[earnmyturns]

Please don't feed the trolls. Ignore them and they will go back under the bridge.

I'm kind of curious about how long this is going to last... Will the heathens be converted, or will the preacher be laid low by malarial mosquitos?

 

[wiz2596]

See? That sounds terribly dogmatic right there! Your thoughts built from your visits to ASR are already made up, rigidly congealed, and inflexible, not to mention iron clad judgmental about those who do not share your view. This attitude seems like a direct translation of your abiding faith in whatever you have read from ASR. That's okay with me, but It makes me wonder why you're even bothering to have a conversation about this. Ironically, there seems to be no one here to convince or persuade, except, maybe yourself, which is weird, given how strongly anchored you already seem to be in your convictions.

Personally, I am no hater of any audio site, let alone ASR, I simply did not find their approach to this whole audio thing to be convincing, or even particularly useful for my needs, so I decided not to return there, but hating them? Nah. I do not have the time nor the energy for that, Nor do i think that they even deserve that kind of attention, to be honest with you. I can say the same for a thousand other sites on the internet, sites that are always trying to sell you one thing or the other, dishonestly or honestly. They are a dime a dozen, and operate in many diverse fields. If I wanted to make a practice of hating every site that is selling some idea I do not agree with, I'd soon have no room in my heart at all for anything else.

Wishing you a lot of luck and joy in your ASR listening, measuring, philosophical, and enjoyment l adventures. I hope there is some actual listening (and enjoyment of listening) going on there, though, at the very least

Actually that 'analog' feeling and rich details you hear from the Yggy is just a massive amount of harmonics and unwanted distortion added to signal to replicate 'analog sound', and not an actual capability of the dac, unfortunately, the signal is being compromised and destroyed at this point, signal is not as pure as every audiophile would like it to be, please open your eyes, measurements don't lie, we all been foole and a $99 dac can do it better.

 

[koven]

I'm kind of curious about how long this is going to last... Will the heathens be converted, or will the preacher be laid low by malarial mosquitos?

Studies have shown ASR conversion rate is about on par w/ Jehovah's Witnessess.

 

[earnmyturns]

Actually that 'analog' feeling and rich details you hear from the Yggy is just a massive amount of harmonics and unwanted distortion

I've resisted, but this is too funny. Some of us have the blessing (or had before covid-19) of being able to hear live music from the best musicians in the best concert halls many times/year. If a DAC were that distorting, would we put up with it? Especially when its cost is a fraction of what we spend in concert going, so replacing it would be in the noise? You have no idea of the knowledge or experience of the people here (look at the gear list on my sig).

 

[scottcw]

Please don't feed the troll. They grow weak and die when ignored.

 

[Rensek]

Actually that 'analog' feeling and rich details you hear from the Yggy is just a massive amount of harmonics and unwanted distortion added to signal to replicate 'analog sound', and not an actual capability of the dac, unfortunately, the signal is being compromised and destroyed at this point, signal is not as pure as every audiophile would like it to be, please open your eyes, measurements don't lie, we all been foole and a $99 dac can do it better.

Don't come in here and tell people what they should want or like. If they like sound of their yggy at 2700 and you like the sound of your modi 3 at 99 just be happy that you like your modi!

Schiit, man, life is hard enough the way it is. If you drive a Honda Civic do you go up to everyone driving a silverado pickup and tell them off for their decision?

I have a modi 3, a modi multibit, a bifrost 4490, and a Bifrost 2. Plus a bunch of other stuff. I like it all. Some better then others. It's ok. Don't be discontent with another's decisions because you like something else. That's just stupid...

Do you dislike people who like shasta because you like coke or Pepsi products? Or do you recognize that Shasta orange/grape/cream soda are as different and also as awesome as coke and mountain dew...... And Schiit mountain dew in the can is better then a 20oz bottle, but the first 20 ounces of ice cold mountain dew to come out of a freas 2 liter bottle is the best ever......
God, don't be an idiot. Life is hard enough right now. Focus brainpower on something else to try and change......gotta be plenty of people other people on the internet that are legitimately wrong about something that actually matters..

Please don't feed the troll. They grow weak and die when ignored.

But I'm bored.... Normal news sites are all corona virus all the time. I'd rather read audio forums and type out half sensical rants.....


Also, if you are buying cheap assed RCA cables with very thin gauge wire it doesn't matter what damn dac you buy, the cables aren't going to able to carry all of the signal the dac is sending, regardless of price....

 

[johnzz4]

Actually that 'analog' feeling and rich details you hear from the Yggy is just a massive amount of harmonics and unwanted distortion added to signal to replicate 'analog sound', and not an actual capability of the dac, unfortunately, the signal is being compromised and destroyed at this point, signal is not as pure as every audiophile would like it to be, please open your eyes, measurements don't lie, we all been foole and a $99 dac can do it better.

Wiz.. I was once an objectivist much like yourself when it came to audio equipment. I chased specs for years, unable to figure out why I wasn't satisfied with the sound. I'd find myself turning it down, wondering why the treble was annoying, etc. Maybe I was still short a couple of 0's in my THD%? Wait, what's all this talk about R2R, and what's the point of tube-based equipment that measures like crap? More money and poor specs - those suckers (sound familiar?).

Fast forward a few ungratifying years of audiophilia, I opened my mind and explored a lot of equipment. My focus shifted from specs to being keenly aware of my enjoyment levels. My exploration began slowing down as I could turn the volume up without wincing, and I could listen, engaged, for hours on end. When I was done a listening session, it wasn't long before I was itching for some more.

I think the reason there is such a strong focus for many on specifications is two-fold. First, people like to make sense of things, and specs are an easy way to do that. The fallacy is that specs equal listening pleasure. Nobody ever said "you've got to come over and measure my system"; they say "you've got to listen to this".

Secondly, I echo Koven's sentiment about a subconscious defense mechanism that protects people's egos - particularly when they don't have the means to explore more costly equipment.

I think it's safe to say that many with more costly equipment have at one time focused on and made audio purchases based on specs. It's cost effective, initially makes sense, and is the logical first stop on nearly every audiophile's journey. On the flip-side, many of the objectivists haven't explored more costly equipment, and in turn lack the proper insight and experience to make a valid argument. I would never argue that your $99 dac measures better than my equipment. I would and can, based on experience, argue with you that your $99 dac doesn't bring me nearly as much listening enjoyment. The latter happens to be all I care about since my listening isn't done with an Audio Precision analyzer.

 

[wiz2596]

Wiz.. I was once an objectivist much like yourself when it came to audio equipment. I chased specs for years, unable to figure out why I wasn't satisfied with the sound. I'd find myself turning it down, wondering why the treble was annoying, etc. Maybe I was still short a couple of 0's in my THD%? Wait, what's all this talk about R2R, and what's the point of tube-based equipment that measures like crap? More money and poor specs - those suckers (sound familiar?).

Fast forward a few ungratifying years of audiophilia, I opened my mind and explored a lot of equipment. My focus shifted from specs to being keenly aware of my enjoyment levels. My exploration began slowing down as I could turn the volume up without wincing, and I could listen, engaged, for hours on end. When I was done a listening session, it wasn't long before I was itching for some more.

I think the reason there is such a strong focus for many on specifications is two-fold. First, people like to make sense of things, and specs are an easy way to do that. The fallacy is that specs equal listening pleasure. Nobody ever said "you've got to come over and measure my system"; they say "you've got to listen to this".

Secondly, I echo Koven's sentiment about a subconscious defense mechanism that protects people's egos - particularly when they don't have the means to explore more costly equipment.

I think it's safe to say that many with more costly equipment have at one time focused on and made audio purchases based on specs. It's cost effective, initially makes sense, and is the logical first stop on nearly every audiophile's journey. On the flip-side, many of the objectivists haven't explored more costly equipment, and in turn lack the proper insight and experience to make a valid argument. I would never argue that your $99 dac measures better than my equipment. I would and can, based on experience, argue with you that your $99 dac doesn't bring me nearly as much listening enjoyment. The latter happens to be all I care about since my listening isn't done with an Audio Precision analyzer.

Are you sure my $99 dac doesn't bring you as much listening enjoyment? Have you tried khadas before? Please elaborate

I'm willing to lend you my khadas for testing, play 'montana', 'valley girl' or 'my jelly roll gum drop' from Zappa and you will be in heaven

 

[johnzz4]

Are you sure my $99 dac doesn't bring you as much listening enjoyment? Have you tried khadas before? Please elaborate

No, but I have tried the Modi mentioned in your initial post. I can’t be certain of any DAC I haven’t tried, but I’ve tried enough budget, well measuring DACs to reasonably conclude that it’s unlikely your Khadas DAC would make me see the light. I am happy for you that you seem to enjoy it though.

 

[johnjen]

Actually that 'analog' feeling and rich details you hear from the Yggy is just a massive amount of harmonics and unwanted distortion added to signal to replicate 'analog sound', and not an actual capability of the dac, unfortunately, the signal is being compromised and destroyed at this point, signal is not as pure as every audiophile would like it to be, please open your eyes, measurements don't lie, we all been foole and a $99 dac can do it better

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Now I know that the 'a' in asr is driving this.

This 'conclusion' is patterned after what 'a' wrote when he tried this tactic before.
The syntax, spelling, phraseology not to mention the speculation touted as factual in nature of this, is a dead give away.
You know about that right, that he has tried to lure others to his lair, and most of us here remember his futile efforts.

I figure his collection of 'hard core' objectivists is dwindling and he needs to augment the numbers in his flock to satisfy his ongoing need to maintain his 'confirmation bias'.
This is a natural consequence of attrition, especially when those who finally experience that reality is more complex and delightful than what mere numbers can convey, and subsequently the 'light goes ON'.
And it happens to, dare I say it, most of us, as we gain experience and learn how to, and what to, listen for.

Which is also a missing aspect to asr's method and madness, that being, he doesn't critically listen to the gear, and I would suspect he eschews such, because he hasn't acquired the listening skills.

After all that IS what we do, we like to listen to music.

JJ
ps, forgive me as I couldn't help myself when I read his 'oh so amusing analysis', so rich in innuendo and devoid of factual understanding.

 

[scottcw]

The troll has found a plentiful supply of food.

 

[Mike-WI]

I am oblivious.
"Ignore" is your friend on the forums.

 

[mwr2700]

I am oblivious.
"Ignore" is your friend on the forums.

Thank you for the reminder. ASR trolls appear so infrequent I had forgotten it existed.

 

[scottcw]

Thanks for the reminder. The ASR troll is banned from my screen.

 

[471724]

I know - don't feed the trolls. I can't resist a little of that, unfortunately.

Closed-minded willfully ignorant strictly by-the-book meter-reader engineer types believe that most of the differences obvious to audiophiles between cables, amplifiers, DACs, use of “tweak” accessories, etc. are hype and illusion. I learned otherwise a long time ago. I'm an audiophile and also an electronics engineer and programmer who respects and uses science within its sphere of applicability. Some people never get beyond worship of scientific measurements, supposedly the scientific method, which assumes that for anything to be real it has to be demonstrable in a lab experiment, and then replicated. So much the worse for these people - they're missing out on a whole world of perception and experience - of musical, intellectual and spiritual enjoyment.

These fanatical objectivists seemingly never learn, don't want to learn, a lot of things in audio. Presumably because of ego, fear and a lot of other psychological mechanisms.

What they simply won't recognize is that the ultimate subtlety and resolving power of human hearing perception is vastly beyond present (and any projected) instrumentation capability and acoustical/neurological theory. All of the present and forseeable practical recording and reproduction technologies produce easily perceptible distortion, both in the amplitude (like harmonic and IM distortion) and the time domain. The hearing mechanism is especially sensitive to the time and frequency smearing types of distortion. The common effect of all these is a clearly perceived blurring, smearing, flattening and veiling of the sonic "picture", along with various tonal imbalances such as overbrightness and bass boominess or looseness.

Of course the ignorant obnoxious trolls will blow off these truths, but they need to be said. Just coming up - my use of the ignore feature of this forum.