-end customs & universals. Your post seems to suggest/imply that it's not until Joker gives his verdict on the AKGs that "we" will "really" know how good/bad the K3003s are.

It is true that many people --specially (though not exclusively) less experienced members-- mostly rely on Joker's views when considering a purchase. However, there are other HF'ers, like me who, while still valuing Joker's contributions and impressions, sometimes value more the views of other members who may not be as popular and/or well-known as Joker but who, nevertheless, have got a very good pair of ears, plenty of experience and credibility.
 
 

 

[ysyung]

Very nice review! Me too, you've just said what I've feeling for the last two months!

 

[k3oxkjo]

Quote:

I wonder how a low end custom would rate against the akg. You should send those iems off to joker so we can see how they really stack up to other iems

There is no reason to expect a low end custom to rate with the AKG at all, I suspect (unless it is a real "outlier" and the ultimate sleeper...). Some high end customs are probably competitive, though.
 
I really admire what Joker has done, but don't find most of it relevant to my interests. At the risk of seeming an elitist somehow, I personally don't really care if the $27 Whoppiemobile 8 is better than the $39 Frammistan pro monitor. If you are beyond a newbie, I would suggest that something like the ER4P would be the baseline, to be interesting an IEM must be at least better than the baseline.
 
It would be interesting to see what Joker thinks, however. And I suspect he will get his chance at some point.
 
Best, Kevin
 

 
 

 

[Poetik]

Quote:

We? While it cannot be denied that Joker certainly has experience and credibility, I don't see why he would have to have the last word when comparing the K3003 to other IEMs, custom or universal.

There have been several people --some with more experience and credibility that others-- who have already compared the K3003s to some high-end customs & universals. Your post seems to suggest/imply that it's not until Joker gives his verdict on the AKGs that "we" will "really" know how good/bad the K3003s are.

It is true that many people --specially (though not exclusively) less experienced members-- mostly rely on Joker's views when considering a purchase. However, there are other HF'ers, like me who, while still valuing Joker's contributions and impressions, sometimes value more the views of other members who may not be as popular and/or well-known as Joker but who, nevertheless, have got a very good pair of ears, plenty of experience and credibility.

 
I think you blew my post out of proportion but it's nothing against the OP as I do respect his opinion on the iem, I'm just stating that while he has owned / heard higher end gear, it doesn't seem like he has "owned" a better iem than the akg's.  I like hearing the opinions of everyone who has heard an iem, especially one that is out of the price range of most people, but until you have a similar tier / higher tier iem to contrast against (which are customs, the OP even stated the jh audio iems himself), then how could you truly rate it fairly against other iems in the price range? 
 
Also bizkit, that's a great idea man and great job for being willing to let people hear and experience an iem like that.  Maybe I'm just biased because I feel that letting joker hear an iem would better benefit everyone on here.  I am in no way saying he is the end all master of iems but I bet no one on here knows anyone that has heard more iems and has as much experience as him.  I let him borrow my ie8's awhile back to review and would love to get more iems in his hands but unfortunately I do not own anything else that he hasn't already heard.   

 

[Poetik]

Quote:

There is no reason to expect a low end custom to rate with the AKG at all, I suspect (unless it is a real "outlier" and the ultimate sleeper...). Some high end customs are probably competitive, though.
 
I really admire what Joker has done, but don't find most of it relevant to my interests. At the risk of seeming an elitist somehow, I personally don't really care if the $27 Whoppiemobile 8 is better than the $39 Frammistan pro monitor. If you are beyond a newbie, I would suggest that something like the ER4P would be the baseline, to be interesting an IEM must be at least better than the baseline.
 
It would be interesting to see what Joker thinks, however. And I suspect he will get his chance at some point.
 
Best, Kevin

Haha it looks like music_4321 took my post the wrong way but you read it the way it was intended. It's just interesting to read that you feel that the akg's are that much better than other universals that they can rival customs.  My post was more of a, "I'm so excited to see how they compare with a custom" rather than a "omg this newb doesn't know what he is talking about" and I'm glad that you're mature enough to understand that.
 
Yea, I'm with you on only really reading jokers reviews on the higher tier universals and up too.  I don't think it's an elitist thing at all considering most of us have started out with $100+ iems in the first place.  At that point I think you're more concerned with how costlier iems stack up to your current ones, at least that's how I see it.
 

 

[music_4321]

 
My responses in blue.
 
Quote:

 
I think you blew my post out of proportion but it's nothing against the OP as I do respect his opinion on the iem, I'm just stating that while he has owned / heard higher end gear, it doesn't seem like he has "owned" a better iem than the akg's.
 
I never said you didn't respect the OP's opinions on the K3003s. The OP has, in fact, heard several (high-end) IEMs as well as james444, myself and other people whose posts/reviews are buried in the other AKG thread -- some of these people have not only heard but also own a similarly priced universal or custom IEM. Some of these people also have some experience with full-sized phones. Joker, BTW, doesn't own most of the phones he's reviewed, and if/when he gets to try the K3003s again --he did have a short listening session with them at CES 2012-- chances are he will not be purchasing a pair.
 
I like hearing the opinions of everyone who has heard an iem, especially one that is out of the price range of most people, but until you have a similar tier / higher tier iem to contrast against (which are customs, the OP even stated the jh audio iems himself), then how could you truly rate it fairly against other iems in the price range? 
 
You did not state the above in your first post -- you only stated: "I wonder how a low end custom would rate against the akg". The OP says he's heard the JH-3A and JH-13 universals (the JH-3A apparently, from all accounts so far, being "a clear step up" from just the JH13). I would imagine that some of the full-sized phones he's heard would rival, if not downright surpass, the JH13s & JH-3A he's tried.
 
Maybe I'm just biased because I feel that letting joker hear an iem would better benefit everyone on here.  I am in no way saying he is the end all master of iems but I bet no one on here knows anyone that has heard more iems and has as much experience as him.
 
Like I said, I do value Joker's contributions but, like all of us here, he also has his sound & music preferences. He, for instance, has said he tends to prefer/favour BA-based IEMs - nothing wrong with that, of course, but it's something to bear in mind when reading his reviews. His music preferences are: 85% Rock & Metal, 10% Electronica, 5% Other. Yes, probably a lot people are into the same sort of music he's into, but one also has to bear that in mind, specially if one tends to listen to other genres (too).

 
Quote:

Haha it looks like music_4321 took my post the wrong way but you read it the way it was intended... and I'm glad that [the OP is] mature enough to understand that.
 
It seems to me Kevin, the OP, took your post pretty much the way I did -- originally saying "I wonder how a low end custom would rate against the akg. You should send those iems off to joker so we can see how they really stack up to other iems", to me (and I think to the OP) says it all, or says a lot. I didn't know one had to be "mature enough" to understand your first post in this thread, and saying so seems rather condescending. Looks like you waited for the OP's response to that post to then reply to mine, but then stated things rather differently -- doesn't take much maturity to see that, I think.
 
Yea, I'm with you on only really reading jokers reviews on the higher tier universals and up too.  I don't think it's an elitist thing at all considering most of us have started out with $100+ iems in the first place.
 
I think most of us actually didn't even "start out with $100+ IEMs in the first place", but with (much) cheaper ones.