[kuma]

As I have been trying out the W2002 again, but this time with Naim Headline2, I found the results much better than my past experience.

Unfortunately, this is a borrowed pair from a friend.
What is the sonic difference, if any, between the two cans?

Does a W2002 pretty much summarise the AT's house sound?

 

[overlunge]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuma As I have been trying out the W2002 again, but this time with Naim Headline2, I found the results much better than my past experience. Unfortunately, this is a borrowed pair from a friend. What is the sonic difference, if any, between the two cans? Does a W2002 pretty much summarise the AT's house sound?

IMHO, W5000 is along the same line of W2002 in terms of overall presentations however they varies slightly in: [size=xx-small](following is based on personal experience)[/size]

Musicality (W2002>W5000),
Warmth (W2002>W5000)
Clarity (W5000>W2002),
Bass Quantity (Equal),
Bass Depth (W5000>2002),
PrAT (W500>W2002)

I have not had enough experience with the A and AD series to comment whether if the W2002 being the summary of the audio technica house sound. However, if you were looking for a good balance between two lines of ATH-W sound, ATH-W100 is a good starting point.

Overlunge

 

[kuma]

Thanks for your reply.

hmmm.. the plot thickens.

Whilst I thought W2002 was a slow can in the past, I don't particularly think it's slow with the Headline2.

I am not sure what you mean by the musicality and bass depth.
Can you clarify a bit?

Also, which amplifier and source did you use for both 'fones?

And if you also tried a K271s in the same rig, what's the different or similar to the W2002?

Sorry for all these questions, but I'm trying to find the commond ground here.

 

[GoRedwings19]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuma Thanks for your reply. hmmm.. the plot thickens. Whilst I thought W2002 was a slow can in the past, I don't particularly think it's slow with the Headline2. I am not sure what you mean by the musicality and bass depth. Can you clarify a bit? Also, which amplifier and source did you use for both 'fones? And if you also tried a K271s in the same rig, what's the different or similar to the W2002? Sorry for all these questions, but I'm trying to find the commond ground here.

Hi Kuma,

I wouldn't of thought the w2002/w5k would of been your cup of tea. You are full of suprises.

 

[kuma]

Quote:

I wouldn't of thought the w2002/w5k would of been your cup of tea. You are full of suprises.

Certainly, the W2002 wasn't.
But in need of a decent closed cans, I've been listeing to a few and they all are crap!

The strong contender so far was the AKG K271. Then I've borrowed my friend's 2002 again to see since my rig has changed. ( LP12/Vinyl Ref./Nait3R/HC)
This time it's performing a lot better.

A W5000 does sound promising.
One thing tho, W2002 leaks a lot for a closed cans.

Have you tried either 'fones?

 

[overlunge]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuma Whilst I thought W2002 was a slow can in the past, I don't particularly think it's slow with the Headline2. I am not sure what you mean by the musicality and bass depth. Can you clarify a bit? Also, which amplifier and source did you use for both 'fones?

Hi kuma,

I have been using audio technica's amplifier, AT-HA2002 with both headphones. Although HA2002 improves the speed of W2002 (compare with amps in the like of Earmax Pro and Grace m902), in relative terms, it is slower than W5000.

To me, there's something to do with the instrument separation and resolution. W2002 is more fuzzy around the edge, while W5000's presentation is more towards clean, sharper imaging.

W5000's bass goes to more depth and with good articulations (though can be lack of impact) but to me W2002 does not bass shy as some might describe, maybe it's because of the HA2002.

Sorry, I have no experience with K271's so I cannot help you on that one. Apology.


Overlunge

 

[overlunge]

Kuma, just had look through your profile, I have to agree with this man...

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoRedwings19 I wouldn't of thought the w2002/w5k would of been your cup of tea. You are full of suprises.

RS-1's the king of fuzz, and to maximise your fuzz force in the closed can departement, you need to score yourself a pair of W11JPN

Just ask the man himself, and try to pry his JPN off him for you to try

Sorry GRW19, I thought you were spot on with your comment

Overlunge

 

[kuma]

Sorry, dude.

I do not know what JPN thingy is.

It's cool you are using the AT amplifier. It makes sense since I assume they are voiced together.

If Naim made a headfones, I'd use it, too.

I don't blame you for not liking the Grado as they are not for everyone. I still prefer the feel of open cans, tho.

But sounds like I could live with the W5000 since Headline2 is working pretty good with the W2002.
AKG271 might be less costlier than a W2002, but it's not a bad 'fones for the money. Interesting thing is that most of the closed cans around the cost of 271 or less just do not have the clarity of RS1 or W2002. Guess this is where you pay your money.

I am not having ANY bass problems with the W2002 this time with the Headline2.
Its bass delivery is different from the Grado but it's well articulated with slight bloom I don't mind at all. Your comments on the W5000 regarding the lack of impact is worrisome, however.
Where I see it, if it's faster, then it should not lack the initial transients at all.
Would you say the W5000's presentation is similar to the k1k?

Thanks again for your comments.
Any other closed cans reco. also would be appreciated.

 

[ayt999]

the ATH-W11JPN is a limited edition audio-technica wood-cup headphone that came out in 1998 with a limited run of ~2000 (I thought it was 2000, but apparently some people have ones with serials over that).

http://www.audio-technica.co.jp/prod...th-w11jpn.html

overlunge - stop recommending these things.

they are scarce as it is, although since everyone that posted in this thread so far besides kuma has one, I guess it isn't much of a concern for us.

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayt999 the ATH-W11JPN is a limited edition audio-technica wood-cup headphone that came out in 1998 with a limited run of ~2000 (I thought it was 2000, but apparently some people have ones with serials over that). http://www.audio-technica.co.jp/prod...th-w11jpn.html overlunge - stop recommending these things. they are scarce as it is, although since everyone that posted in this thread so far besides kuma has one, I guess it isn't much of a concern for us.

so, what's so special about them?
Difference between W2002 and W5000?

I'm sorry but I have to wonder about the AT's limited edition series as it appears more like a marketing ploy to me.

 

[ayt999]

the W11JPN are one of the fuzziest of the ATH-W cans, somewhat similar to the RS1 with its fuzziness quality, so maybe that's why overlunge mentioned them.

I have yet to hear a W5000 so I cannot help you there, and I doubt comparing notes on the W2002 with you would be useful. but from what I've read, the W5000 seems like a good candidate if you want the W2002 sound. I think bluetin.com still has a NOS W2002 for sale (at about 1.5 times original MSRP I might add) but given the price of that and the lack of availability otherwise, the W5000 probably is the wiser choice.

the sound signatures of the various ATH-W headphones varies quite a bit, so I would also add that although the W2002 may share general features as the rest of the series, I wouldn't say any of them by itself is a good representation of the whole. (the soundstage width doesn't change too much and the general idea of the sound stays the same... but tone, balance, warmth, speed, and other aspects vary.)

have you looked at the ATH-L3000 (probably over your budget) or the JVC HP-DX1000? maybe one of those would be a better choice if I understand your preferences correctly. I could check out the isolation and sound signature of my HP-DX1000 and see how it compares to the RS1 (mine's old school with the brown headband) and W2002 if you are interested. IIRC the DX1000 is more isolating with its huge supple pads, although they add even more to the size of the can. I've never heard a K271 so I cannot help you there.

not quite sure what the point of AT releasing so many headphones all the time is (more profit is always a good reason), but the ATH-W series has been out for about 10 years now, and if you separate it into a high end and a more affordable categories... I guess the product release intervals are a bit more reasonable. maybe it's also become somewhat of an AT tradition to make a new wood-cup headphone every once in a while so they continue on although the new products may not necessarily sound better, although the sound difference probably has some use like targeting a slightly different market or new trends. there is a definite trend towards better overall sound as you get to the newer models though IMO.

also, considering them all when looking for an ATH-W to buy doesn't make much sense unless you are a collector. it probably could be compared to considering the entire MDR-SA series and MDR-CD3000 sony headphones when the logical thing to do is look at the best model in the current lineup.

 

[overlunge]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayt999 overlunge - stop recommending these things. they are scarce as it is, although since everyone that posted in this thread so far besides kuma has one, I guess it isn't much of a concern for us.

Alright, alright... I was trying to convert kuma into the Team ATOWF

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuma Its bass delivery is different from the Grado but it's well articulated with slight bloom I don't mind at all. Your comments on the W5000 regarding the lack of impact is worrisome, however. Where I see it, if it's faster, then it should not lack the initial transients at all. Would you say the W5000's presentation is similar to the k1k? Thanks again for your comments. Any other closed cans reco. also would be appreciated.

Actually, RS-1 is one of my all time favourite headphone, I wonder if I structured the post wrongly and made you think I dislike Grado?

W5000 to my ears, would not be basshead's choice of headphone, although the bass is present (more so than the W1000) but it is not the skull rocking (I am scared of using the word 'rattle'

) kind.

W5000 is faster than W2002 across the frequency, not only the bass if that is what you were trying to say?

Again, I have very limited experience with AKG's K1000, therefore my comment won't be of any use.

As for the marketing ploy of audio technica in terms of releasing limited edition headphones... Well, when you hold one in your hand, wear one on your head, and you will appreciate the philosophy audio technica has behind these headphones.. There's a link to some brief impressions I made about the W11JPN in my signature, have a look.

Woops, I did it again. Sorry, ayt999...


Overlunge

 

[kuma]

Thanks for your follow up.

I am specifically looking for the closed cans. And as usual home demoing is difficult for various models.

I am not into Sony products in general, but a R10 is still a possibility if I could home demo but I have read somewhere that the sound leaks out quite a bit.

W2002 also leaks but less than the Grado. And at lesat I could listen in my own rig. And glad I was able to since it reversed my previous negative impression on the fones.

I don't think that the W2002 warrants more than their retail price.
I am not a collector. I am looking for a good closed cans that I can enjoy as much as my RS1.

L3000 is out of consideraton since the leather as a casing does not appeal to me. They are going to be used often, so I need something that can be cleaned easily. I'm certain it's a cool thing to look at but not very practical.

As Beyerdynamics I am concerned that the ATs flavour varies by the model. Which makes the fone selection even more difficult, unfortunately.

I haven't heard the HP series, nor the PS, so can't speak for those, but with Grado, all through the line, it's pretty consistant.

I am skeptical of the DX1000 as JVC has a very little track records.
Also good to know they are large cans in that I'd rather not go there.

Altho, it seems all the closed cans are rather large.

Which amplifier did you use with the W2002?
I see you use a DP85. ( one of the nicer CD player Accuphase makes )

Thanks for your input. I know this is difficult since not too many Headfiers use a Naim headamp or a rig.

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally Posted by overlunge Alright, alright... I was trying to convert kuma into the Team ATOWF

Quote:

Actually, RS-1 is one of my all time favourite headphone, I wonder if I structured the post wrongly and made you think I dislike Grado?

Love it or hate it Grado, so naturally I assumed AT lovers won't be attracted to them.
Hifi is a *clickish* hobby.

Quote:

W5000 to my ears, would not be basshead's choice of headphone, although the bass is present (more so than the W1000) but it is not the skull rocking (I am scared of using the word 'rattle' ) kind.

I've noticed the slight lack of bass blooms on the W2002 with the Headline2 compared to the Grado. But what's there was clean and articulate and has a nice decays. Pretty natural delivery of bass notes. FWIW, I have never had the sloppy bass of the RS1 in my rig.

Quote:

Again, I have very limited experience with AKG's K1000, therefore my comment won't be of any use.

Ah.. darn.. the way you descrive the W5000 sounds like k1k to me. Also a god fones, but they were too lean in my rig. Fast and articulate tho but they could not do the convincing piano from the lack of bass decays as well as the RS1.

Quote:

Well, when you hold one in your hand, wear one on your head, and you will appreciate the philosophy audio technica has behind these headphones..

Well, the packaging of these W2002 is bloody impressive, indeed.
But I'm more concerned with how any piece of kit delivers in terms of sonic goods as all the boxes are stored in the basement or back shed and forgotten.

Thanks for your help, Overlunge.

p.s. I've noiced you use a meridian 506. 16 as a source.
I liked the unit as well as the 20 much better than anything Meridian made after.

 

[ayt999]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuma Which amplifier did you use with the W2002?

I use any one that's around since I don't have a preference, at least at the moment. they all perform well, but if I were to choose I'll probably go with the DHA3000 or SDS-XLR for a more musical and enjoyable (for me) presentation, but pairing it with the Balanced Reference for neutrality is equally as good.

with the current types we are discussing (highend closed wood headphones) I doubt there's any that can be considered extremely isolating. I think I have pretty much all the headphones of this type, and I don't get that impression with any of them. of course, external sound bleeding is hard to gauge by myself, but I think I have a decent idea of it....

as for their sounds and if any would fit what you want, I'm a bit confused over that right now.

what was the problem again? you think the W2002 is good enough for what you are looking for but cannot find a pair for a decent price? I doubt overlunge uses his pair a lot with all those other ATH-W headphones he has.

the price at bluetin for the NOS W2002 is up there well above used W2002 prices and would explain why it's still available.

not considering the DX1000 is understandable. it seems to have a serious issue with people often not liking it too due to its very unique sound. I was going to mention it, but it seems that I forgot to do so. the sound quality is suprisingly good IMO for a company that hasn't been in the high end scene, and and the price is fairly reasonable. possibly a bit higher than I would like, but not that ridiculous. (to me at least, and I usually buy these in Japan so that helps.)

how about RS1 drivers modded into an ear muff?

RS1 sound (which hopefully still exists after the implant into a highly isolated environment) with superb sound dampening.