Schiit Happened: The Story of the World's Most Improbable Start-Up
Jul 2, 2023 at 2:07 PM Post #120,736 of 153,916
8 or more speakers in the living room hahaha. That is a WAF of minus 10 million.
Most music lovers have the greatest trouble convincing their spouses that any speaker or any audio system can reside in the living room at all. Not even talking about good layout or optimal positioning. Only a very small percentage are allowed. Ceiling speakers, back wall speakers, subs hahahaha. Keep dreaming.
Like I've said many times, people who want to be in this hobby yet who have to worry about WAF either need to learn how to talk to their partner about what's important to them, or they are living with the wrong person. My wife and I share our passion for good audio, and 8 loudspeakers in the main listening room is not only not a problem she'll help me set them up properly. :)
 
Jul 2, 2023 at 2:17 PM Post #120,737 of 153,916
8 or more speakers in the living room hahaha. That is a WAF of minus 10 million.
Most music lovers have the greatest trouble convincing their spouses that any speaker or any audio system can reside in the living room at all. Not even talking about good layout or optimal positioning. Only a very small percentage are allowed. Ceiling speakers, back wall speakers, subs hahahaha. Keep dreaming.

The first floor belongs to my wife. The upstairs is all mine...!!! 🤪 :grinning: :laughing:
 
Jul 2, 2023 at 2:21 PM Post #120,738 of 153,916
8 or more speakers in the living room hahaha. That is a WAF of minus 10 million.
Most music lovers have the greatest trouble convincing their spouses that any speaker or any audio system can reside in the living room at all. Not even talking about good layout or optimal positioning. Only a very small percentage are allowed. Ceiling speakers, back wall speakers, subs hahahaha. Keep dreaming.
This is why a specifically defined audio room is a necessity. Just audio stuff. Only audio stuff, except for a couch and a table or two. Keep the knick-knack dust collectors, "pretties," and pictures of your mama off my record racks and tables. That useless junk can (and does) consume every horizontal surface in the living room, but the audio room is off limits. Requires daily monitoring and enforcement, as this junk seems to be self-mobile and is always on patrol looking for an uncluttered surface to occupy. :slight_smile:
 
Jul 2, 2023 at 2:38 PM Post #120,739 of 153,916
I have an audio room that is all mine and the wife is A-OK with that. Despite that, I am considering placing a cypher-lock on my audio room door for a few reasons: 1) Grand-kids are prone to poking dome tweeters, 2) It would keep the audio-curious visitor(s) out of the room unless I am there to act as host, and 3) It'll keep my gear out of harm's way by keeping me out of the room if I am in a margarita-induced state of euphoria. If I'm too 'tipsy' to operate the lock, then I have no business operating the gear. :wink:
 
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Jul 2, 2023 at 2:46 PM Post #120,740 of 153,916
Not that justification was needed for a device like Syn, but if you need any check this out.



*Full disclosure - I recently dropped a very good Pre/Pro out of my system and installed a Syn

OMG, I took the time to watch this video, and it's aaaaaahhhhhmmmmmmaaaaayyyyyyzzzzing.

You guys thought I was hard on the ergonomics/compatibility/usability aspects of modern surround? Ha! Watch the video. He tries it as a consumer, setting up his living room for it and trying it on headphones.

Aaaaannnnddddd...other than having to play a different game he doesn't play, other than having to watch a different show he doesn't watch, other than it not being possible to set up his living room inexpensively in any way, other than it compromising all stereo content, other than it not working with headphones, other than it being a nervosa fest part excellence, yeah its fine.

Watch the video.

Then you'll know why I did Syn.
 
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Jul 2, 2023 at 3:31 PM Post #120,741 of 153,916
OMG, I took the time to watch this video, and it's aaaaaahhhhhmmmmmmaaaaayyyyyyzzzzing.

You guys thought I was hard on the ergonomics/compatibility/usability aspects of modern surround? Ha! Watch the video. He tries it as a consumer, setting up his living room for it and trying it on headphones.

Aaaaannnnddddd...other than having to play a different game he doesn't play, other than having to watch a different show he doesn't watch, other than it not being possible to set up his living room inexpensively in any way, other than it compromising all stereo content, other than it not working with headphones, other than it being a nervosa fest part excellence, yeah its fine.

Watch the video.

Then you'll know why I did Syn.
Wow, that is such a good take on Atmos and the whole sorry state of affairs on proprietary sound/music technology. Thanks so much for sharing AND releasing Syn, a non-proprietary surround sound option, which is the best possible approach to getting the truth out. You were right about MQA, and I'm betting you're also right about Atmos. If it's proprietary, it'll be licensed; if it's licensed, it'll be a subscription; and if it's a subscription, the business model is to continuously increase charges and continuously offer less and less until you're paying everything and getting nothing. Well done!
 
Jul 2, 2023 at 3:44 PM Post #120,742 of 153,916
Wow, that is such a good take on Atmos and the whole sorry state of affairs on proprietary sound/music technology. Thanks so much for sharing AND releasing Syn, a non-proprietary surround sound option, which is the best possible approach to getting the truth out. You were right about MQA, and I'm betting you're also right about Atmos. If it's proprietary, it'll be licensed; if it's licensed, it'll be a subscription; and if it's a subscription, the business model is to continuously increase charges and continuously offer less and less until you're paying everything and getting nothing. Well done!
Yeah, I think the best part of the video was the headphones where you'd have to pay more to keep using Atoms after, what, 10 hours? Oh yeah **** that. I ain't paying a monthly vig for heated seats, and I ain't paying for headphone decoder subscriptions either.

I hope we are witnessing the end of marketed monopolies.

MQA fell because it wasn't providing anything of value, and was just another cash grab--from musicians, from recording studios, from customers, from manufacturers--via licensing fees. They figured it would work the way every marketed monopoly had worked in the past--get the customers worked up for it, and that would drive everyone to adopt it. That worked perfectly for CD and DVD. But those were physical formats and were clearly better than what they replaced (and yeah I know digital arghishness and compression artifacts, but sorry guys, I went through the LP/cassette transition and the laserdisc/DVD transition, and, for the most part, the differences were clear and significant in both cases.)

Modern surround formats have been a marketed monopoly for a long time. And it worked, pretty much, when you went from stereo to Dolby Pro-Logic and from Pro-Logic to Dolby Digital. But the pressure to always find something new meant lots of variants, lots of confusion, and sometimes not an obvious jump in quality. Trying to shoehorn Atoms into phones and soundbars isn't helping to differentiate it, either. And how far away from Atoms Ultra and Ultra Giga Super Supreme to keep the purchasing treadmill going?

I'd much rather steer clear of the marketed monopolies, and concentrate on stuff that works with the maximum amount of content out there. But that's me. As I've said many, many times before, I'm probably insane.
 
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Jul 2, 2023 at 3:53 PM Post #120,743 of 153,916
@Jason Stoddard Maybe consider sending Benn a Syn and ask him to review it. I think he'd do a great job with it.

Edit 1 - I realize he's not an equipment reviewer
Edit 2 - I've watched 4-5 of his vids now and I really like his content.
 
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Jul 2, 2023 at 4:11 PM Post #120,744 of 153,916
And how far away from Atoms Ultra and Ultra Giga Super Supreme to keep the purchasing treadmill going?
Atmos is just the tip of the ice berg and just a tiny part of the current insane audio world.
How about all those new ((not)golden) 100K cables, 20K (Rpi in a shiny CNC milled box) streamers and super giga fantastic speaker model # Alpha 12.438,55F with extra super special cone material starting at 30K. Every week dozens of "new" models to keep purchasing treadmill going.
The audio world is one big marketing machine trying to sell you the latest "upgrade". Maximizing profit to an insane greedy level without any hesitation.
Glad that Schiit is around so I can enjoy great quality and good sound without all the blahblablah.
 
Jul 2, 2023 at 4:11 PM Post #120,745 of 153,916
Yeah, I think the best part of the video was the headphones where you'd have to pay more to keep using Atoms after, what, 10 hours? Oh yeah **** that. I ain't paying a monthly vig for heated seats, and I ain't paying for headphone decoder subscriptions either.

I hope we are witnessing the end of marketed monopolies.

MQA fell because it wasn't providing anything of value, and was just another cash grab--from musicians, from recording studios, from customers, from manufacturers--via licensing fees. They figured it would work the way every marketed monopoly had worked in the past--get the customers worked up for it, and that would drive everyone to adopt it. That worked perfectly for CD and DVD. But those were physical formats and were clearly better than what they replaced (and yeah I know digital arghishness and compression artifacts, but sorry guys, I went through the LP/cassette transition and the laserdisc/DVD transition, and, for the most part, the differences were clear and significant in both cases.)

Modern surround formats have been a marketed monopoly for a long time. And it worked, pretty much, when you went from stereo to Dolby Pro-Logic and from Pro-Logic to Dolby Digital. But the pressure to always find something new meant lots of variants, lots of confusion, and sometimes not an obvious jump in quality. Trying to shoehorn Atoms into phones and soundbars isn't helping to differentiate it, either. And how far away from Atoms Ultra and Ultra Giga Super Supreme to keep the purchasing treadmill going?
Oh man... I was ready to spring for Ultra Giga Standard Supreme... because... standards... but now you have me wondering. 🤣
I'd much rather steer clear of the marketed monopolies, and concentrate on stuff that works with the maximum amount of content out there. But that's me. As I've said many, many times before, I'm probably insane.
Your insane is probably the best form of sanity. Thanks for all your insights and schiit.
 
Jul 2, 2023 at 4:13 PM Post #120,746 of 153,916
Well, now I think I'm gonna have to wait for the Schiit Ultra Giga Supreme Syn. :rolling_eyes:
 
Jul 2, 2023 at 5:23 PM Post #120,749 of 153,916
But when everybody and their grandma already has an audio setup of some sort that makes them happy enough, and if those cash cow patents you were able to rely on for decades keep expiring on you, you've got little choice but to invent a new problem and market it to people until they begin to jones for the solution you have to offer. How else would you keep growing an already saturated market and pacify your board and shareholders?

I couldn't do those execs' jobs for any money in the world. I can't stand up there on some stage and present the product of multiple years and millions of Dollars of r'n'd as "the next big thing" if it doesn't solve an actual problem. If I ran Apple, the next iPhone presentation would conclude with "…and this is the all-new iPhone 15: It's fast, it's nifty, and it's shiny. But unless you're still sporting an iPhone 8, you shouldn't bother with actually getting one. Thanks to all the digital post processing techniques that we had to come up with to give you a reason to upgrade, the photos it takes are actually worse than what you get from your iPhone 12. All that spacial sound stuff doesn't really work all that well to begin with, and everything else in it that's 'new and improved' is really just a slight spec bump anyway. What you've got in your pocket right now is already more than good enough for what you do with it, so I'd say that you should rather take that money and invest it into a memorable weekend with your loved ones instead."

Something tells me their board and shareholders probably wouldn't keep me around for very long.

And I'm not even kidding in my defense of how these things tend to work, as cynical and ironic the above may sound. It's simply just the way the system that we've picked for ourselves happens to work best. Worse, you can't even blame this on some real or imagined greed of some Silicon Valley, Wall Street, or DC "elite" — because whether we want to accept or even just realize this or not, we all depend and rely on this kind of constant, artificially created growth for our very own standard of living. Without it, the dividends that make your 401(k)s work wouldn't exist. There would be no gain in revenue that could pay for your raise. There wouldn't be the kind of competitive pressure that leads to a world-class system of colleges, entertainment industry, or service industry.

In other words:
When there's nothing left to burn, you have to set yourself on fire. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Do I like this? No, of course not. And for the most part, I choose to not really partake in this unending rat race up this constantly inclining slope of "prescribed improvement." But at the same time, I have to sincerely hope that I remain part of a vanishingly small minority with how I think and act in this regard, as I am under no illusion that it is anything other than the ever-jonesing masses that enable my lifestyle in the first place. Because when your system relies on constant growth, there really are just two general directions you can take: Either you keep inventing solutions for problems that don't actually exist, or you have to periodically destroy everything and make people start over from scratch.

Personally, I prefer the former. Because short of coming up with an entirely different economic and sociopolitical system, everything else we've already tried turned out to be worse.

Edit:
Plus, frustratingly bad or silly products or wannabe-standards occasionally motivate someone to create a much more sane and actually usable competing product or standard. So there's that, too.
 
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Jul 2, 2023 at 5:47 PM Post #120,750 of 153,916
And how far away from Atoms Ultra and Ultra Giga Super Supreme to keep the purchasing treadmill going?
And, although the visual impact of larger higher resolution monitors is apparent to most people, the same could be said for the flat panel industry. HD to 4K to 8K to what's next, 64k? It'll be better because it has MORE K's!! And of course the new 70-inch screen is FAR superior to your existing 65-incher so go buy a new one NOW! Cell phones fall into a similar marketing manipulation scheme, in my opinion. I heard and ad for something called "10-G" the other day. gimmeabreak
 
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