[jfoxvol]

Right now back to work. I need my Vali 2 mega and it ain't gonna design itself.

 

[Astral Abyss]

  You are reading way to much into things.....................
 
No I dont have a 3 week old Bifrost I contacted Nick through your info email and was looking into a new DAC He STEERED me twords Bifrost Uber at no time did I say hard sales I said STEERED me twords WITH THE KNOWLEDGE OF NEW / BETTER BIFROST COMING OUT VERY SOON, and I would think someone caring more about audio more than profit would say maybe ("hey wait 3 weeks and watch HeadFi") or something like that

 
Bought one used from someone instead and "overpaid"?

 

[jfoxvol]

Yarp

 

[LxJLthr]

 
Some decent reading in this thread on R2R vs Delta Sigma
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/779572/r2r-multibit-vs-delta-sigma

 
Looks like I better educate myself   Thanks for the link.
 

  You won't really know until you listen, but I ordered my upgrade based on a few observations:
 
1) The cost is a pretty small fraction of what I've paid for audio gear in the last few years.
2) Lots of listener reports on the differences between delta-sigma and R2R DACs on this forum are consistent about the improvements in soundstage and upper midrange from R2R
3) Soundstage size is the main limitation I hear in my current setup (Bifrost Uber > Asgard 2 > MrSpeakers Alpha Primes), even compared with my living room speaker setup (Bel Canto C7R + KEF LS50s; I have no idea what the DAC innards of the Bel Canto are based on, but clarity and soundstage of this compact DAC+amp are remarkable)
4) I listen to lots of live music (mainly jazz, some classical) from front row seats or close, and 3) is my main regret when I hear comparable music on my headphone setup
5) For space reasons, I want to stay with the Bifrost + A2 form factors
6) I listen almost exclusively to lossless (FLAC) from 44.1/16 to 96/24; the relatively few tracks I still have in MP3 or AAC can sound OK for background listening, but there are enough artifacts in the upper midrange on some tracks and lack of soundstage to make me a bit sad when listening to them (example: I'm a Bill Frisell fan, I've listened to him live more times than I can count, I love his records, but there's a harshness in those few that don't have yet lossless that stops me from listening to them). I want a DAC that makes the most out of the lossless music bits I've got (yes, that means that I may go for Gumby or an Yggy when I get the room to put them). Lest you think this is all placebo effect, my wife who pays zero attention to audio gear or compression has walked into the living room and said "this sounds so much better" when I switched to lossless for a familiar track and to better DAC+amps, even though the speakers stay the same.

 
Please do not take this the wrong way, but I am extremely amused that after disclaiming I have mere mortal hearing, a low end gear set up and no format loyalty...the reply I get is from someone who exclusive listens to the highest encoding technologically possible, able to audibly distinguish the minute intricacies and owns $10,000+ of audio equipment with plans to buy even more...At least we are on the same page about live music and Bill Frisell preferences =)
 
I appreciate you sharing your impression and it is excellent you are able to listen/afford music on such a level.  Though not sure I can take anything that relates to my situation...besides that I really should not go down the rabbit hole of chasing life like sound considering the costs it takes to get those very last tens of percentage right =)

 

[Jason Stoddard]

Right now back to work. I need my Vali 2 mega and it ain't gonna design itself.

Yeah, I actually have a bunch of stuff to work on. One final word, then back to engineering for real, because it bears on this discussion.
 
One product I'm working on today has the name of a current product on it, and a higher number after it. It looks very official, screened on the board, board neatly laid out, parts in place. It would be easy to think, "hey, that's the new (name of product)!" It would be just as easy for us to announce that it is coming, with new specs and functionality that are much better than the current product.
 
But in actuality, it doesn't have a huge chance of going into production. Why? Several reasons:
 
1. It's fundamentally different than the product it replaces--I don't know how fans of the current product would react to it.
2. We don't know if it sounds better than the current product until we've had a chance to listen to it—and this thing is a pretty radical new design, so we don't have any signposts to even guess what it sounds like.
3. It has some very large and ugly stability problems, primarily thermal stability, that may or may not be addressable in such a manner to make it a sellable product--at least at the price point we're shooting for.
 
So, this could be a new updated product, a non-product, or incorporated into a brand new kind of product at a higher price point where we can address the downsides of its thermal stability...but we haven't even heard it yet (it's that unstable.) So we have no idea what this is going to be in the future. It may be nothing...and until it's something, I won't say any more about it.

 

[Ali-Pacha]

Gents,
Please keep cool and listen to some schiit.
M2Uber + Vali + HD600 by my side. Sweet.

Ali

 

[joespride]

   
Bought one used from someone instead and "overpaid"?

On the contrary I dont feel like I overpaid at all in fact am very happy with the deal (this will be my second bifrost uber, I got off track on the upgrade bug and am in correction mode currently which was the reason for contacting Schiit 3 weeks ago)
 
I am of course quoting from hearing memory which some contend does not exist, but I can recall evenings of extreme pleasure listening to valhalla and bifrost it is a SQ I wish to re-visit

 

[jfoxvol]

Awesome. Hopefully redacted number redacted works out.

 

[cskippy]

I'll take my Ragnarok 2 in black please!  

  J/k /s etc.

 

[Deftone]

  You are reading way to much into things.....................
 
No I dont have a 3 week old Bifrost I contacted Nick through your info email and was looking into a new DAC He STEERED me twords Bifrost Uber at no time did I say hard sales I said STEERED me twords WITH THE KNOWLEDGE OF NEW / BETTER BIFROST COMING OUT VERY SOON, and I would think someone caring more about audio more than profit would say maybe ("hey wait 3 weeks and watch HeadFi") or something like that

Dude, have some respect.

 

[joespride]

  Dude, have some respect.

Respect ?? what am I missing ?? A difference of opinion on a procedure = lack of respect........................Dude Since when

 

[earnmyturns]

Please do not take this the wrong way, but I am extremely amused that after disclaiming I have mere mortal hearing, a low end gear set up and no format loyalty...the reply I get is from someone who exclusive listens to the highest encoding technologically possible, able to audibly distinguish the minute intricacies and owns $10,000+ of audio equipment with plans to buy even more...

Not taking it badly at all, very valid criticism. In my defense, my total audio gear investment over the last several years is well below $10K, and I certainly don't have great hearing (age and all that). But I do notice differences, maybe in part because I listen to so much live music (off to an SFJAZZ show again this evening).

At least we are on the same page about live music and Bill Frisell preferences =)

A bad pun, but he has "divine" at his recent show at Grace Cathedral in SF.

I appreciate you sharing your impression and it is excellent you are able to listen/afford music on such a level.  Though not sure I can take anything that relates to my situation...besides that I really should not go down the rabbit hole of chasing life like sound considering the costs it takes to get those very last tens of percentage right =)  

I started down the Head-fi rabbit hole with Uberfrost Uber + Asgard 2 + Shure SRH1540 so that I could listen while working at home without bothering my wife. But as I listened more, I started noticing opportunities for improvement. I know, pretty expensive. But then my other hobby, backcountry skiing in remote places, is way more demanding...

 

[StanD]

 
Your post has some home truths and misconceptions. Let me see if I can address them. Then I have to get back to engineering:
 
"no matter what you do someone is going to get ticked off"
 
100% true. The only way not to irritate someone is to do nothing and say nothing.
 
"continual upsell by the "step up" mantra over the previous product"
 
​Nope. We don't upsell. Period. Never have, never will. We have nobody in sales and nobody with a sales title.
 
"with no end in sight without ticking off the traditional Schiit customer, which is probably the backbone of your business."
 
Actually, new customers have been the primary growth driver since inception.
 
"After all you have a business to grow."
 
​No, I don't. I don't care if we grow at all. I haven't cared since 2013, actually. We are very comfortable where we are at...but we happen to continue to grow. When the growth stops, it will be organic, and no effort will be made to artificially enhance sales. Understood if you don't believe me, but we are *very* different than other companies. 

By "Upsell by step up, I didn't mean a malevolent plan to do so, however, upsell can be the what the sales process becomes due to circumstances. "No end in sight" to continuous product improvements that are always a step up. At one point nobody can tell a difference unless we ourselves get upgraded. After all we are just Carbon Units.
The $399 Bifrost was a nice gesture and a good business decision considering that the Bifrost has to fit into the price structure an existing and growing product line, allowing for the differentiation of products and yet not canibalizing the sales of other products. A nice balancing act.
It's OK for your business to grow, after all this is capitalism and I'm sure that we all wish for Schiit to be very successful.

 

[bflat]

In for one. Got hooked on Gumby and need an upgrade for my office and smaller footprint. Will be replacing my Teac.

 

[vinjeman]

#33 in Que sound unheard ( as in sight unseen ) just living on faith.  A fan since I bought my
used Bifrost 2 years ago.  Excellent products, customer service.  This company is exploding!
 
thanks Jason,
 
jhv