[pp312]

Quote:

Justo, If you think I'm trolling, than you also missed the point.
BTW, the fact that you think it funny that the 555/595 share the same drivers is indicative of the lack of attention ppl have paid to my original post.
It is very obvious that many products share common components.
As I stated, it's like the difference between a Lincoln and a Ford. Same chassis, in most cases, even the same engine, right?
 
If anyone wishes to continue a spirited discussion of the 555/595, than I'm all for it.
 
I'm perfectly willing to agree to disagree, in the interest of getting this thread back on topic.
 

Perhaps it'd be helpful if you clearly stated your position, as it's not at all clear from your posts (which more resemble the reposts of an habitual stirrer). If you agree the 555/595 share the same drivers (and you have no choice, since they carry the same part number), and there's no noticeable difference in the housing, how do you maintain there is in fact an audible difference once the 555s foam strip is removed? You use the analogy of cars, but cars have thousands of components, most hidden from sight; headphones have only those 3 basic components: driver, housing and leads (and possibly damping, but there's no damping involved here). If the 595 is indeed superior in some way, in what way?
 
Incidentally, I agree that the 595 has excellent sound, and I've used up considerable bandwidth here over the years defending them . But my ears tell me the 555 with the mod sounds just as good for considerably less, making it a huge bargain.  

 

[recorder]

 
Quote:

Perhaps it'd be helpful if you clearly stated your position, as it's not at all clear from your posts (which more resemble the reposts of an habitual stirrer). If you agree the 555/595 share the same drivers (and you have no choice, since they carry the same part number), and there's no noticeable difference in the housing, how do you maintain there is in fact an audible difference once the 555s foam strip is removed? You use the analogy of cars, but cars have thousands of components, most hidden from sight; headphones have only those 3 basic components: driver, housing and leads (and possibly damping, but there's no damping involved here). If the 595 is indeed superior in some way, in what way?
 
Incidentally, I agree that the 595 has excellent sound, and I've used up considerable bandwidth here over the years defending them . But my ears tell me the 555 with the mod sounds just as good for considerably less, making it a huge bargain.  

OK, to clearly state my position, I see a thread in which owners of the HD 555/595 attempt to show that by removing a foam strip, the less expensive model sounds exactly like the more expensive model.
 
As I read the comments, I'm reminded of the 100's of posts on several boards of similar discussions. A brief example would be the Samsung A vs. S panel debate. Where someone discovered that Samsung used OEM panels in their LCD HDTV's & Computer monitors. Well, who doesn't? But, the A panel owners feel they were sold an inferior product.
So, getting back to this thread, I thought it would be somewhat instructional (oops! my bad!) to post a contrary POV, which has been completely misconstrued.
You say "I have no choice, but to agree they use the same drivers". Of course they do,and I never said otherwise, and that was precisely the whole point of my analogy.
 
The main difference in the 2 concerning performance  is the THD, and Frequency response.
555:
Frequency response (headphones) 15.....28000 Hz

THD, total harmonic distortion < 0,2 %

595:
Frequency response (headphones) 12.....38500 Hz
THD, total harmonic distortion < 0,1 %

The improved THD for the 595 is attributed to: "Highly constant,compressed cellulose fleece reduces total harmonic distortion"( that's from Sennheiser's description.)
Do they sound superior to the 555? Every review I've read has indicated they sound incrementally better, certainly NOT superior.
I for one, value the great build quality, and comfort level of the 595's, and I just love my headphone holder!
I don't think anyone would be disappointed with the sound quality of the 555's and at their price point, they're a great value.
Much like a Ford vs a Lincoln, or Accord vs Accura!

 

[pp312]

Unforunately you still haven't addressed the issue. Specs from manufacturers mean nothing, as I'm sure you know. As for the cellulose fleece, I wish someone would tell me where it's located, or rather, where it's located in the 595 but not the 555. As for the reviews, they are of course of the stock product, not the modded 555, so are not relevant as we're comparing 595 v. modded 555.
 
However, if you're saying the visual differences in the phones and maybe better comfort plus the phone holder (which I agree is very useful) is worth the extra money, that's fine, and entirely your choice. My only point of confusion is the (apparent) assertion that two phones with the same drivers, same housing (and thus, same loading), and same leads (and no doubt the leads have the same part numbers as well) can in some way sound different.  

 

[Ashirgo]

Quote:

 
However, if you're saying the visual differences in the phones and maybe better comfort plus the phone holder (which I agree is very useful) is worth the extra money, that's fine, and entirely your choice. My only point of confusion is the (apparent) assertion that two phones with the same drivers, same housing (and thus, same loading), and same leads (and no doubt the leads have the same part numbers as well) can in some way sound different.  

That is a very real possibility. It would be very logical to think that the manufacturer picks better drivers for HD 595 and puts those of a less than stellar performance into HD 555 housing. Of course, all that provided there are any measurements & QC taken.

 

[xnor]

Quote:

The main difference in the 2 concerning performance  is the THD, and Frequency response.
555:
Frequency response (headphones) 15.....28000 Hz
THD, total harmonic distortion < 0,2 %
595:
Frequency response (headphones) 12.....38500 Hz
THD, total harmonic distortion < 0,1 %
The improved THD for the 595 is attributed to: "Highly constant,compressed cellulose fleece reduces total harmonic distortion"( that's from Sennheiser's description.)

Sorry, but that was about the most pathetic comparison I've seen in a while.

 

[SP Wild]

I'm starting to think if the HD555 has a felt piece in the cup to absorb resonance that it'll probably sound better than my HD595...I can't stand it's excessive cup resonance.

 

[pp312]

Quote:

It would be very logical to think that the manufacturer picks better drivers for HD 595 and puts those of a less than stellar performance into HD 555 housing.

That would be convenient to assume except that the drivers have the same part number. Obviously Sennheiser doesn't differentiate.

 

[V-bro]

Indeed they don't differentiate and all drivers carrying the partnumber are of equal (stellar) performance...
 
Mr. Recorder, don't kid yourself thinking your definition of an engineer is anywhere near realistic, it rather sketches your narrow minded and twisted point of view (along with all the other extremely weak reasoning in the responses you have ventilated). Don't forget that your 595 was designed by an engineer as well.
 
Great engineering is rather defined by doing the greatest things with the least of means. Which would make the 595 the engineers choice.
 
Also don't forget that most of the engineering involved here is old school stuff regurgitated and perhaps just slightly refined, or even degraded. Taken into account the price of producing these headphones makes it rather obvious the 595 isn't a fundamentally improved version of the 555. And makes it rather obvious the price difference is based upon making profit on thin air.

 

[LiquidExtreme12]

The HD 555's and HD 595's look so similar from the inside, yet there is a massive difference in price!

 

[pp312]

Quote:

I'm starting to think if the HD555 has a felt piece in the cup to absorb resonance that it'll probably sound better than my HD595...I can't stand it's excessive cup resonance.

I've never heard anyone mention cup resonance before with regard to the 555. However, I experienced something like that with both the AKG 702 and 601--what I can only describe as a kind of metallic resonance, as though something inside needed to be damped. I wonder if there's some kind of interaction between some ears and some phones. I'd never experienced this effect on any phones other than the AKGs.   

 

[SP Wild]

Quote:

I've never heard anyone mention cup resonance before with regard to the 555. However, I experienced something like that with both the AKG 702 and 601--what I can only describe as a kind of metallic resonance, as though something inside needed to be damped. I wonder if there's some kind of interaction between some ears and some phones. I'd never experienced this effect on any phones other than the AKGs.   

 
I don't own the HD555 - its the HD595 that I own, which I have been so turned off by its resonance that centers approx 1khz and adjacent frequencies.  The mod for the HD555 is to take away a foam strip...from what I've read, this increases the soundstage and "opens up" the frequency response...I am suspecting that this is a result of increased cavity resonance that occurs if one was to remove damping material away from the cup.  I suspect the HD555 is a better can than the HD595 for having this damping cloth - sure the soundstage is not as big, at least the cup resonance is not as bad.
 
The cup resonance you describe on the K701 is exactly the sort of thing that I am on about.  With the K701 the cup resonance is zoned higher up at approx 5khz - but is more controlled and refined, whereas the 1khz resonance in the HD595 is completely out of control.  The K701 resonance is what gives the K701 that gigantic soundstage in the uppermids...and also draws criticism for the same reason, i.e. a upper mid glare.
 
I repeat...I believe the HD555, if it contains damping cloth in the cup, will sound more coherent than the HD595.  I am thinking Senheisser took away the damping to unleash the resonance and in doing so increase soundstage and upper mids to satisfy the typical audiophile, which I believe seem to have an unnatural obsession with "air" and soundstage.
 
I am planning to do the opposite of the mod.   I want to open my HD595 and put material in the cup and hope to reduce the cavity resonance.

 

[pp312]

It's all rather strange. I've owned several pairs of both 555 (modded and stock) & 595 and never been aware of any cup resonance, nor ever heard anyone complain of it, but in any case I doubt the foam piece has anything to do with it. This is actually more like rubber and more reflective than absorbant; I think it was designed  to have the same effect as when you cover part of the back of any open phone. This is probably the opposite of what you want, which is to damp reflections. I which you luck, but I really doubt there are many reflections being thrown back toward the driver from that very open grille. 

 

[xnor]

The funny thing is that I tried out a couple of things with a HD555 a while ago and when I removed the foam and made it a closed HD555 (double-sided tape on the mesh inside the cup, no foam, so lots of reflections) I measured a huge increase (about +10dB) of frequencies around 1 to 3 kHz. Looking at the frequency map, 1 to 2 kHz is called "tinny". And it definitely sounded that way.
Reverted to the original state and everything's fine again, flat upper midrange restored.
 
The foam removal mod resulted in a slight increase in frequencies around 1.2 kHz followed by a valley at 3 to 4 kHz - reverted that one too.
 
^ In german I like to say something like "to think [believe] means to be clueless", see Nietzsche.

 

[SP Wild]

Who says one has to block the grilles to mass damp a headphone cup?

 

[xnor]

Nobody?