[Midgetguy]

I'm posting this here because it relates directly to the HD600, and I'm hoping that some of you who know this headphone so well can provide some guidance:

I listen to my music at relatively low volumes (I have a bit of sound sensitivity and my ears get fatigued quicker than the average listener).

From what I've read, the HiFiMan 400s has a more present & less laid-back bottom-end (with the hifiman focus pads or the brainwavz pads) than the HD600/650. It also seems like the 400s will have more presence/sparkle in the high-end as well.

So... I'm wondering if the 400s might be better at lower volumes?

In other words, do the HD600/650s need to be listened to at louder volumes in order for the bass and treble to really make themselves audible/present. Can I get the same audibility/presence from the 400s at a lower volume?

I appreciate that some of you cannot offer a comparison to the 400S, but I'd still love to here your thoughts on just the HD600 as it relates to this question.

I only had a quick listen, but the HE400S reminded me of listening to the HD650. I personally don't have any issue with not getting the bass and treble presence in my HD600 at lower volumes.

 

[DavidA]

  hi guys, anyone go from magni 2 uber to a WA6/WA7? thinking about making this jump w/ the hd600, would assume its a noticeable upgrade but maybe someone can comment if they've took this path

Went from original Magni > O2/ODAC > WA7d > BH Crack (possibly to Elise next).
 
The WA7d was a slight disappointment for me due to the so-so DAC section and the average sound of the amp section.  It was and still is one of the best looking amps out there IMO.

 

[DavidA]

I'm posting this here because it relates directly to the HD600, and I'm hoping that some of you who know this headphone so well can provide some guidance:

I listen to my music at relatively low volumes (I have a bit of sound sensitivity and my ears get fatigued quicker than the average listener).

From what I've read, the HiFiMan 400s has a more present & less laid-back bottom-end (with the hifiman focus pads or the brainwavz pads) than the HD600/650. It also seems like the 400s will have more presence/sparkle in the high-end as well.

So... I'm wondering if the 400s might be better at lower volumes?

In other words, do the HD600/650s need to be listened to at louder volumes in order for the bass and treble to really make themselves audible/present. Can I get the same audibility/presence from the 400s at a lower volume?

I appreciate that some of you cannot offer a comparison to the 400S, but I'd still love to here your thoughts on just the HD600 as it relates to this question.

For listening at low/very low volume the best headphone I've found is the MDR-7506, yeah its not even a mid-fi level can and are not the greatest at normal or loud levels but for when I want to go to sleep and have the volume at low levels the boosted bass and treble become just right, sort of like the old "loudness" button on vintage gear.
 
A quite room is around 40-45dB, when I say low volume its about 55dB, just a touch above the ambient noise level, my normal listening level is about 65-75dB.  With the HD-650, HE-400i and most of my other headphones if I have the level at 55dB they sound rather flat and lifeless.

 

[Midgetguy]

  Went from original Magni > O2/ODAC > WA7d > BH Crack (possibly to Elise next).
 
The WA7d was a slight disappointment for me due to the so-so DAC section and the average sound of the amp section.  It was and still is one of the best looking amps out there IMO.

The aesthetic design is fabulous in my book. Dunno about how things sound though.

 

[TheEldestBoy]

For listening at low/very low volume the best headphone I've found is the MDR-7506, yeah its not even a mid-fi level can and are not the greatest at normal or loud levels but for when I want to go to sleep and have the volume at low levels the boosted bass and treble become just right, sort of like the old "loudness" button on vintage gear.

A quite room is around 40-45dB, when I say low volume its about 55dB, just a touch above the ambient noise level, my normal listening level is about 65-75dB.  With the HD-650, HE-400i and most of my other headphones if I have the level at 55dB they sound rather flat and lifeless.

Apologies if this is a "basic" question... but how do I measure the volume level (in db) at which I am listening?

 

[DavidA]

Quote:

Apologies if this is a "basic" question... but how do I measure the volume level (in db) at which I am listening?

Easiest way if you have a smart phone is load a sound meter app, not the most accurate readings but it will get you in the ball park.  If you don't have a smart phones then getting a dedicated meter is about the only other way, not super expensive.
 

 

 

[TheEldestBoy]

Easiest way if you have a smart phone is load a sound meter app, not the most accurate readings but it will get you in the ball park.  If you don't have a smart phones then getting a dedicated meter is about the only other way, not super expensive.

Thanks DavidA!

 

[DavidA]

  The aesthetic design is fabulous in my book. Dunno about how things sound though.

+1, I wish more manufactures would put some added design into aesthetics, they could probably increase sales quite easily just by making something look a little better than the competition IMO.  The WA7 is one of those, it looks like a expensive piece of art and in part that is why I bought it (I was a noob).

 

[Argyris]

  Easiest way if you have a smart phone is load a sound meter app, not the most accurate readings but it will get you in the ball park.  If you don't have a smart phones then getting a dedicated meter is about the only other way, not super expensive.
 

 

 
Good suggestion. Unfortunately, my particular phone doesn't seem very accurate for this, since it appears to top out at 60 dB even as I raise the volume. I'll have to use my condenser mic and fire up my DAW later to get a good result. For some reason it never occurred to me that this sort of setup would work, since I figured the SPL would be a lot lower without a proper seal.

 

[DavidA]

   
Good suggestion. Unfortunately, my particular phone doesn't seem very accurate for this, since it appears to top out at 60 dB even as I raise the volume. I'll have to use my condenser mic and fire up my DAW later to get a good result. For some reason it never occurred to me that this sort of setup would work, since I figured the SPL would be a lot lower without a proper seal.

Might want to try another app, the free app that I use has a setting for calibrating it so if you know of someone with a SPL meter you can calibrate your phone mic so that the reading are a bit more accurate.  The app that I got tops out at 120dB.  After doing the calibration with a friends SPL meter that was accurate to 1.5dB +/- the app seems to be quite accurate, accurate enough to set matching listening levels to do some crude blind testing.

 

[castleofargh]

just remember that the loudness you're measuring is not always calibrated correctly. but most of all, it's what is captured in a given configuration! the ear will be much closer to the driver and the headphone better sealed. so those values for the headphone's loudness are probably higher than the values showed on those pics(room noise now should be close to reality, modulo calibration errors) . as a vaguely informative thing it's fine, but I wouldn't suggest to use such method to decide upon a higher limit for those who like loud music and want to feel safe about it. for those fellows it would be better to get a multimeter with some low freq test tone and calculate the loudness from the sensitivity given by the headphone's specs. also not perfect but probably closer to actual loudness.
 
about the low listening experience, the equal loudness contour is probably a good approach to find out what needs to be boosted at low volume levels(implies you know what signature you want at normal listening level). in a general way we indeed want more low and trebles to feel the same kind of signature for quiet listening.

 

[DavidA]

  just remember that the loudness you're measuring is not always calibrated correctly. but most of all, it's what is captured in a given configuration! the ear will be much closer to the driver and the headphone better sealed. so those values for the headphone's loudness are probably higher than the values showed on those pics(room noise now should be close to reality, modulo calibration errors) . as a vaguely informative thing it's fine, but I wouldn't suggest to use such method to decide upon a higher limit for those who like loud music and want to feel safe about it. for those fellows it would be better to get a multimeter with some low freq test tone and calculate the loudness from the sensitivity given by the headphone's specs. also not perfect but probably closer to actual loudness.
 
about the low listening experience, the equal loudness contour is probably a good approach to find out what needs to be boosted at low volume levels(implies you know what signature you want at normal listening level). in a general way we indeed want more low and trebles to feel the same kind of signature for quiet listening.

I don't measure with the phone placed between the ear cups like the image shows, I've been placing the phone's mic as close to the driver as possible, where the readings were highest so it should be pretty close to what my ears are hearing.  For those that listen at high levels your suggestion to set a limit is a great idea.  At the listening level of 70-80dB where I'm at the Health and Safety charts say that I can safely listen for 24hrs straight with none or low possibility of hearing damage.

 

[wombatfi]

  What do you guys think about this:
http://whttp://www.head-fi.org/t/538255/sennheiser-hd-600-impressions-thread/15210ww.headfonia.com/sennheiser-hd650-600-and-580-updated-drivers/

I can't tell if I have black or white. It looks half way between black and white! It clearly looks darker than the white parts on the center ring. It sort of depends upon the angle of the light and it can look fairly light or considerably dark.
 
Probably the white though. Got them late 2011. Looking at my Amazon order I see that I only paid a $20 difference between then. $315 for the HD600 and $336 for the HD650

 

[DavidA]

The price difference for me was $55, $290 for HD-650 (amazon) and $235 for HD-600 (adorama), back in Nov of 2014, black Friday sales.

 

[Midgetguy]

 
I can't tell if I have black or white. It looks half way between black and white! It clearly looks darker than the white parts on the center ring. It sort of depends upon the angle of the light and it can look fairly light or considerably dark.
 
Probably the white though. Got them late 2011. Looking at my Amazon order I see that I only paid a $20 difference between then. $315 for the HD600 and $336 for the HD650

Sounds like it would be new enough to be the white drivers. From the pics I've seen, you wouldn't even think they'd used to be white if they were the older black drivers. Not unless your headphones have a severe active smoking problem