[GOOROO]

Looking for perspectives on reference gear for mixing.

Currently mixing on
Adams & NS10s

Trying portable setup when traveling:

- u18t / Lotoo P6k

Effect Audio cables are transparent for me when comparing to PW Audio cables.

I'm curious on how these iems sound through chord hugo2 & TT2. I hear great things about Chord Dave. But I already have access to a mastering A/D Convertor. I'm looking at something trans-portable.

 

[ranfan]

For something closer to neutrality, flatter without one region being emphasized over another, the RS10 I think is the more suitable one. The U18t to my ears are more colored, thinner-sized notes with slightly harder-hitting bass and sparklier sharper treble. The U18t is also more prone to hisses with lower quality sources. Whereas the RS10 with its low impedance are more consistent sounding even with varying sources. Both have a high resolution, with the U18t sounding a little brighter especially on the treble side

 

[548184]

ranfan is a great resource. I appreciate his pragmatic levelheadedness in this hobby.

I think I'm the only one running as close to pro audio studio transportable as possible. DAPs, Sony and OEM cables are good for Youtube videos and entertainment portable Music purposes but for pure neutral accuracy you need a low latency real-time Music Server + a Chord DAC.

I agree with you on PW Audio cables. I don't understand why they are so popular besides the ergonomics. They are coloured and try to take you back to an era. Who wants their gear tainted and be taken back to the 50's and 60's? 80's, 90's, 00's and 10's should sound like their period not taken back to the 1950's. I don't like OEM cables at all. I only use non-OEM perfectly neutral reference CIEM cables via RCA OUT of a Chord DAC.

For IEMs, I only use Customs and IPX so that rules out the majority. I only trust IEM companies with a solid clientele and a solid professional reputation. For Black Friday, I'm considering the A18S at the transducer of choice. The past Black Fridays, discounts were 20%. I'm preoccupied with other Audio projects, but if the discount is higher than 20% then I will roll the dice. There's an reviewer that uses the A18S for mixing and that reviewer has an arsenal of IEMs in his inventory. I ruled out the A18T as the A18S seems more balanced, but still close to reference. Most likely, I will wait for the next iteration of A18 as I don't think my cable will be IPX ready this year and I need a my cable to do the A18 justice.

https://theheadphonelist.com/64-audio-a18s-the-quartermaster-a-custom-in-ear-monitor-review/

For more of a pro use, not consumer you need low latency real-time on the source along with a Chord DAC. There's nothing like pro audio quality bass that's close to bare metal as possible (super low milliOhms).





Also, only Chord can do 10/10 Resolution and 10/10 Transparency due to not implementing a headphone amplifier in it's design. My cable is the only one that can do 10/10 Resolution and 10/10 Transparency. So I'm the only one with 10/10 Resolution and 10/10 Transparency all the way up to the transducer.

If you willing to go further down the rabbit hole. I don't as I don't have the self-control to settle thus big money pit, so CIEMs and transportable are the sweet spot for my use case. But this is ray-dude's system if you are wondering how a low latency real-time like the Taiko Extreme + a Chord DAC is architected. He had open invites pre-COVID in San Diego but not sure about now.

 

[HuoYuanJia]

Hi, I think I might be able to help you.

Considering you are used to your ADAM and I work for HEDD (same founder), I will assume our understanding of transparent sound will match quite nicely. I also have RS10 and A18t both as CIEM.

The Softears RS10 is much much closer to the sound of near-field monitors. It is much more transparent and has noticeably less coloration. The A18t will sound too warm and full-bodied. The midrange is slightly recessed, but it‘s the transition of mid-high to high of where the 64 Audio can sound most colored. I would use an EQ (not a deal-braker), but with the RS10 I don‘t feel like I would ever need one.
BTW, I also compared extensively to the U18s, but that one is way too warm.

I have to say, I really like the apex modules. However, the musician‘s fit of 64 Audio is very tight. To sit at the desk, I prefer Softear‘s custom even though there is slightly more fiddling because of a looser fit.

 

[HuoYuanJia]

Oh, and I also have the Hugo 2. If you‘re thinking about to use that one as a source, the 64 Audio picks up some background hiss. The RS10 does not.

 

[PatrickB]

Hi, I think I might be able to help you.

Considering you are used to your ADAM and I work for HEDD (same founder), I will assume our understanding of transparent sound will match quite nicely. I also have RS10 and A18t both as CIEM.

The Softears RS10 is much much closer to the sound of near-field monitors. It is much more transparent and has noticeably less coloration. The A18t will sound too warm and full-bodied. The midrange is slightly recessed, but it‘s the transition of mid-high to high of where the 64 Audio can sound most colored. I would use an EQ (not a deal-braker), but with the RS10 I don‘t feel like I would ever need one.
BTW, I also compared extensively to the U18s, but that one is way too warm.

I have to say, I really like the apex modules. However, the musician‘s fit of 64 Audio is very tight. To sit at the desk, I prefer Softear‘s custom even though there is slightly more fiddling because of a looser fit.

Appreciate your perspective as I have been in a similar situation and formerly used a pair of ADAM A7x nearfields for mixing and mastering. In the usual pro audio forums not a lot of people have much experience with IEM’s outside of typical brands like Shure, AT, Etymotics, etc.

I’m currently testing the RS10 and RSV (also Monarch MKII, Clairvoyance, KSE1500, Euclid, ER4SR, LCD-i4). I’m thinking of trying the the U12t. Does your observation of the crossover and warm coloration of the A18t apply to the U/A12t as well? I know you said the RS10 took your top spot as a reference over the Prophile 8 and 64 Audio.

 

[redrol]

I have a bunch of studio monitors (JBL, Yamaha, KRK) and for me the RSV is DAMN close to them. The closest I own likely. Good enough for mixing easily, and I've done it.

 

[PatrickB]

I have a bunch of studio monitors (JBL, Yamaha, KRK) and for me the RSV is DAMN close to them. The closest I own likely. Good enough for mixing easily, and I've done it.

That’s good feedback from someone who has done mixing on studio monitors. And cool to hear you’ve done some mixing on them! That’s exactly what I want to try.

I believe @HuoYuanJia said the same thing about the RS10 matching his monitors.

So this is encouraging to hear. I’ve debated if U12t might be overkill. Especially considering many producers mix on unglamorous speakers and how well you know your reference ends up being a more important factor than absolute neutrality.

 

[redrol]

The RSV is much closer to reference that U12T for me. Im sure plenty would disagree.

 

[PatrickB]

The RSV is much closer to reference that U12T for me. Im sure plenty would disagree.

Interesting. I've actually heard a handful of people say they felt the U12t wasn't exactly neutral and might be problematic for use as a mixing reference. I guess neutral tends to be seen as boring or sterile if you're someone who is listening for pure enjoyment. Maybe I'll skip the U12t for the time being and pause my new mixing IEM/headphone search.

Then again it surprises me how many engineers swear by their Audeze headphones for mixing! Many EQ them but I've heard some don't. I'm surprised the recessed mids don't pose more of a problem for mixing.

 

[Big In Japan]

I own the U12T and had the RS10 here for a week. These two at least are quite different (check 3-4K region below). I`m not a mixer/producer though. In my opinion the RS10 is much more resolving an to my ears sounds more neutral. I`d go for the RS10 in this comparison if I was after detail / resolution / neutrality. If the U18T is similar, this may tanslate to your question too.

 

[ljnew]

ranfan is a great resource. I appreciate his pragmatic levelheadedness in this hobby.

I think I'm the only one running as close to pro audio studio transportable as possible. DAPs, Sony and OEM cables are good for Youtube videos and entertainment portable Music purposes but for pure neutral accuracy you need a low latency real-time Music Server + a Chord DAC.

I agree with you on PW Audio cables. I don't understand why they are so popular besides the ergonomics. They are coloured and try to take you back to an era. Who wants their gear tainted and be taken back to the 50's and 60's? 80's, 90's, 00's and 10's should sound like their period not taken back to the 1950's. I don't like OEM cables at all. I only use non-OEM perfectly neutral reference CIEM cables via RCA OUT of a Chord DAC.

For IEMs, I only use Customs and IPX so that rules out the majority. I only trust IEM companies with a solid clientele and a solid professional reputation. For Black Friday, I'm considering the A18S at the transducer of choice. The past Black Fridays, discounts were 20%. I'm preoccupied with other Audio projects, but if the discount is higher than 20% then I will roll the dice. There's an reviewer that uses the A18S for mixing and that reviewer has an arsenal of IEMs in his inventory. I ruled out the A18T as the A18S seems more balanced, but still close to reference. Most likely, I will wait for the next iteration of A18 as I don't think my cable will be IPX ready this year and I need a my cable to do the A18 justice.

https://theheadphonelist.com/64-audio-a18s-the-quartermaster-a-custom-in-ear-monitor-review/



For more of a pro use, not consumer you need low latency real-time on the source along with a Chord DAC. There's nothing like pro audio quality bass that's close to bare metal as possible (super low milliOhms).





Also, only Chord can do 10/10 Resolution and 10/10 Transparency due to not implementing a headphone amplifier in it's design. My cable is the only one that can do 10/10 Resolution and 10/10 Transparency. So I'm the only one with 10/10 Resolution and 10/10 Transparency all the way up to the transducer.



If you willing to go further down the rabbit hole. I don't as I don't have the self-control to settle thus big money pit, so CIEMs and transportable are the sweet spot for my use case. But this is ray-dude's system if you are wondering how a low latency real-time like the Taiko Extreme + a Chord DAC is architected. He had open invites pre-COVID in San Diego but not sure about now.

What chord dac?

 

[GOOROO]

What chord dac?

Chord Dave or Hugo TT2.

As illustrated in diagram.

 

[goodvibes]

I'd also look at the Moondrop S8 with Comply tips. S8 can get a bit analytical with a touch more pinna gain than the RSV but it's also reportedly more detailed and layered. I haven't heard the RSV to corroborate so take with a grain. Complys remove that slightly too present tonality and make them quite linear and very informative for my ears. Moondrop, that is a sister company of Softears, have looked at a successor to the s8 and said they can't make it better in the kilobuck range, which I assume they meant considering it's goal of accuracy. It also has great timing/PRaT. Like I said, I use mine with Comply tips and also a $30 NiceHCK LitzPS-Pro-8 4N Litz Pure Silver Earphone Upgrade Cable. Like most revealing things, getting the interface right becomes more critical. They've been good with everything I've played them with in this config.

Just realized this was about rs10 and not RSV. Brain fade on my part. RS10 has an almost identical response curve to S8 with other tweaks so that would be my vote. I'd recommend universal and comply tips for a similar result I get from S8. I really like customs but at the same time, you can't tweak the pinna gain/tonality with tips etc. if it doesn't agree with you and Complys or other less tonally significant foams are secure, isolating and comfy like a custom.